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Iowamaster49
March 29th, 2009, 06:40 PM
I'm new to masters this year and have had two meets since January. The first 500 was 5:50 and the second one was 5:51. I can't hold on to my pace after 350. I'm 49 and am working out 5 days a week. Most days are 3000 yards. Once a week I go 4000 yards. Most of my workouts are 250-500 yard swims, with some 100's on 1:30. I can go 6:10 in the middle of practice without killing myself. Why can't I do better in a meet? In meets my first 100 is 1:03 and at 200 at 2:11. Why the fall off? Any meet nutruition ideas? Workout ideas? Pacing ideas?

ViveBene
March 29th, 2009, 07:52 PM
Here is Ande's "Swimming Faster Faster" thread:
Ande's Swimming Tips: Swimming Faster Faster - U.S. Masters Swimming Discussion Forums

Perhaps something there will help.

Here is a thread specifically on racing the 500 free:
http://forums.usms.org/showthread.php?t=13589&highlight=race+500+free

I am very slow myself, but the current thinking on acquiring speed is to focus on short, high-intensity intervals, and make sure the kick is helping you. I would also point you to the blogs, which show how dryland, weights, and other nonaquatic as well as aquatic work can build speed.

mattson
March 29th, 2009, 09:33 PM
You are averaging 1:13s for the last 3 hundreds, which is 10 seconds slower than your first 100. Try pacing it a little more even. Even the 5 second drop-off from your first to second 100 is a bit large. (You can look up swims in your age group at Nationals to see how other people paced their swims.)

Let's say you want to do a 5:45 for your next swim, which is a 1:09 average. You could try 1:06 / 1:09 (2:15) / 1:10 / 1:10 / 1:10. Feel comfortable the first 200, even if it feels too slow, so you have energy to be aggressive on the back half.

Iowamaster49
March 29th, 2009, 10:55 PM
Thank you so much for your responses! This is encouraging. I'll read up on the links. I do plan on going to nationals next month, so I'll experiment with timed 500's on each of the next 4 saturdays. I want to get this pace down. Any workout suggestions for the 500? For reference, my meet times are: 26.7 - 50 free, 57.4 - 100 free and 2:07.2 in the 200 free. These are also all of the events I plan on swimming at nationals. The 500 is the event I'm most interested in doing well with.

Muppet
March 30th, 2009, 12:26 AM
Fifty 500 swimmers will probably give you 50 different ways to swim a 500.
As a mid-distance freestyler myself, in general, my advice for someone swimming a 400/500 is: the pace you set in the first 100 will dictate the rest of the race. If it is too fast, you die at the end; if you start out too slow, you'll finish slow. Unfortunately, there is a fine line for the perfect first 100 that changes every time you dive in.

I think it is important to take advantage of the momentum and speed from your dive and I like that you're aggressive going out, but as has been alluded to already, that is not the best race strategery for us adults to adopt.

What things do you notice falling apart during that last 150-200y of the 500? Work on the small things like keeping turns fast, not breathing in/out of walls on turns, tight streamlines, SDK on your streamlines, breathing patterns, perfect technique, kicking.

FYI, my pacing for a good 500 is
first 100 - set the pace
second, third - build turnover
at the 250, really start putting the legs into it
4th 100 - 98% effort
5th 100 - go for broke!

orca1946
March 30th, 2009, 02:48 PM
I agree with muppet, pace is all important.

ande
March 31st, 2009, 12:39 PM
If you can't hold on to your pace after 350, it's because you haven't trained to the point to make it possible.

You're working out 5 days a week, doing 3000 yards, 4000 Once a week
Most of your workouts are 250 - 500 yard swims,
with some 100's on 1:30.
you can go 6:10 in the middle of practice without killing yourself.

you asked Why can't I do better in a meet?

i suggest you

1) train 5 to 6 times a week, 4,000 to 5,000 per practice,
get a coach,
swim with a team

2) include speed work
ie
fast 50's on 1:00 to 1:30 &
fast 100's on 2:00 - 3:00

3) swim a fast 500 for time once or twice a week
focusing on proper splitting
the right way to split a 500 is:
1st 50 should be easy speed & comfortable, breathe every stroke
2nd through 9th 50's should be very close to each other
10th 50 should be about as fast as your first
work your turns & streamlines, breathe every stroke

4) are you lifting weights?
if not start

5) are you over weight?
if so, lose some pounds

6) Which suit did you wear in your race?
Tech suits can make a HUGE difference.
Did you shave?

7) Did you rest for the meet?

8) How psyched & focused were you before & during the races?
How mentally tough were you in your race?

In meets my first 100 is 1:03 and at 200 at 2:11. Why the fall off?
so you're 2:11 at the 200 & 5:50 at the 500,
meaning you're 3:40 on the last 300, which is 1:13 per 100 pace.
The real issue is, you're attempting to hold a pace you think you can, but you really can't.
EASE UP a bit on the front end & you'll have more on the back end.

do your 100's like this:
1:06 1:09 1:09 1:09 1:07 or
do your 50's like this:
1) 32 2) 34 3) 34 4) 34 5) 34 6) 34 7) 34 8) 34 9) 34 10) 32
when you compare your first 250 with your last 250, they should be pretty close.
At least within 5 seconds, preferably 0 to 2.

Any meet nutruition ideas?
probably won't make much diff, don't get food poisoning

Workout ideas?
train smarter, further, harder, more times a week, under a coach with a group

Pacing ideas?
learn to properly pace your 500, it's all about correct effort

READ SWIM FASTER FASTER

Hope this helps you Swim Faster Faster,

Ande


I'm new to masters this year and have had two meets since January. The first 500 was 5:50 and the second one was 5:51. I can't hold on to my pace after 350. I'm 49 and am working out 5 days a week. Most days are 3000 yards. Once a week I go 4000 yards. Most of my workouts are 250-500 yard swims, with some 100's on 1:30. I can go 6:10 in the middle of practice without killing myself. Why can't I do better in a meet? In meets my first 100 is 1:03 and at 200 at 2:11. Why the fall off? Any meet nutruition ideas? Workout ideas? Pacing ideas?

Iowamaster49
March 31st, 2009, 08:36 PM
These are great suggestions and just what I'm looking for. I did go into the last meet without tapering since I really am aiming for nationals. I'm wearing a jammer. Are the body suits really a big advantage? Do I need the most expensive one to be effective? I can have no problem upping the yardage, but at what point do I ease up for nationals. I'm really stoked about swimming and can't wait for my first national experience! Unfortunately I swim on my own. We don't have a competitive master program in Sioux City and no one I swim with can push me. You guys are now my coach. I want to thank Jeff for recommending a place to swim while I'm in DC. I got in some yardage and felt great. I did a broken 500 for the first time and thought it was a great set. Thanks again everyone!
Scott
712-253-9701 cell

tdrop
March 31st, 2009, 10:50 PM
a full body suit will make a big difference. so will shaving if you don't want to spend the money. In my experience with body suits and shaving you can expect to drop about 3 seconds per 100 in your 500. this is a bit of speculation but it is also based on observation and experience over many years.

i would approach a taper for the 500 by making sure all the muscle soreness is gone going into the meet. You should feel fresh and powerful. Also, realize that during the last two or three weeks you are not going to get into better shape (assuming you've been training for several months).

what you can do is focus on speed and details. focus on your race strategy. learn the pace of your race. do a couple of turns at the end of practice and some starts. Practice the turns you want to race with during your training sessions. I have always found that an increase in detail focus the last couple of weeks produces results in the big meet.

if you are dying at the end of your race you are going out too fast. it is that simple. often we try to complicate it, but in my mind it is that simple. pace your race better. don't go out slow but just back off your first 100 a bit.

if you want to swim a 5:30 in the 500 but never swim at that speed in practice, chances are you won't be able to hit that pace in a meet. i don't mean swimming a set of 500s holding that pace, but rather, swim a set of 100s holding that pace on an interval that allows you to maintain that pace.

the way to get faster is to change something. you know the saying "if nothing changes then nothing changes". i am not a person whose first response is "i have to train harder". I usually go for "I have to change something in my training." sometimes its train more intensely, sometimes its training less or more, sometimes i have to change something technical, sometimes i have to change my mindset. but something has to change if I want to keep getting faster.

I have heard a Eddie Reese (maybe the world's best coach) say that there are only four ways to get faster

1. improve technique
2. get stronger
3. harder workouts
4. if the workouts can't get any harder then swim the same workouts faster

i particularly like number four. often we get into our comfort zone. viewed this way it is easier to just swim more yards in our comfort zone. what is better in my view is to do the same workouts just swim them faster.

so, if you normally hold 1:15/100 in workout start holding 1:13. we can all do this. it comes down to "are you willing to hurt like this"? sometimes the answer is no. and that is alright. I know I don't always want to make swimming a process of agonizing training sessions. but i also realize i have to be satisfied with the results that moderate levels of pain produce.

i hope this helps and i didn't ramble too much. good luck and let us know how it turns out.

ande
April 1st, 2009, 12:02 PM
Hey Scott,

I can have no problem upping the yardage, but at what point do I ease up for nationals
train hard then rest a week for nats

Are the body suits really a big advantage?
YES

Do I need the most expensive one to be effective?
NO

There's many changes in suit rules to come.
Read

Tip 201 Which Suit Suits you? More On Racing Suits


Tip 214 Even More On Racing Suits


FINA Releases Information on FINA Bureau Meeting, Approves Speedsuit Restriction Proposal


U.S. Masters Swimming’s official interpretation of Swimwear rule 102.14


Bottomline is
03/31/09 was the deadline for manufacturers to submit suits for phase 1 testing, soon FINA will issue a list of APPROVED SUITS, I have no clue what will and what won't be approved. I hope Blue Seventy Nero Comps & Speedo PROs will.

effective Jan. 1, 2010 FINA requires a "permeability value" test


The non-permeable material can only be used for a maximum 50% of the total surface of the swimsuit for full-body models. For these models, the maximum surface of non-permeable material to be used on the upper and lower part of the swimsuit shall be respectively 25% on each part. Non-permeable material shall be distinguishable.

this language in the U.S. Masters Swimming’s official interpretation of Swimwear rule 102.14
suits introduced prior to September 30, 2007, are legal for U.S.M.S. competition
leads me to believe the Speedo FAST SKIN II will be safe, not sure when Speedo PROs were released but it think it was after that date.

Your best bet could be a hineck speedo pro, I hope blue the blue seventy nero comp makes the phase 1 list but it won't pass the 50% non permeability value test.

for training ideas
consider following these blogs:

Pat Brundage (http://www.usms.org/forums/blog.php?u=5013)


Chris Stevenson (http://www.usms.org/forums/blog.php?u=6428)


My current blog, Ande's Swimming Blog (http://www.usms.org/forums/blog.php?u=3156), just know that I'm focusing on 50's & 100's for Nats

My My Old swimming blog with workouts from Mar 2005 - Sep 2008

Swim Faster Faster,

Ande




These are great suggestions and just what I'm looking for.
I did go into the last meet without tapering since I really am aiming for nationals. I'm wearing a jammer.
Are the body suits really a big advantage?
Do I need the most expensive one to be effective?
I can have no problem upping the yardage, but at what point do I ease up for nationals.
I'm really stoked about swimming and can't wait for my first national experience! Unfortunately I swim on my own. We don't have a competitive master program in Sioux City and no one I swim with can push me. You guys are now my coach. I want to thank Jeff for recommending a place to swim while I'm in DC. I got in some yardage and felt great. I did a broken 500 for the first time and thought it was a great set. Thanks again everyone!
Scott
712-253-9701 cell

knelson
April 1st, 2009, 12:21 PM
I have heard a Eddie Reese (maybe the world's best coach) say that there are only four ways to get faster

1. improve technique
2. get stronger
3. harder workouts
4. if the workouts can't get any harder then swim the same workouts faster


This is obviously dated. He'd have to amend it now by adding;
5. Wear a good full body suit

Iowamaster49
April 1st, 2009, 07:56 PM
Thanks coaches! I'm really suprised about the performance of the full body suit! 3 seconds per 100? Can I get by with a suit for $250? I will get one, but how durable is it? I assume it would be for meets and time trials only, but I would think that I should practice in it to get used to it and try to determine new pace splits. The two meets that I've been in, I had the lap counter person signal me as far as my pace. Do you agree with this?

Very exciting information gentlemen!

tdrop
April 2nd, 2009, 04:21 PM
I don't think the suits are as fragile as they are made out to be. I have used my last fs pro high neck for about 40 swims before i retired it because it was getting a little loose. but it was still fast.

I suggest getting an fs pro high neck. i just got mine from metroswimshop.com for 210 bucks. if they don't have them try swimoutlet.com

Ya, you should probably take it to a practice and try it out. they feel weird when you are not used to them.

regarding figuring out your pacing: don't worry too much about the exact pace time. instead just try going by feel. of course this is just one school of thought. some coaches would say use the clock. i prefer feel most of the time because i rarely see swimmers stick to their pace in races. we normally over or under shoot the mark, anyway.

fyi...3 seconds per hundred is just a guess. it varies for everyone. and that number is for someone at your current speed in a 500. so, ya. i think you can expect a 15 second drop with a suit. who knows maybe even more...lets hope!

good luck

ande
April 2nd, 2009, 04:57 PM
The speed improvement effect of a tech suit is different for each swimmer. Depends on the suit & fit, the swimmers' proportions, characteristics, & expectations.

The Speedo FS Pro Highneck Bodyskin (http://tinyurl.com/yu2hwd) is probably the fastest suit for the money, only $203.

but as I wrote in my earlier post, I'm not sure what is going to be approved by FINA in their PHASE 1 testing. I really like the Blue Seventy Nero Comp, I hope it passes PHASE 1 but the current model won't pass PHASE 2 so it's done on Jan 1, 2010.

Ande



Thanks coaches! I'm really suprised about the performance of the full body suit! 3 seconds per 100? Can I get by with a suit for $250? I will get one, but how durable is it? I assume it would be for meets and time trials only, but I would think that I should practice in it to get used to it and try to determine new pace splits. The two meets that I've been in, I had the lap counter person signal me as far as my pace. Do you agree with this?

Very exciting information gentlemen!

flippergirl
April 2nd, 2009, 05:17 PM
Thanks Ande, this is really helpful to me. It makes sense...now I just have to follow it. I mean it. This is good advice for a 500.
Paige

Iowamaster49
April 3rd, 2009, 10:19 PM
I just ordered the FS Pro hineck. Thanks for the advice. I'm looking forward to trying it. The $203 was a great price!

ande
April 6th, 2009, 10:31 AM
Hi Paige,

You're welcome,
I hope it helps you swim faster faster.
Let me know how you do.

Ande


Thanks Ande, this is really helpful to me. It makes sense...now I just have to follow it. I mean it. This is good advice for a 500.
Paige

orca1946
April 6th, 2009, 12:21 PM
Where do I look for the pro hineck? Never mind , I just reread it .

ande
April 6th, 2009, 02:37 PM
here's the link:

The Speedo FS Pro Highneck Bodyskin (http://tinyurl.com/yu2hwd) is probably the fastest suit for the money, only $203.

but as I wrote in my earlier post, I'm not sure what is going to be approved by FINA in their PHASE 1 testing. I really like the Blue Seventy Nero Comp, I hope it passes PHASE 1 but the current model won't pass PHASE 2 so it's done on Jan 1, 2010.


RECENT RULINGS

FINA Releases Information on FINA Bureau Meeting, Approves Speedsuit Restriction Proposal


U.S. Masters Swimming’s official interpretation of Swimwear rule 102.14



Previous Articles

Tip 201 Which Suit Suits you? More On Racing Suits


Tip 214 Even More On Racing Suits



More links:

Mens Jammers (http://tinyurl.com/2wree6)


Mens LegSkins (http://tinyurl.com/25hzh4)


Mens Full Body (http://tinyurl.com/yu2hwd)


Womens Full body (http://tinyurl.com/264te8)


Womens (http://tinyurl.com/3hyo4f)






Where do I look for the pro hineck? Never mind , I just reread it .

Iowamaster49
April 20th, 2009, 10:58 PM
I bought the fs pro and should have had someone film me trying to fit into it! What a sight. After 20 minutes, it wasn't going to happen. I have a 35" waist and this suit will not work for me. I exchanged it for a Nike Hydra which fits very well. I was concerned that the performance wouldn't be noticeable, but boy was I wrong! I couldn't believe how fast I was with no extra effort. I was 2-3 seconds faster per 100 in practice than normal! The suit was $153.

I have been taking the advice of what many of you had said, Swim faster in practice and put more intensity into the practice. I upped the yardage about 500 yards a day as well. The last few weeks have shown some break through times. My last broken 500 was 6:00 including the 30 seconds of rest. This is 20 seconds faster than a month ago. The advice you have all given should be a guide for others. It works!

With Nationals just around the corner I could use some taper advice.

ande
April 21st, 2009, 11:21 AM
consider getting a larger PRO, I could get into an X-Large but couldn't get the Large FS PRO past my butt. Tech Suits can make a HUGE diff.

Glad to see you're swimming faster faster. I'm curious to find out how much you're going to improve your 500 time.


I bought the fs pro and should have had someone film me trying to fit into it! What a sight. After 20 minutes, it wasn't going to happen. I have a 35" waist and this suit will not work for me. I exchanged it for a Nike Hydra which fits very well. I was concerned that the performance wouldn't be noticeable, but boy was I wrong! I couldn't believe how fast I was with no extra effort. I was 2-3 seconds faster per 100 in practice than normal! The suit was $153.

I have been taking the advice of what many of you had said,
Swim faster in practice and
put more intensity into the practice.
I upped the yardage about 500 yards a day as well. The last few weeks have shown some break through times. My last broken 500 was 6:00 including the 30 seconds of rest. This is 20 seconds faster than a month ago. The advice you have all given should be a guide for others. It works!

With Nationals just around the corner I could use some taper advice.

jim thornton
April 21st, 2009, 05:22 PM
Scott, I read the title of this thread quickly, then read your post about having trouble getting into your fastskin pro.

God help me but I concluded that your were talking about lb. not distance, as in the last 150 lb. of your former weight of 500 lb. finally fell off.

I was going to recommend you go on the Biggest Loser when I realized my mistake,

In any event, keep up the good work, and I hope that the last 150 of your 500 climbs back up!

Iowamaster49
May 21st, 2009, 11:49 PM
I swam at nationals and had great races! My 500 did not fall off at all thanks to the advice given. I came into the meet with a seed time of 5:50 and swam a 5:30 in the race. The first 50 was 30 seconds then all 33's and finished with a 32! Very consistant pace due to learning what this pace felt like when fresh and tired. For anyone having the same problem that I did with the last 150 falling off should follow what was written here. I'm living proof that the advice is good.

As a note, I tapered for 2 weeks, got lots of rest and ate very little red meat. I stuck with turkey and chicken quite often. I raced at 9:00 am so the day of the race I had part of a Powerbar, water and half gatorade. My warm up was 700 easy yards with a couple 50's at race pace. I had 90 minutes rest after warm ups. It was a winning combination that nearly got me the Iowa masters record for the 500 in the 45-49 age group. I missed it by .16 seconds. I turn 50 in June, so new goals are being set. Thanks again and good luck to all of you 500 atheletes.

I want to give a special thanks to Jack Groselle of Ohio. I met Jack and his wife at the Nationals dinner. He was very encouraging and actually watched my 500. (Jack owns several world records so his support meant a lot!)
Scott Gerkin

Fresnoid
May 21st, 2009, 11:58 PM
I swam at nationals and had great races! My 500 did not fall off at all thanks to the advice given. I came into the meet with a seed time of 5:50 and swam a 5:30 in the race. The first 50 was 30 seconds then all 33's and finished with a 32! Very consistant pace due to learning what this pace felt like when fresh and tired. For anyone having the same problem that I did with the last 150 falling off should follow what was written here. I'm living proof that the advice is good.

As a note, I tapered for 2 weeks, got lots of rest and ate very little red meat. I stuck with turkey and chicken quite often. I raced at 9:00 am so the day of the race I had part of a Powerbar, water and half gatorade. My warm up was 700 easy yards with a couple 50's at race pace. I had 90 minutes rest after warm ups. It was a winning combination that nearly got me the Iowa masters record for the 500 in the 45-49 age group. I missed it by .16 seconds. I turn 50 in June, so new goals are being set. Thanks again and good luck to all of you 500 atheletes.

I want to give a special thanks to Jack Groselle of Ohio. I met Jack and his wife at the Nationals dinner. He was very encouraging and actually watched my 500. (Jack owns several world records so his support meant a lot!)
Scott Gerkin

Wow. Great swim. You must feel encouraged and also excited about how much faster you can go with more hard work.

jim thornton
May 22nd, 2009, 09:57 AM
Scott, you may be a gerkin now. But with hard work and dedication, I have no doubt that you will be a kosher dill soon. The Iowa records in the 500 are going down!

ande
May 22nd, 2009, 04:45 PM
Hey Scott,

Congratulations, that's exciting! you made huge improvements.
dropping from 5:50.40 to 5:30
on April 21st I wrote
"I'm curious to find out how much you're going to improve your 500 time."
and here's the answer

13 Gerkin, Scott 49 IAMA 5:30.14
30.13
1:03.18 (33.05)
1:36.68 (33.50)
2:10.54 (33.86) 1:07.36
2:44.32 (33.78)
3:17.49 (33.17) 1:06.95
3:50.81 (33.32)
4:24.22 (33.41) 1:06.73
4:57.38 (33.16)
5:30.14 (32.76) 1:05.92 2:45.82

I think your 4th & 5th 50's should have been slightly faster. Your 10th should have been much faster, really kick it into overdrive on that last 50, 6 beat kick & give it everything you've got.

What suit did you wear?

Looks to me like you followed MY Suggestions to the letter, more, even more, suit links

You proved you can swim faster faster,
Now swim faster faster next season.
Way to go!

Ande


I swam at nationals and had great races! My 500 did not fall off at all thanks to the advice given. I came into the meet with a seed time of 5:50 and swam a 5:30 in the race. The first 50 was 30 seconds then all 33's and finished with a 32! Very consistant pace due to learning what this pace felt like when fresh and tired. For anyone having the same problem that I did with the last 150 falling off should follow what was written here. I'm living proof that the advice is good.

As a note, I tapered for 2 weeks, got lots of rest and ate very little red meat. I stuck with turkey and chicken quite often. I raced at 9:00 am so the day of the race I had part of a Powerbar, water and half gatorade. My warm up was 700 easy yards with a couple 50's at race pace. I had 90 minutes rest after warm ups. It was a winning combination that nearly got me the Iowa masters record for the 500 in the 45-49 age group. I missed it by .16 seconds. I turn 50 in June, so new goals are being set. Thanks again and good luck to all of you 500 atheletes.

I want to give a special thanks to Jack Groselle of Ohio. I met Jack and his wife at the Nationals dinner. He was very encouraging and actually watched my 500. (Jack owns several world records so his support meant a lot!)
Scott Gerkin

Iowamaster49
June 6th, 2009, 01:21 AM
Ande, Thanks you for your help! This has been one of my best experiences ever. The suit I wore was a Nike Hydra. I bought an FS Pro but it was too small and I couldn't get it on. For simpicity of suit size and availability I got the Hydra. It worked well for me. I saw a lot of Blueseventy suits at Nationals. Are they that much better?

This summer I'm going to cross train and then hit the pool hard in the fall. Hopefully I will break some Iowa records next season. Do you want to help me do it?! Thanks again.
Scott

ande
August 12th, 2009, 10:59 AM
Go for it Scott, Good luck.

ande


Ande, Thanks you for your help! This has been one of my best experiences ever. The suit I wore was a Nike Hydra. I bought an FS Pro but it was too small and I couldn't get it on. For simpicity of suit size and availability I got the Hydra. It worked well for me. I saw a lot of Blueseventy suits at Nationals. Are they that much better?

This summer I'm going to cross train and then hit the pool hard in the fall. Hopefully I will break some Iowa records next season. Do you want to help me do it?! Thanks again.
Scott

Iowamaster49
January 2nd, 2010, 11:25 PM
In early December, all of my dedication to swimming paid of by setting a pending Iowa Master record in the 500 free. (50-54) My time was 5:26.91. The previous record set in 1998 was 5:30.86. I want to thank all of you for your help! I also want to thank my swimming partner and coach, Roger Madden.

jim thornton
January 3rd, 2010, 11:45 AM
In early December, all of my dedication to swimming paid of by setting a pending Iowa Master record in the 500 free. (50-54) My time was 5:26.91. The previous record set in 1998 was 5:30.86. I want to thank all of you for your help! I also want to thank my swimming partner and coach, Roger Madden.


Congratulations, Scott!

I think that with this new record, you deserve a name change. You are no longer a Gerkin. From this day henceforth, I will think of you as Scott Dill!

ande
January 5th, 2010, 03:55 PM
Congratulations!
Way to go!
You seriously dropped your time
What were your splits?


In early December, all of my dedication to swimming paid of by setting a pending Iowa Master record in the 500 free. (50-54) My time was 5:26.91. The previous record set in 1998 was 5:30.86. I want to thank all of you for your help! I also want to thank my swimming partner and coach, Roger Madden.

Iowamaster49
January 10th, 2010, 09:56 PM
Jim and Ande, you've been with me all along! Thanks for the help and support! Ande, I may be in Austin for work next month. Any chance we could meet at a practice? I still need a little more stength in the end. My turns are pretty weak as well. I know I need to start weight training, so advice on ths would be great. Below are my splits.


Name Age Team Seed Finals
================================================== =============================
1 Gerkin, Scott T 50 IAMA-40 5:30.14 5:26.91
29.31 1:01.36 (32.05) 1:33.89 (32.53) 2:06.79 (32.90)
2:39.78 (32.99) 3:12.70 (32.92) 3:45.87 (33.17) 4:19.69 (33.82)
4:53.76 (34.07) 5:26.91 (33.15)

Lump
January 10th, 2010, 10:04 PM
Jim and Ande, you've been with me all along! Thanks for the help and support! Ande, I may be in Austin for work next month. Any chance we could meet at a practice? I still need a little more stength in the end. My turns are pretty weak as well. I know I need to start weight training, so advice on ths would be great. Below are my splits.


Name Age Team Seed Finals
================================================== =============================
1 Gerkin, Scott T 50 IAMA-40 5:30.14 5:26.91
29.31 1:01.36 (32.05) 1:33.89 (32.53) 2:06.79 (32.90)
2:39.78 (32.99) 3:12.70 (32.92) 3:45.87 (33.17) 4:19.69 (33.82)
4:53.76 (34.07) 5:26.91 (33.15)

That is great Scott! You give me some inspiration!:applaud:

The last 500 free is did was back in April (09) and I did a 5:44. I think my goal for Master's Nationals will be under 5:20. Hopefully visiting back on this thread between now and then will help me get there!

jim thornton
January 12th, 2010, 10:20 PM
Scott et al,

A friend of mine here in the Pittsburgh area, Glenn Battle, is both a super swimmer and a really nice guy. I asked him at one of our little Y meets how to swim the 500 when you aren't in the greatest shape and want to do okay without either humiliating or damaging yourself.

Before I tell you his strategy, let me just say that this is probably not the way to swim the 500 if you want to get your best time for the season. The way to swim to get your best is to not wimp out: swim intelligently but without letting yourself off the pain hook too much. As my coach Bill said once, "It's supposed to hurt."

With this preamble acknowledged, here is a strategy for swimming the 500 if you don't want it to hurt too much:

150 comfortable
50 faster
150 comfortable
50 faster
50 comfortable
50 sprint

So basically, you break it down into 2 x 200 and 1 x 100; the 200s become 150 moderate/50 fast, and the 100 becomes 50 moderate/50 fast.

Glenn added one more complication: the very first 50 should be just outside the comfort zone, otherwise you will establish too much comfort!

Observations:



I think the real genius of this strategy is that you spend so much time thinking and counting that it distracts you from pain
It is easy to become confused, which is what happened to me on Sunday. I ended up "miscounting"--I did the initial "just out of the comfort zone comfortable 50" but then followed this by 150 comfortable yard. It should have been 100. If you are getting confused just reading this, imagine how much more confusing it would be with hypoxia setting in.

In any event, here are my splits: Eventually, I hope to be able to man up and swim the whole thing with some pain; but for now, I was very happy with this relatively pain-free execution of Glenn's strategy! We have the advantage in our area of having small Y meets every 2-3 weeks, so it gives you the chance to play around with different ways of swimming events. The drawback is that very few of these meets are ever USMS sanctioned, not that this time would have much of a chance of Top 10 qualification. I also did a 53.35 earlier in the 100 free, which in previous years might have just squeaked in, though this is almost certainly too slow for the age group now.

AGE GROUP: 55-59
1 JIM THORNTON 57 M SEWY 5:34.13
29.29 33.64 34.73 34.65 32.75 35.19 34.93 34.76
33.58 30.61

PS Ande, if you happen to see this posting, do you have any explanation for the following.

Here is my 100: And here is my 50:
AGE GROUP: 55-59
1 JIM THORNTON 57 M SEWY 53.35
25.74 27.61

And here is my 50:

AGE GROUP: 55-59
1 JIM THORNTON 57 M SEWY 25.16

The 50 split felt controlled and decent; the 50 by itself felt like I was
trying MUCH harder, but the times were virtually identical (given that the split time was measured from the feet and the regular 50 by the hand.

What gives? Where does raw speed vanish in ones dotage?

Iowamaster49
March 25th, 2010, 10:19 PM
In February I swam the 1000 for the first time in Minneapolis. Using the guidelines for the 500, I was real pleased with the outcome. I swam the 1000 in 11:20 which got me another Iowa Masters record by 3 seconds! The first 500 was at 5:32 which was probably a little too fast but felt good all of the way through. Swimming has been so good to me and I'm so thrilled with to have all of your help and support. I'm now trying to give a little of my swimming knowledge (and yours) to our local Triathlon club at monthy swim clinics. Thanks again. Good luck to all of you in the final meets this season!

Lump
March 25th, 2010, 10:23 PM
In February I swam the 1000 for the first time in Minneapolis. Using the guidelines for the 500, I was real pleased with the outcome. I swam the 1000 in 11:20 which got me another Iowa Masters record by 3 seconds! The first 500 was at 5:32 which was probably a little too fast but felt good all of the way through. Swimming has been so good to me and I'm so thrilled with to have all of your help and support. I'm now trying to give a little of my swimming knowledge (and yours) to our local Triathlon club at monthy swim clinics. Thanks again. Good luck to all of you in the final meets this season!

Great Job Scott!

I did the 500 at Auburn last month and did a 5:24 (from a 5:44 the previous April) and will be swimming the 1000 this Saturday at a meet. I think I just entered at 11:30 and "hope" to be 11:15ish or so. Seems we are on the same path! Keep up the great work and report back!:applaud:

stillwater
March 26th, 2010, 10:29 AM
do you have any explanation for the following.

Here is my 100: And here is my 50:
AGE GROUP: 55-59
1 JIM THORNTON 57 M SEWY 53.35
25.74 27.61

And here is my 50:

AGE GROUP: 55-59
1 JIM THORNTON 57 M SEWY 25.16

The 50 split felt controlled and decent; the 50 by itself felt like I was
trying MUCH harder, but the times were virtually identical (given that the split time was measured from the feet and the regular 50 by the hand.



I have an idea, but it was resoundly mocked in the past.

The general feeling is that you should just go more ALL OUT.

__steve__
March 26th, 2010, 08:24 PM
I bet weight lifting can shed close to a second in the 50 if not already engaged with such activity.

ande
March 26th, 2010, 08:50 PM
wait he wrote an article against it
he could get down to 23's with proper weight training


I bet weight lifting can shed close to a second in the 50 if not already engaged with such activity.

Iowamaster49
March 26th, 2010, 11:55 PM
Thanks Jeff! I think you're right. We seem to be pacing about the same. Good luck this weekend!

orca1946
March 27th, 2010, 01:04 PM
Now that you have tasted the tech suit , it's going to be gone !!!
We were all faster as we think back , now it's going to be jammers.