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View Full Version : State meets - Best or Reps?



tomtopo
February 24th, 2008, 03:35 PM
I coached in both Texas and Mich. In Texas the best swimmers are not represented in the State meet but rather a few representatives are sent from each district. Super fast districts could only send their allotment. In Michigan if you hit the qualifying time during the season, you were in automatically. I think qualifying times are the way to go. I wonder why every state couldn't do qualifying times and add token swimmers from slower districts to maintain the status quo? What other states are like Texas (may only send a district allotment)? I can't believe Texas hasn't changed to qualifying standards! What do you think?

cowsvils
February 24th, 2008, 05:11 PM
PA actually does a mix of the two, we give out half of the bids to the winners of our districts (I assume that is the equivalent of Texas regions) in relation to how good that district is on the whole (i.e in a very fast district the top 4 will get in automatically, a slow district may only get one automatically) and then the next 16 are decided by the top 16 times.

Kurt Dickson
February 24th, 2008, 06:54 PM
I coached in both Texas and Mich. In Texas the best swimmers are not represented in the State meet but rather a few representatives are sent from each district. Super fast districts could only send their allotment. In Michigan if you hit the qualifying time during the season, you were in automatically. I think qualifying times are the way to go. I wonder why every state couldn't do qualifying times and add token swimmers from slower districts to maintain the status quo? What other states are like Texas (may only send a district allotment)? I can't believe Texas hasn't changed to qualifying standards! What do you think?

Arizona has qualifying standards but then divides schools based on population (i.e. 3-A, 4-A, 5-A). The best swimmers are usually 4-A and 5-A, both swimming at ASU but in different pools, resulting in watered down crap. Often times there is a great swimmer in 4-A and one in 5-A who don't even get to race each other. I'm not sure why token slow swimming is even needed at the state level--there are plenty of dual meets and regionals to nab some of that coveted self-esteem. There should be one state meet and the best 16 in each event should be there.

pwolf66
February 24th, 2008, 07:07 PM
The DC area handles this by having Metro Champs 1-2 weeks after the various HS divisional meets. This meet has straight qual time reqs so if make the qual you swim.

Paul

slknight
February 24th, 2008, 09:25 PM
The DC area handles this by having Metro Champs 1-2 weeks after the various HS divisional meets. This meet has straight qual time reqs so if make the qual you swim.


Have they changed this to include the Virginia public schools? When I swam in it (admittedly 20+ years ago), it only included the Maryland/DC public and private schools and the VA private schools only. It was always a very fast meet. I went a 56 in the 100 fly one year and got second.

Blackbeard's Peg
February 25th, 2008, 12:15 AM
Have they changed this to include the Virginia public schools? When I swam in it (admittedly 20+ years ago), it only included the Maryland/DC public and private schools and the VA private schools only. It was always a very fast meet. I went a 56 in the 100 fly one year and got second.

It does not appear that VA is in here. I believe this meet was put together in part because the MD kids had no state meet (I believe this year's is the 2nd or 3rd year it's happened) and MoCo Public Schools wanted a chance to compete against all the private school kids.
Great meet this year - a LOT of records were broken, and best part is that UMD is getting one of the recordbreakers!
Results (http://www.pvswim.org/0708hs/2008Metros.htm)
Too Bad Gonzaga didn't win.

tomtopo
February 25th, 2008, 07:35 AM
I agree with Kurt. I don't think token swimming accomplishes anything positive although I'm sure someone can rationalize the benefits (I'd like to read them). Coach T.

aquaFeisty
February 25th, 2008, 08:13 AM
Wow! I used to think that Illinois had a messed up system, but then I read about these others...

My senior year (I swam senior year and Grade 9), I lived in Delaware. In DE, if you made the State cut at any time during the HS season, you were in the State meet. However, remember, we're talking Delaware. The cuts were pretty slow and the State meet was still a very manageable size...

My husband has coached HS swimming in Illinois for several years now. In Illinois, there are Sectional meets that occur a week before States. To make State, you have to:
A. swim the State cut at the Sectional meet - there is no limit to how many kids can go from each Sectional in a particular event
B. even if you don't make the State cut, if you win your event at Sectional you can make State

So, every now and then you have a really slow sectional where the winner doesn't make the cut and still gets to go to State. In our sectional, though, you often get 6 kids who all make the cut and all go to State.

tomtopo
February 25th, 2008, 08:53 AM
Aqua,
In Texas, you could be the fastest swimmer in the world and if you were sick or missed a turn, you're out. I like the idea that once you've qualified you can swim in the prelims.

pwolf66
February 25th, 2008, 09:31 AM
It does not appear that VA is in here. I believe this meet was put together in part because the MD kids had no state meet (I believe this year's is the 2nd or 3rd year it's happened) and MoCo Public Schools wanted a chance to compete against all the private school kids.
Great meet this year - a LOT of records were broken, and best part is that UMD is getting one of the recordbreakers!
Results (http://www.pvswim.org/0708hs/2008Metros.htm)
Too Bad Gonzaga didn't win.
Stewart's going to UMD? Or is Mr 1:47 200 IM going?

Paul

slknight
February 25th, 2008, 09:39 AM
It does not appear that VA is in here. I believe this meet was put together in part because the MD kids had no state meet (I believe this year's is the 2nd or 3rd year it's happened) and MoCo Public Schools wanted a chance to compete against all the private school kids.
Great meet this year - a LOT of records were broken, and best part is that UMD is getting one of the recordbreakers!
Results (http://www.pvswim.org/0708hs/2008Metros.htm)
Too Bad Gonzaga didn't win.

The girls' times weren't any faster than they were back in 1987. :dunno:

Blackbeard's Peg
February 25th, 2008, 10:07 AM
Stewart's going to UMD? Or is Mr 1:47 200 IM going?

Paul

Stweart is going to UMD. Strong swimmer and good catch for the Terps. Should do well.

Eric Friedland's (IM guy) time did catch my eye... Completely crushed Barrowman's 22 year-old record (was 1:51.80, now 1:47.59). He's committed to Texas, who was not on his map last year. BTW, his 200 IM last year was 1:51.94.

pwolf66
February 25th, 2008, 10:49 AM
Stweart is going to UMD. Strong swimmer and good catch for the Terps. Should do well.

Eric Friedland's (IM guy) time did catch my eye... Completely crushed Barrowman's 22 year-old record (was 1:51.80, now 1:47.59). He's committed to Texas, who was not on his map last year. BTW, his 200 IM last year was 1:51.94.
That IM was a ridiculous swim. When the results went up on the board, the crowd went crazy. Stewart's Free was soooooo pretty to watch. He'll do very well at UMD.

born2fly
February 25th, 2008, 01:24 PM
Ohio High School States seems to be the norm I think. I think there are 4 or 5 districts. They start with sectionals then think top 4 from sectionals move on to districts with some at large bids also. Then at districts you need to need top 3 in district to move on to States,then there are the at large bids total of 24 swimmers in all.

Seems to be getting quicker and quicker, in the mens 100fly it took a 52.2 to be seeded 24th.

Attatched are the Ohio State results. Check out the girl that won 100 fly, 53.8 and shes just a Junior, yikes!

http://www.cdab.org/sports/index.htm

Greg

daniel2768
February 29th, 2008, 10:18 PM
I coached in both Texas and Mich. In Texas the best swimmers are not represented in the State meet but rather a few representatives are sent from each district. Super fast districts could only send their allotment. In Michigan if you hit the qualifying time during the season, you were in automatically. I think qualifying times are the way to go. I wonder why every state couldn't do qualifying times and add token swimmers from slower districts to maintain the status quo? What other states are like Texas (may only send a district allotment)? I can't believe Texas hasn't changed to qualifying standards! What do you think?

I'm in Michigan and i love the qual time idea because My county (Macomb) is fast, to get first in your event you need a D-1 state cut minimum pretty much. like our IM winner went a 2 flat, we had 3 back strokers go 55's, 100 breast winners go 1:03... and other crazy stuff.