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Leonard Jansen
March 13th, 2009, 05:45 PM
Can someone point to a link that has good description/pix of how to do EVF (early vertical forearm)?

I have recently been changing my "short" distance stroke (for OW races of less than about 75 minutes) to have more EVF and it really seems to be working very well - it blends nicely with the TI portion of my stroke as long as I don't daydream. However, I don't have access to a coach and so I am making it up or just going on impressions at this point. I've seen some of the Olympic swimmers, of course, but they are in a very different category WRT ability than I.

Thanks,
LBJ

splash
March 14th, 2009, 05:51 PM
I would be also interested in a good description of EVF.

I have found this description of effiecient, winning stroke which I assume is closely related to EVF. Now if somebody could translate this into language understood by an average recreational swimmer.

http://www.staps.uhp-nancy.fr/foad_natation/crawl_stroke.htm

"The efficiency of Thorpe's stroke lies in his ability to get into the medial rotated position with elbow flexion while the arm is still fully abducted and the shoulder girdle is elevated (the position an eager child uses when he raises his hand to answer a teacher's question) and before the am begins its forceful adduction movement."

No pictures, however, there are many youtube clips with Thorpe et al:

YouTube - Thorpe vs Van den Hoogenband

The problem, to me, is to understand and incorporate into stroke not only kinematics (movement, trajectory), but also transient dynamics (acceleration, force) and corresponding complex muscle work, body positioning and balance etc.

geochuck
March 14th, 2009, 06:28 PM
This has been explained many times. To make it simple keep the elbow high and get the forearm into the catch position after entry without droping the elbow and exert pressure.

el desmadre
March 14th, 2009, 08:08 PM
Hey man, I feel your confusion, I had to relearn my freestyle just recently to save my poor beaten shoulders. This video, combined with some front-view vids of thorpe and hackett helped me a lot, although its a daily struggle to do it correctly. This vid is, of course an exaggeration (at least for me - my arms dont bend that way), but you get the picture. Good luck. Also, sorry about the lack of embedding, I dont know how to do that. Edit- apparently I do!

YouTube - SwimTherapy - Frontcrawl Catch

M

ViveBene
March 14th, 2009, 09:05 PM
L.J., I think "tomtopo" is the person you want. Here is one of his posts:
Prevention of shoulder problems - U.S. Masters Swimming Discussion Forums

He has his own videos, and also posts videos of others doing EVF at various times on the fora.

:)

Splash,
Ian Thorpe has an unusual dexterity. I've never seen anything like his stroke on anyone else.

tomtopo
March 22nd, 2009, 10:04 AM
What a wonderful video!! Congratulations for showing and describing (very well) what a catch looks like. Swimmers must understand that 12 stabilizing shoulder muscles (strength) and flexibility determine the effectiveness of your catch. The Early Vertical Forearm position will look different from swimmer to swimmer. On one end of the spectrum you have Rebecca Adlington (the best EVF Iíve ever seen) to Alain Bernard (the most leveraged EVF).*** The hand is your paddle and an EVF allows you to use it in the most effective position. Everyone from a world record holder to beginner can improve their EVF and thatís a training fact.

Iím a developmental coach and my job is to help swimmers acquire the most technically propulsive habits they can. Without a question, the EVF is the most difficult and most critical propulsive position they need to attain. The past president of the world largest coaching association says the EVF is a skill that differentiates every level of swimmer. Coach Dan Thompson puts it like this, ďThe catch is what your natural freestylers do naturally that the other 99% of your kids do not. It is a difficult skill to impart. But we must find ways to teach it. Without the ability to engage water early in the stroke, your young swimmers cannot create effective pulling patterns.Ē Eleven coaches at the recent Senior Nationals at Irvine California were asked the question; what would you teach first when teaching the freestyle. Nine of the eleven said the catch (Early Vertical Forearm (EVF). Like every good swimming coach, no one dismisses the importance of streamlining, timing, kicking, and many other skills vital to swimming speed but if EVF acquisition isnít at the top of your list it should be.

Every one of my swimmers does EVF and shoulder strengthening exercises every single day and every swimmer uses EVF training equipment. Itís important to note that weak stabilizing shoulder muscles must be corrected to prevent potential shoulder injuries. Done correctly, even swimmers with one intact shoulder tendon can improve their EVF without injury. If you train smarter and not just harder, youíll get faster, itís not simple but itís the truth. This video is awesome, and should be in every coachís library. There are more great EVF videos and most are free. I suggest that everyone from the World Record Holder to the first year swimmer focus on this key propulsive swimming ingredient. Again ---- Nice Video. The most concise and short video to date!!!

*** Taller swimmers can use their longer arms to keep their hands in ďstillĒ water by moving it deeper as their hand moves backward. Bernard has a later EVF and I believe that he could swim even faster if he his EVF was improved even a little bit. The movement of the hand away and toward the mid-line of the body in another way to move the hand into ďstillĒ water.




Hey man, I feel your confusion, I had to relearn my freestyle just recently to save my poor beaten shoulders. This video, combined with some front-view vids of thorpe and hackett helped me a lot, although its a daily struggle to do it correctly. This vid is, of course an exaggeration (at least for me - my arms dont bend that way), but you get the picture. Good luck. Also, sorry about the lack of embedding, I dont know how to do that. Edit- apparently I do!

YouTube - SwimTherapy - Frontcrawl Catch (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x3ctBUV08_o&feature=PlayList&p=8BD437839E802FC6&index=73)

M

mazzy
March 22nd, 2009, 12:35 PM
is it correct to move the shoulder forward when extending the arm to further set-up EVF ahead to maximize the pull/insweep or is it too stressfull and it's better to leave shoulder in neutral position ?

tomtopo
March 22nd, 2009, 01:58 PM
That's a difficult question to answer because the word "neutral". The ability to set-up your stroke with an EVF is determined by the stability of the shoulder joint. A strong and balanced or symetrically balanced shoulder-cuff can handle an EVF during the extended / streamlined position. For some swimmers; Phelps, Thorpe and Hackett the catch is done very early while, in the same breath, Rebecca Adlington initiates her catch early and when her shoulders are more square or horizontal to the bottom of the pool. Individual strengths and weaknesses will detremine how early you can initiate your catch. A good coach can help you determine the when's, where's and how's to your catch. Good luck. Coach T