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islanddancer
September 19th, 2008, 10:04 PM
Hi,
I have a technical question concerning bilateral breathing. I have been thinking and feeling about it for a couple of weeks.

Do you guys make your upper arm and head touch when you do the bilateral breathing in freestyle?
I watched a couple of videos on youtube and found normally the athletes do not do that. But I found it more comfortable when I do that and I think it forces you to extend your arms further.

Thanks for any explanations.

Warren
September 19th, 2008, 10:36 PM
no

islanddancer
September 19th, 2008, 10:44 PM
no

Thanks, for sprints and short distances I can not do it.

I think this could be a good drill for weaker side breathing. Could you please give me some suggestions on drills to enhance the weaker side breathing?

Thanks!

knelson
September 20th, 2008, 01:55 PM
I have a feeling if your head touched your upper arm there'd be a good chance you'd be crossing over on that side.

islanddancer
September 20th, 2008, 02:22 PM
I have a feeling if your head touched your upper arm there'd be a good chance you'd be crossing over on that side.

You mean my arm's entry point is crossing the middle line?

chaos
September 20th, 2008, 02:29 PM
though i do not make contact between my head and upper arm, i always see evidence of "beard rash" on several swimmers shoulder's at open water events.

ourswimmer
September 20th, 2008, 02:44 PM
I can't think of any point in an efficient freestyle stroke cycle where your head and upper arm would touch. To bring them together you would either have to move your head toward your arm while your arm recovers (bad) or make your hand enter the water way on the other side of your midline (what Kirk called "crossing over," and also bad). If your hand enters the water on the opposite side of your midline, you may feel as if you are extending your arm farther, but you are not extending it in the direction it needs to go.

In choppy OW I can imagine how a beard could touch the shoulder as David describes, but even there unless those guys are Billy Gibbons they probably also have less-then-efficient strokes to be getting "beard rash."

Also, I do not understand why your question is about bilateral breathing. The breathing motion is the same whether you do it always on the same side, or alternate sides.

If you want to improve your "weaker side" breathing, the only drill I know is just to do it. It feels really awkward at first, like if you try to use a computer mouse or a spoon with your "wrong" hand. But the more you do it the easier and more natural it feels. You may never feel completely even on both sides (I still have a stronger side, and I have been using bilateral breathing for almost 30 years), but you will get to where you don't have to think about it to do it.

jim clemmons
September 20th, 2008, 02:54 PM
If you're hitting the cheek with the upper/inside top of the shoulder, you're probably getting your head back in the water a little bit late. For whatever reason, you're either not completing the inhalation phase quickly enuf, or you're just plain breathing late.

geochuck
September 20th, 2008, 03:09 PM
My upper arm brushes my ear every time I take a stroke. You don't move your head over, you keep the body streamlined. Don't take everything you hear from us as a must do. I like to just brush the ear others can say it is wrong. Take their advice if they have ever gone under 57 seconds for 100m lc but if they have not don't listen to them.

I am swimming slowly here but you will notice my shoulder touches the ear on every stroke and I do not cross over. http://oregonmasters.ning.com/video/video/show?id=545489%3AVideo%3A6784

If it hits your cheek you must be turning your head a little more then neccessary and looking back (I call this arm pit breathing) rather then looking directly at the side of the pool.

islanddancer
September 20th, 2008, 03:49 PM
My upper arm brushes my ear every time I take a stroke. You don't move your head over, you keep the body streamlined. Don't take everything you hear from us as a must do. I like to just brush the ear others can say it is wrong. Take their advice if they have ever gone under 57 seconds for 100m lc but if they have not don't listen to them.

I am swimming slowly here but you will notice my shoulder touches the ear on every stroke and I do not cross over. http://oregonmasters.ning.com/video/video/show?id=545489%3AVideo%3A6784

If it hits your cheek you must be turning your head a little more then neccessary and looking back (I call this arm pit breathing) rather then looking directly at the side of the pool.
I think your stroke is right, Lindsay Benko said in a tutorial video
that shoulder should be close to the head as much as possible.

islanddancer
September 20th, 2008, 03:50 PM
If you're hitting the cheek with the upper/inside top of the shoulder, you're probably getting your head back in the water a little bit late. For whatever reason, you're either not completing the inhalation phase quickly enuf, or you're just plain breathing late.

This really reminds me of something, although I exhale underwater, I
simply have to burst out the air when I turn my head for breathing or
else there will be water in my mouth.

Do you take a very quick breath and turn my head back or I can breathe
while I slide sideways?
Thanks.

jim clemmons
September 20th, 2008, 05:37 PM
This really reminds me of something, although I exhale underwater, I
simply have to burst out the air when I turn my head for breathing or
else there will be water in my mouth.

Do you take a very quick breath and turn my head back or I can breathe
while I slide sideways?
Thanks.

It's a relatively quick action but you can continue to inhale as the head is returning to the forward position while it's still in the low area "hole" behind the head and under the arm. You'll get used to the timing (determining the end point so to speak) so you're not breathing in water.

And George is correct too. My arm will occasionally brush my cheek, just not on each and every stoke. That's probably because that's how we get access to that low area "hole" so we're not lifting the head up instead.

islanddancer
September 20th, 2008, 10:36 PM
It's a relatively quick action but you can continue to inhale as the head is returning to the forward position while it's still in the low area "hole" behind the head and under the arm. You'll get used to the timing (determining the end point so to speak) so you're not breathing in water.

And George is correct too. My arm will occasionally brush my cheek, just not on each and every stoke. That's probably because that's how we get access to that low area "hole" so we're not lifting the head up instead.

I think I was doing the unconsciously doing the catchup or 3/4 Catch-up drill. In that case, will the touch be tolerable?