PDA

View Full Version : How far should hand move during last phase of stroke?



spindogg
June 19th, 2008, 10:42 AM
Hi everyone-

I am new here and have been wondering something and there seems to be a lot of differing opinion on this. I am asking about the last phase of the stroke (freestyle) after you have had a strong catch and are pulling through---how far should you pull through? Should your hand stop at the waist or should it push through until you lose grip on the water (past the waist)?

I have heard/read both opinions but wondered if there is a general consensus on this now. Thanks for your help.

pwolf66
June 19th, 2008, 10:55 AM
Well that is an interesting question and the answer is.........

It depends. For sprinting you want to have as long a stroke as possible in order to maximize your power and engage as many muscle groups as possible.

For distance events, you want to swim as efficiently as possible and taking a longer stroke, while more powerful, will cause fatigue toxins to build up in the triceps and rear delts faster. So if you watch you will see that most distance swimmers shorten the stroke slightly so instead of pulling all the way past thier hip lines, they stop just short of there.

From a practice perspective, I vary it based upon the current distance (but not much as I am a pure sprinter) being swum and the pace. The faster I want to go, the longer my pull is.

I hope this helps.

Paul

spindogg
June 19th, 2008, 11:15 AM
Thanks Paul, that makes sense. My primary distance is half iron and full ironman swims.

JMiller
June 19th, 2008, 12:41 PM
Watch these under-water video's of some of the Greatest.

Thorpe, Popov, Sullivan
http://forums.usms.org/showpost.php?p=125195&postcount=68



I have heard/read both opinions but wondered if there is a general consensus on this now. Thanks for your help.

fanstone
June 19th, 2008, 07:42 PM
hummmm, interesting...I figured that on a sprint I would want faster turnover, because I thought the first phase till the waist was where most power was coming from, and so I would not push all the way towards the thighs. Got to work this one out. billy fanstone

Midas
June 19th, 2008, 08:44 PM
Ian Thorpe
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8egC7PbOME (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8egC7PbOME)


I was surprised to see that Thorpe's left arm has weaker technique when he breathes. I have the hardest time with this myself.

rtodd
June 19th, 2008, 08:48 PM
This was posted by tomtopo. It reinforces what pwolff says.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KrmO...eature=related

rtodd
June 19th, 2008, 08:51 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KrmOVY_png&feature=related

JMiller
June 19th, 2008, 09:18 PM
I was surprised to see that Thorpe's left arm has weaker technique when he breathes. I have the hardest time with this myself.

I think that has more to do with the camera angle... maybe not though...

JMiller
June 19th, 2008, 09:24 PM
Ya, that slow-mode of Sullivan is pretty incredible... He has lightning fast turn-over, but look at where his hand position finishes at the end of the stroke. He can keep the turn-over high because of the EVF-EDF, notice how close his forearm stays to his body through the whole stroke.
http://forums.usms.org/showpost.php?...5&postcount=68 (http://forums.usms.org/showpost.php?p=125195&postcount=68)



hummmm, interesting...I figured that on a sprint I would want faster turnover, because I thought the first phase till the waist was where most power was coming from, and so I would not push all the way towards the thighs. Got to work this one out. billy fanstone

pwolf66
June 19th, 2008, 09:34 PM
hummmm, interesting...I figured that on a sprint I would want faster turnover, because I thought the first phase till the waist was where most power was coming from, and so I would not push all the way towards the thighs. Got to work this one out. billy fanstone

Actually you are correct. That is where MOST of the power comes from. But why not get as much power from your stroke as possible? You do want a faster turnover BUT NOT at the expense of generating maximum power.

It boils down to this, every swimmer has a different 'sweet spot' by that I mean the perfect combination of stroke length and stroke rate. And this perfect storm varies by individual.

And yes, sprinters tend to have a higher stroke rate than distance folks and _on average_ sprinters strokes are a touch longer (YMMV) because they can afford to engage more muscle groups to maximize power (shorter race duration) at the expense of fatigue BUT most distance swimmers (again YMMV) will have a slightly shorter stroke to ensure that muscle groups are not prematurely (or excessively) fatigued during the swim.

Please note that I did not use absolutes, I used 'most' and 'tend to' and 'on average' as in all things, YMMV.

Paul

ande
June 20th, 2008, 12:16 AM
depends how long your arms and torso are

if possible you should push your hands past your waist
until you can't push them anymore water
which is where they will naturally come out of the water for your recovery

one mistake novices make is
they stop pressing and lift their hands out of the water too soon
causing them to miss out on an important part of their stroke cycle

you'll notice swimmers accelerate their hands, the last part of the press is very fast


Hi everyone-

I am new here and have been wondering something and there seems to be a lot of differing opinion on this. I am asking about the last phase of the stroke (freestyle) after you have had a strong catch and are pulling through---how far should you pull through? Should your hand stop at the waist or should it push through until you lose grip on the water (past the waist)?

I have heard/read both opinions but wondered if there is a general consensus on this now. Thanks for your help.