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ande
June 3rd, 2009, 11:14 AM
ROMA 2009 ::: 13th FINA WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS
Sun July 26th - Sun Aug 02
Swimming Events (http://www.roma09.it/en/competition_programme/swimming.html)

RESULTS (http://omegatiming.com/swimming/racearchives/2009/Roma2009/index.htm)

http://www.roma09.it/en/index.html

FACEBOOK (http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=56603546746&ref=ts)

FINA (http://www.fina.org/pool/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=7240&Itemid=330)

ande
July 12th, 2009, 03:20 PM
2 weeks to go
The US team is selected

Couroboros
July 12th, 2009, 05:15 PM
Let me be the first to say... GO USA! :canada:

Er... oops... where's an American flag when you need one?

knelson
July 12th, 2009, 05:24 PM
I think this meet will be a real mixed bag for the U.S. We'll win plenty of medals, but there will be quite a few events where we won't even advance a swimmer to finals.

ande
July 13th, 2009, 01:30 PM
ADDED FINA SITE (http://www.fina.org/pool/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=7240&Itemid=330)

plus here's where you can get
World Rankings (http://www.fina.org/swimming/world_rankings/index.php)

bamueller
July 13th, 2009, 01:58 PM
It's cool to see open-water events in there as well. The 25K just sounds painful.

ande
July 20th, 2009, 11:34 AM
less than a week to go

bridge5
July 20th, 2009, 09:26 PM
I found this helpful. Thought others might as well....(copy/pasted) From SwimNetwork.com:

2009 FINA World Championships



Event Start Date:

Sun 07/26/09 12:00 AM
Event End Date:
Sun 08/02/09 11:59 PM

Description:
Swimnetwork.com will be at the 2009 FINA World Championships in Rome, bringing you highlights, recaps, results and more. For the latest, click here (http://www.swimnetwork.com/blogs/blfeat/251.html).

Click here (http://www.universalsports.com/EPG/tv.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=23000&SPID=13408) for Universal Sports' TV schedule.

OPEN WATER
st1\:*{behavior:url(#ieooui) }
Swimnetwork.com's Open Water Expert Steve Munatones will report live from Ostia along with Olympic open water champion Maarten van der Weijden. Together, they will report from the media boat via twitter (twitter.com/swimopenwater (http://twitter.com/swimopenwater)) during the 5K races .

After an unanticipated two-day delay due to weather conditions, U.S. team leader Paul Asmuth said, “They all feel good. They enjoyed the light training session at the beach this morning. The water was a bit cooler [than before] and there was a bit of a swell left over, but they are looking forward to racing tomorrow.”

Coverage via Twitter will begin at 8 am Rome time (2 am ET Tuesday or 11 pm PT Monday).

Official event site (http://www.roma09.it/en/index.html) | FINA (http://www.fina.org/)

Meet the U.S. Worlds Team:

MEN
Nathan Adrian (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=df1f8d94-c89f-4032-ba40-a4ad20818348&TabId=388&Mid=597) (50 Free, 100 Free)
Ricky Berens (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=e7879c6b-f63b-46ad-be56-aa18332f5e16&TabId=388&Mid=597) (4x100 Free Relay, 4x200 Free Relay)
Tyler Clary (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=58106456-9c97-4501-9181-90c8da28fde9&TabId=388&Mid=597) (400 IM, 200 Fly)
Fran Crippen (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=22e4f6d7-aa8d-4598-88fb-8dbe55ea305f&TabId=388&Mid=597) (5K, 10K)
Mark Gangloff (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=faa288cf-1892-443f-b541-c61ca766074d&TabId=388&Mid=597) (50 Breast,100 Breast)
Andrew Gemmell (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=ab4c6ffc-4432-4bf3-a78c-a65249f04c36&TabId=388&Mid=597) (5K, 10K)
Matt Grevers (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=9249d75b-d2c0-4f0d-aafb-9b8c362600fe&TabId=388&Mid=597) (50 Back, 100 Back, 50 Fly)
Cullen Jones (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=51c2fb07-a280-4c57-8196-9e874d4f690d&TabId=388&Mid=597) (50 Free)
Adam Klein (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=d7cc2ffe-2893-4ac6-932c-d6b809c1787b&TabId=388&Mid=597) (50 Breast, 200 Breast)
Ryan Lochte (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=ef40c7a1-7499-4931-8027-f8a7f1c4175d&TabId=388&Mid=597) (200 IM, 400 IM, 200 Back)
Daniel Madwed (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=865832b1-1907-4251-92d2-047fe26eea20&TabId=388&Mid=597) (400 Free)
Tyler McGill (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=613c0b1b-23b4-45c0-9f79-cf329da09596&TabId=388&Mid=597) (50 Fly,100 Fly)
Alex Meyer (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=f94352e0-7bfa-48f1-953c-b009d94720bf&TabId=388&Mid=597) (25K)
Brennan Morris (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=4e6a9f68-d562-4637-9f10-b26efc89cada&TabId=388&Mid=597) (1500 Free)
Aaron Peirsol (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=117cb3d8-0aa7-48a3-8cd4-6eb86eae3b8d&TabId=388&Mid=597) (50 Back, 100 Back, 200 Back)
Michael Phelps (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=4beec290-d7ae-483d-a512-36b18a4e022a&TabId=388&Mid=597) (200 Free, 100 Fly, 200 Fly)
Sean Ryan (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=9681ae93-dc35-4b3c-8780-a0d76e854e7b&TabId=388&Mid=597) (25K)
Eric Shanteau (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=902aafbb-7f55-4ba1-918f-4477e1642e3b&TabId=388&Mid=597) (100 Breast, 200 Breast, 200 IM)
Davis Tarwater (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=7cf2f1fe-7786-45e5-89ca-17f0cd6f4f49&TabId=388&Mid=597) (4x200 Free Relay)
Peter Vanderkaay (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=7c2389a0-a353-49e5-a233-ee5ce44ca731&TabId=388&Mid=597) (400 Free, 800 Free)
David Walters (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=40aca59f-d145-4ffa-84b5-f3acedf6de9f&TabId=388&Mid=597) (100 Free, 200 Free)
Garrett Weber-Gale (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=df411ab9-0d47-434a-8032-f75c0a200b52&TabId=388&Mid=597) (4x100 Free Relay)
Jackson Wilcox (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=7cd82379-243a-414b-88b2-577e811eb82e&TabId=388&Mid=597) (800 Free, 1500 Free)

WOMEN
Alyssa Anderson (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=fa924f9d-128a-4ed7-959f-8a492eb23ca5&TabId=388&Mid=597) (4x200 Free Relay)
Haley Anderson (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=837fa8cf-2926-4e51-aab8-cfea4409d889&TabId=388&Mid=597) (800 Free)
Elizabeth Beisel (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=07f4d985-95ef-4e5f-a14e-fb25c8426300&TabId=388&Mid=597) (400 IM, 200 Back)
Emily Brunemann (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=3eac52f9-b34b-4d83-8170-ab8fc4390c7b&TabId=388&Mid=597) (5K, 10K)
Kasey Carlson (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=cb46f983-c338-41c1-9728-9dc8a264b015&TabId=388&Mid=597) (50 Breast, 100 Breast)
Mary Descenza (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=857d7d61-a3d9-4441-9b95-9627629fabfa&TabId=388&Mid=597) (200 Fly)
Kate Dwelley (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=de849813-6ed7-41c8-9b88-55b8d1eb7c5f&TabId=388&Mid=597) (4x100 Free Relay)
Eva Fabian (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=b5722ae9-3f07-4867-b755-2d4eaa830c18&TabId=388&Mid=597) (10K, 25K)
Caitlin Geary (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=5d332a0e-3b2d-4c53-a7ba-7f512adb3884&TabId=388&Mid=597) (4x100 Free Relay)
Emily Hanson (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=967d2f7c-33a7-4cff-a562-77626579a2c3&TabId=388&Mid=597) (5K, 25K)
Keri Hehn (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=18984621-ada7-46d6-8dcb-5aecf2e153a6&TabId=388&Mid=597) (200 Breast)
Kathleen Hersey (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=e0af03f7-4d51-44ce-928d-c83a02ada10e&TabId=388&Mid=597) (200 Fly)
Ariana Kukors (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=523ed027-b96b-459c-a1db-33856f25843d&TabId=388&Mid=597) (200 IM, 4x200 Free Relay)
Dagny Knutson (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=8dc8e9b0-6e03-43a5-a1ea-1626ef9ac1a6&TabId=388&Mid=597) (4x200 Free Relay)
Christine Magnuson (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=fc4b6b3b-69a7-4552-ba3d-3cc81f77498c&TabId=388&Mid=597) (50 Fly, 100 Fly, 4x100 Free Relay)
Hayley McGregory (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=c764da57-c881-4e1f-8070-bac2f7c2a2aa&TabId=388&Mid=597) (50 Back, 100 Back)
Lacey Nymeyer (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=82930283-9f08-43f1-97ee-f94c4ed9f86f&TabId=388&Mid=597) (4x200 Free Relay)
Elizabeth Pelton (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=723d8313-b79d-4ed0-aee6-a0d2e2dac880&TabId=388&Mid=597) (50 Back, 100 Back, 200 Back)
Allison Schmitt (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=c88fdd52-8893-42c8-800a-c277b47cb4fc&TabId=388&Mid=597) (200 Free, 400 Free)
Julia Smit (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=96a54352-aea2-4fae-a4ba-8c24b7deed64&TabId=388&Mid=597) (200 IM, 400 IM, 4x100 Free Relay)
Rebecca Soni (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=08cb9e14-0fae-46b2-9104-6e9b8a81e3ab&TabId=388&Mid=597) (50 Breast, 100 Breast, 200 Breast)
Chloe Sutton (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=35a480c5-26c9-4135-807a-084bb6394d06&TabId=388&Mid=597) (400 Free, 800 Free, 1500 Free)
Dara Torres (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=10e6c9c4-0e67-465f-be5f-051652fe330c&TabId=388&Mid=597) (50 Free)
Dana Vollmer (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=c002d3fc-321e-4811-beb3-199dc8168c78&TabId=388&Mid=597) (50 Fly, 100 Fly, 100 Free, 200 Free)
Amanda Weir (http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/DesktopModules/BioViewManaged.aspx?personid=b885af65-24ff-478c-b2c6-419a27d238f6&TabId=388&Mid=597) (50 Free, 100 Free)

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tjrpatt
July 21st, 2009, 09:36 PM
Andrew Gemmel from Wilmington, DE placed 5th in the 5K while Fran Crippen from Philadelphia placed 7th. Who knew that the Middle Altantic region was such a Open Water Mecca!

tjrpatt
July 22nd, 2009, 03:01 PM
In the 10K event for the men's,

From maswim.org,

Andrew Gemmell and Fran Crippen closed with tremendous finishes to capture the silver and bronze behind winner Thomas Lurz of Germany. Soon after the completion of the race, Italy and Greece filed a protest of Crippen's finish. According to the protest, Crippen allegedly swam outside the lane lines of the finish chute.

The protest has been accepted by the FINA judge, and the U.S. contingent has filed an appeal. The appeal will be adjudicated by tomorrow morning, and as early as later this evening. FINA will not confirm or post official results until the protest and subsequent appeal are concluded.

orca1946
July 22nd, 2009, 03:07 PM
This is great to watch on TV .

tjrpatt
July 22nd, 2009, 04:44 PM
This is great to watch on TV .

I wish that they showed more than two minutes of the Open Water. :bitching:. Who the heck cares about Water polo and Diving? Open Water is where the action is. I really need to find more open water races like that. I really hate the running beginning and endings in alot of the ocean swims that I have.

selkie
July 23rd, 2009, 12:04 PM
Crippen is awarded the bronze after the protest was overturned on appeal:

http://www.universalsports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?&SPID=11652&DB_OEM_ID=23000&ATCLID=204764089

As for coverage, I actually like watching water polo, but don't see why Universal can't put up a full video of at least the 5Ks when they're also archiving entire water polo matches.

tjrpatt
July 23rd, 2009, 12:21 PM
Crippen is awarded the bronze after the protest was overturned on appeal:

http://www.universalsports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?&SPID=11652&DB_OEM_ID=23000&ATCLID=204764089

As for coverage, I actually like watching water polo, but don't see why Universal can't put up a full video of at least the 5Ks when they're also archiving entire water polo matches.


:applaud::applaud::applaud::applaud::applaud:. I am happy for him. I saw that part of the race. He had to extra work to get on the other side of the lane line so the Italian guy had more of a challenge to beat him.

Universal sports could have put up a full video on the website at least. You know that they probably videotape the whole race in case some dramatic happens.

But, from what I heard, Open Water swimmers don't peak until they are 29 so that is a good sign for Andrew Gemmel to get the silver at the 10K and only 18 years old. Crippen trains with Germantown Academy so doing a Dick Shoulberg practice is very good preparation for open water swimming without doing any real open water training. The attitude has really changed about open water swimming in our area. When I was coming up, I never knew to do open water events or heard about them. Now, there are alot of kids are doing these events. The Middle Atlantic never had a Open Water Championship or clubs hosting open water events.

Knightswimmer2
July 23rd, 2009, 12:51 PM
I wish that they showed more than two minutes of the Open Water. :bitching:. Who the heck cares about Water polo and Diving?


I take a bit of offense to that statement, I care about water polo a lot!

Diving...not so much. :banana:

tjrpatt
July 23rd, 2009, 01:58 PM
I take a bit of offense to that statement, I care about water polo a lot!

Diving...not so much. :banana:

Sorry to take it out on water polo but I just felt like I saw 95% water polo and .2% of open water swimming. All I have to say that there are some big girls in water polo. Don't mess with those ladies!!!!

Knightswimmer2
July 23rd, 2009, 05:00 PM
Sorry to take it out on water polo but I just felt like I saw 95% water polo and .2% of open water swimming. All I have to say that there are some big girls in water polo. Don't mess with those ladies!!!!


Yea I have a lot of Female friends that are current and ex polo players and I will not confront them...They scare me sometimes :cane:

ande
July 24th, 2009, 02:14 PM
MEET STARTS SUNDAY
RESULTS (http://omegatiming.com/swimming/racearchives/2009/Roma2009/index.htm)

selkie
July 26th, 2009, 09:58 AM
Ariana Kukors is making the most of Elizabeth Pelton's withdrawing from the 200 IM, eh?

ande
July 26th, 2009, 10:15 AM
day 1 prelims are done
article (http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jHLNIGqTjcVgQGZzDvGE72I0rLagD99M4O700)

RESULTS (http://omegatiming.com/swimming/racearchives/2009/Roma2009/index.htm)

swimcat
July 26th, 2009, 10:33 AM
what a trooper Berens is.:) i read one of the italian swimmers -female- ripped a jaked and withdrew from her heat.

tjrpatt
July 26th, 2009, 01:13 PM
Stephanie Rice was so nice after the 200 IM. Nice job Kukors. But, I really don't think that Coventry and Rice would pull that time off right now. Finally, a girl who can challenge Rice and Coventry. They slaughtered Coughlin and Hoff at Beijing.

I am glad that the 400 free WR is broken. What happened to Vanderkay? I was waiting for him to step it up and he just never did. Then again, I guess that he is not a 100% after his flu he got befroe WCT.

Geesh, a woman under 4:00 in the 400 free.:bow:. That was an amazing swim by Pellegrini.

Salnikov22
July 26th, 2009, 01:27 PM
VIDEO: 50m butterfly men's (http://vinovo.magnify.net/video/Milorad-Cavic-50m-fly-WC-Rome)

THE men's 50 fly national record books took a beating during prelims at the FINA World Championships.

World-record holder Rafael Munoz and South Africa's Roland Schoeman tied for the lead heading into semis with 22.90s. Munoz owns the global mark with a 22.43, while Schoeman broke his African record of 22.96. Schoeman's previous continental mark also served as the meet record.

Serbia's Milorad Cavic qualified third in 22.93 to lower his national mark of 23.11 and become the first Serbian under 23 seconds. Denmark's Jakob Andkjaer finished fourth with a 23.04 to beat his national record of 23.36 set in April.

swimcat
July 26th, 2009, 02:05 PM
bernard had fastest relay split 46.46 althought they didn;t win. maybe he should have anchored. adrian was spectacular, grevers had a great 3rd leg and lochte had a great 2nd. phelps didn';t look as sharp as his teammates. hmmmmmmmmmmm

Maui Mike
July 26th, 2009, 02:20 PM
I thought France was a shoo-in in the 400 free relay?

Is it just my nationalism showing or does the US always rise up for relays?

selkie
July 26th, 2009, 02:42 PM
And Fred Bosquet choked again. He was one of the best NCAA big meet swimmers ever, but seems to consistently fail to live up to potential at LC Worlds and Olympics.

Kukors and USA swimming need to chip in and buy Elizabeth Pelton a crate of turtle wax or something. If she hadn't picked the backstroke over the 200 IM, Kukors wouldn't have even swam the event she got a WR in.

tjrpatt
July 26th, 2009, 03:04 PM
And Fred Bosquet choked again. He was one of the best NCAA big meet swimmers ever, but seems to consistently fail to live up to potential at LC Worlds and Olympics.

Kukors and USA swimming need to chip in and buy Elizabeth Pelton a crate of turtle wax or something. If she hadn't picked the backstroke over the 200 IM, Kukors wouldn't have even swam the event she got a WR in.


Maybe set up a nice little trust fund or something so Pelton can get it when she turns pro. That was some good foreshadowing on Pelton's part. I am just glad that one of our girls is finally able to "throw down" with Rice and Coventry. Too bad, Kukors is not the 400 IM. She probably was just off her game at Nats. She got 4th in the 400 IM there. It is very inspiring to see a swim like Kukors.

Lump
July 26th, 2009, 04:41 PM
I am glad that the 400 free WR is broken. What happened to Vanderkay? I was waiting for him to step it up and he just never did. Then again, I guess that he is not a 100% after his flu he got befroe WCT.

Geesh, a woman under 4:00 in the 400 free.:bow:. That was an amazing swim by Pellegrini.

What happened to Vanderkay.....look at the last 100 split the German pulled off. NO ONE was catching him, holy crap!!!

The women are ALMOST at my best ever time from 1992 (3:58.8)! :bolt:

Maui Mike
July 26th, 2009, 05:33 PM
"They've got the relay in their blood," French coach Lionel Horter said.

Yep!

tjrpatt
July 26th, 2009, 08:52 PM
What happened to Vanderkay.....look at the last 100 split the German pulled off. NO ONE was catching him, holy crap!!!

The women are ALMOST at my best ever time from 1992 (3:58.8)! :bolt:

Geesh, The German's last 100 was faster than his first one. :bow:

Those English girls and Pellegrini are on fire.

tjrpatt
July 26th, 2009, 10:27 PM
What was the deal with Gaines and his comment about Shanteau's first international 100 breast. Who the heck cares if he was his first international 100 breast? The guy swam at Beijing. Yes, it wasn't in the 100 breast but he has international experience to handle other events besides the 200 breast. Geesh, Louise!!! Shanteau was on fire in that semifinal. I think that we could be saying, "kitijama who?". Of course, I can dream, can't I. Shanteau is just mowing down top breaststrokers in his path to potential greatness. Today, it was Gangloff's turn. Heck, he even mowed down the great Tyler Clary to get a spot on the 200 IM at Worlds. :applaud:.

knelson
July 26th, 2009, 11:57 PM
After Kukors destroying the WR with in that swim I'm now wondering if Pelton was "encouraged" to drop the 200 IM from her program.

And how about this Swedish girl Sjostrom in the 100 fly? She's still a couple weeks shy of her sixteenth birthday!

That Guy
July 27th, 2009, 12:40 AM
What happened to Vanderkay.....look at the last 100 split the German pulled off. NO ONE was catching him, holy crap!!!

Vanderkaay went 3:43, not bad at all. He's also swimming the 800 by the way: http://omegatiming.com/swimming/racearchives/2009/Roma2009/C51A1_SLHeats_17_Heats_Men_800_Free.pdf

The first three heats of that heat sheet are filled with NT's and fabricated entry times. Looks like a very fast Masters meet, until you scroll down to page 2.

Rykno
July 27th, 2009, 06:05 AM
Nice to see both Aaron and Matt moving on to the semi in the 100back.

tjrpatt
July 27th, 2009, 08:33 AM
Vanderkaay went 3:43, not bad at all. He's also swimming the 800 by the way: http://omegatiming.com/swimming/racearchives/2009/Roma2009/C51A1_SLHeats_17_Heats_Men_800_Free.pdf

The first three heats of that heat sheet are filled with NT's and fabricated entry times. Looks like a very fast Masters meet, until you scroll down to page 2.

How was the selection process decided for the 800 since they didn't swim it at WCTs? I know that Phelps could have done the 50 fly since he won the 100 fly. Just wondering. Jackson Wilcox is in it too. Gosh, I hope that Vanderkaay can put together a medal winning performance in this race. The 400 Olympic gold medalist didn't even make it back. It was good to see Davies from GBR make it back in the 400 since he is more of a 1500 guy and OW Olympic medalist.

tjrpatt
July 27th, 2009, 09:20 AM
Oh cool, Markus Rogan is still competing. I thought that he was going to retire. He is actually grew up in Switzerland until his parents moved to, I think, DC when he was 12. So, he actually lived in the country he represents unlike other US-citizens who swim for foreign countries.

lefty
July 27th, 2009, 11:29 AM
Do I have this right: Finals start at 6 pm GMT + 2 which means noon eastern here in the US?

ande
July 27th, 2009, 12:51 PM
Aaron got 9th

1 5 KOGA Junya JPN 0.49 25.62 52.39 CR 26.77

2 3 MEEUW Helge GER 0.63 25.94 52.49 26.55

3 4 IRIE Ryosuke JPN 0.54 25.88 52.73 26.85

4 4 WILDEBOER Aschwin ESP 0.60 25.62 52.76 27.14

5 8 GREVERS Mattew USA 0.70 25.85 52.82 26.97

6 8 GRIGORIADIS Aristeidis GRE 0.73 25.80 53.03 27.23

7 2 VYATCHANIN Arkady RUS 0.76 26.04 53.11 27.07

8 5 TANCOCK Liam GBR 0.61 25.68 53.12 27.44

9 3 PEIRSOL Aaron USA 0.64 25.66 53.22 27.56

knelson
July 27th, 2009, 12:56 PM
How about Soni in the 100 breast? She has a such a beautiful stroke. She's easy on the eyes out of the pool, too.

tjrpatt
July 27th, 2009, 08:49 PM
I keep on thinking that Markus Rogan is from Switzerland even though he is from Austria. Duh! I wonder if he will do anything in the 200 back. He didn't look as good in Beijing as he did in Athens where he got the silver in the 200 back.

ande
July 28th, 2009, 12:18 PM
200 fr

1 4 BIEDERMANN Paul GER 0.81
(1) 24.23
(1) 50.12 25.89
(1) 1:16.30 26.18
1:42.00 25.70 WR


2 3 PHELPS Michael USA 0.68 (2)
24.38 (2) 50.25 (2) 1:16.71 1:43.22 1.22
25.87 26.46 26.51

3 5 IZOTOV Danila RUS 0.60 (5) 24.78 (4) 51.24 (3) 1:17.58 1:43.90 1.90
26.46 26.34 26.32

ande
July 28th, 2009, 12:30 PM
Berens suit rip (http://www.examiner.com/x-17367-Miami-Celebrity-Headlines-Examiner~y2009m7d28-Gold-medalist-rips-swimsuit-bares-butt-to-the-world)

another article (http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/sports/ricky-berens-split-swimsuit-embarrassment-getting-to-the-bottom-of-the-problem_100224154.html)

pwolf66
July 28th, 2009, 12:30 PM
Once again proof that the dolphin kick in breast needs to go.

At the start of the 2nd semi of 50 breast, Van der Burgh actually COMPLETED his dolphin kick before his hands or arms started to move.

Ah well.

Muppet
July 28th, 2009, 01:08 PM
Once again proof that the dolphin kick in breast needs to go.

At the start of the 2nd semi of 50 breast, Van der Burgh actually COMPLETED his dolphin kick before his hands or arms started to move.

Ah well.

i was wondering if anyone else saw that too.

tjrpatt
July 28th, 2009, 01:15 PM
Pellagrini's neck tattoo is awful.

knelson
July 28th, 2009, 01:47 PM
I thought every women's freestyle record would go down at this meet. Ziegler's 1500 withstanding this assault really says a lot about that swim. She swam that 15:42 at a mid-season meet. I really hope she can return to form some day.

Jazz Hands
July 28th, 2009, 01:59 PM
Rowdy Gaines is an idiot. He keeps saying this line about stroke 50s. "They aren't Olympic events so they are worthless." Non sequitur. One time he followed that right up by saying how exciting the women's 1500 is and how it should be an Olympic event because it's so great. But not those 50s. Sprinters are not even real swimmers, you know.

Muppet
July 28th, 2009, 02:07 PM
Rowdy Gaines is an idiot. He keeps saying this line about stroke 50s. "They aren't Olympic events so they are worthless." Non sequitur. One time he followed that right up by saying how exciting the women's 1500 is and how it should be an Olympic event because it's so great. But not those 50s. Sprinters are not even real swimmers, you know.

It also doesn't make any sense. He's a sprinter himself, and you think he'd like the additional opportunity for like-minded folks.
Looking at his top 10 history, he is 1996's #1 50 Flyer in 35-39.

kristilynn
July 28th, 2009, 02:08 PM
Once again proof that the dolphin kick in breast needs to go.

At the start of the 2nd semi of 50 breast, Van der Burgh actually COMPLETED his dolphin kick before his hands or arms started to move.

Ah well.

I saw that too. I also thought that he took an extra scull into the finish. Did anyone notice that?

knelson
July 28th, 2009, 02:12 PM
I saw that too. I also thought that he took an extra scull into the finish. Did anyone notice that?

That would be OK as long as he didn't pull twice without a kick in between.

pwolf66
July 28th, 2009, 02:14 PM
Yeah, out of cycle is ok at the turn or the finish, so that's fine.

swimcat
July 28th, 2009, 02:33 PM
Pellagrini's neck tattoo is awful.
she gets a new tatoo every time she sets a world record, according to OGGI magazine.
she's gonna run out of space

ande
July 28th, 2009, 03:34 PM
wonder what she's gonna get now with her 1:53 200 free swim


she gets a new tatoo every time she sets a world record, according to OGGI magazine.
she's gonna run out of space

The Fortress
July 28th, 2009, 03:38 PM
Rowdy Gaines is an idiot. He keeps saying this line about stroke 50s. "They aren't Olympic events so they are worthless." Non sequitur. One time he followed that right up by saying how exciting the women's 1500 is and how it should be an Olympic event because it's so great. But not those 50s. Sprinters are not even real swimmers, you know.

Yeah, it's BS. 50s add excitement to the sport just like tech suits. But everyone seems extraordinarily attached to things that make the sport more boring.

Ian Smith
July 28th, 2009, 04:14 PM
50s add excitement to the sport just like tech suits. But everyone seems extraordinarily attached to things that make the sport more boring.

Totally! We can all go back to discussing the merits of nose clips while swimming in our government-issue Chairman Mao jammers.

tjrpatt
July 28th, 2009, 04:21 PM
she gets a new tatoo every time she sets a world record, according to OGGI magazine.
she's gonna run out of space

She breaks a world record like every other week. Pretty sure, she is going to look like Tommy Lee or Travis Barker!!!!!:)

Seriously, that look is not cute. I don't mind if the ladies get the "tramp stamp" on their lower back or some butterfly or flower crap on their leg. But, the neck thing is over the line in my opinion.

mctrusty
July 28th, 2009, 04:22 PM
Pellagrini's neck tattoo is awful.

Awfully sexy :).

tjrpatt
July 28th, 2009, 04:24 PM
Yeah, it's BS. 50s add excitement to the sport just like tech suits. But everyone seems extraordinarily attached to things that make the sport more boring.

I think that Rowdy is only saying that he likes the longer races. I think that only distance swimmers like watching distance races. I really enjoyed watching the men's 1500 at WCT. In my opinion, 50s aren't that interesting to watch.

The Fortress
July 28th, 2009, 04:33 PM
Totally! We can all go back to discussing the merits of nose clips while swimming in our government-issue Chairman Mao jammers.

And discussions may be it, since TV coverage may go out the window.

You may not like 50s, Tom, but swim spectators do. Just like they like watching the 100 meter dash in track.

bamueller
July 28th, 2009, 04:42 PM
She breaks a world record like every other week. Pretty sure, she is going to look like Tommy Lee or Travis Barker!!!!!:)

Seriously, that look is not cute. I don't mind if the ladies get the "tramp stamp" on their lower back or some butterfly or flower crap on their leg. But, the neck thing is over the line in my opinion.

Hahaha. The "tramp stamp."

Will she go with the Mike Tyson facial tatoos?

selkie
July 28th, 2009, 05:15 PM
I think 50s are usually pretty boring- all that splashing, take a scoreboard to tell who won. I find races (both track and swimming) that are about 45 seconds to two and a half minutes to be the most interesting.

Example: how the last 50 of a 200 fly is high drama to see who's about to die and who still has a little left in the tank.

Midas
July 28th, 2009, 06:43 PM
i was wondering if anyone else saw that too.

I saw it when Shanteau and Gangloff did it at nationals last month, days before I got DQ'd for doing the same thing (though I maintain my hands started to move simultaneously with my kick). What a joke. Is the video online somewhere?

smontanaro
July 28th, 2009, 08:22 PM
Pellagrini's neck tattoo is awful.

Well, the rest of her is umm... not too bad. I noticed that her website is a blank now. You can still get to front Flash splash though via the Wayback Machine (http://web.archive.org/web/20080206125834/http://www.federicapellegrini.com/).

S

pwolf66
July 29th, 2009, 06:00 PM
Once again proof that the dolphin kick in breast needs to go.

At the start of the 2nd semi of 50 breast, Van der Burgh actually COMPLETED his dolphin kick before his hands or arms started to move.

Ah well.


And he did it AGAIN in the final. I know it's hard to see from the deck but with only a single official per lane one would hope that a clear line of sight from the swimmers feet (witnessing the start of the DK) to the swimmers hands (observe if pull has started) would exist and that it would take less than .5 seconds (over the 1.1 seconds between the start of the kick and the start of the pulling action that I timed).

Or do I just not understand the rule as written?

Sigh. Ditch the DK or don't specify when it can be performed.

swimcat
July 29th, 2009, 06:44 PM
And he did it AGAIN in the final. I know it's hard to see from the deck but with only a single official per lane one would hope that a clear line of sight from the swimmers feet (witnessing the start of the DK) to the swimmers hands (observe if pull has started) would exist and that it would take less than .5 seconds (over the 1.1 seconds between the start of the kick and the start of the pulling action that I timed).

Or do I just not understand the rule as written?

Sigh. Ditch the DK or don't specify when it can be performed.

i need to watch this... i was told by my coach pull all the way down(like regular breaststroke,) when the hands pass the waist , initiate dolphin kick. as hand finish, slide hands underneath body (recovery) and initiate breaststroke kick
i know i sound confusing myself. let me watch the video

Midas
July 29th, 2009, 07:35 PM
i need to watch this... i was told by my coach pull all the way down(like regular breaststroke,) when the hands pass the waist , initiate dolphin kick. as hand finish, slide hands underneath body (recovery) and initiate breaststroke kick
i know i sound confusing myself. let me watch the video

Like I said, I got DQ'd for doing exactly what Van Der Berg did. I wouldn't recommend it for Masters swimmers. Judges have no fear calling this against us, even if they won't against the big dogs... I'm trying to relearn it the old way, which to me is extremely awkward...

By the way, big ups to Mark Gangloff for getting third in the 50!

scyfreestyler
July 29th, 2009, 07:37 PM
So completing the single dolphin kick before initiating the pull down is illegal?

tjrpatt
July 29th, 2009, 07:57 PM
This is all Kitijiama's fault for his cheating gold medal performance back in Athens.

Midas
July 29th, 2009, 08:03 PM
While I used to hate him too, I now respect Kitajima and chose to view him as an innovator. I really like the dolphin kick at the commencement of the pulldown. It's very natural. When I swim butterfly, I do a kick at the commencement of my pulldown so it translates over very easily...

Midas
July 29th, 2009, 08:04 PM
So completing the single dolphin kick before initiating the pull down is illegal?

Technically all you have to do is initiate your pulldown. Any real movement/separation of the hands is supposed to count. However, the judges don't seem to call the lack of separation/movement against the top dogs (or interpret movement VERY broadly).

Sorry to hijack the thread. Maybe I should start a new one...

pwolf66
July 30th, 2009, 07:23 AM
So completing the single dolphin kick before initiating the pull down is illegal?

No but starting the downward kick before you start your pull violates the current rules as written.

knelson
July 30th, 2009, 10:41 AM
No but starting the downward kick before you start your pull violates the current rules as written.

This is one of the things I think people might be confused on in the rules. I haven't watched the video from Worlds and maybe they are violating the rules, but everyone needs to realize it is OK to initiate the upward motion of the kick before the pull begins. It's the downward motion that must coincide with the start of the pull.

swimcat
July 30th, 2009, 11:36 AM
where can i watch this in slomo? i watched the video on universal but can't see deburgh? link plz.
btw, my first masters meet in 90 or 91,, i got dekked on a bk to br turn, i used the roll over which is legal but the judge said i dipped my shoulder . oh please. now i pratically stop at the wall to make sure i touch the right way, what a waste of time. high schoolers can do flips from back to breast. wish we could.

Muppet
July 30th, 2009, 11:58 AM
Pellegrini's neck tattoo is awful.

I like it. It's a bit large, but I think it is simple and elegant - far from the obnoxious Tommy Lee/Travis Barker versions by comparison.

Luca Marin is apparently a fan of hot girls with tats - and I think he's upgraded. Federica's predecessor, Laure Manaudou, she's got that lizard at her hip... not exactly a welcoming-looking creature for that area...:banana::banana:

thewookiee
July 30th, 2009, 11:58 AM
high schoolers can do flips from back to breast. wish we could.

No they can't. That rule was changed. They have to follow usa/fina rules on back to breast now. This is done so that hs swims can be certified if a swimmers makes a usa meet cut.

Jazz Hands
July 30th, 2009, 12:24 PM
Another complaint re Rowdy Gaines. I don't think he understands the track/grab start trade-off. He always reads the reaction times and says some swimmer or another has a "terrible start" when they are actually just using a grab start, sacrificing reaction time for power.

Other Rowdy cliches: "powerful kick" (always with telestrator), "crucial turns", direction of breathing, and "clear water."

Ian Smith
July 30th, 2009, 12:35 PM
Another complaint re Rowdy Gaines. I don't think he understands the track/grab start trade-off. He always reads the reaction times and says some swimmer or another has a "terrible start" when they are actually just using a grab start, sacrificing reaction time for power.


Is "reaction time" the time between the gun and when your feet leave the block?

If so, wouldn't tall swimmers tend to have slower reaction times? - their hands/body could be ahead of other swimmers while their feet are still on the blocks making their reaction time slower.

tjrpatt
July 30th, 2009, 12:56 PM
I like it. It's a bit large, but I think it is simple and elegant - far from the obnoxious Tommy Lee/Travis Barker versions by comparison.

Luca Marin is apparently a fan of hot girls with tats - and I think he's upgraded. Federica's predecessor, Laure Manaudou, she's got that lizard at her hip... not exactly a welcoming-looking creature for that area...:banana::banana:

I think that I remember that hip tattoo from her pics on the net. Manaudou does have a 8 pack abs.

tjrpatt
July 30th, 2009, 12:57 PM
I am glad that Lochte showed Laslo and Thiago who is boss in the 200 IM. Shanteau has such an amazing backhalf of the IM. I would hate to be his competitors in the 200 breast. They are in the swimming beatdown.

swimsuit addict
July 30th, 2009, 01:19 PM
In the prelims of the men's 200 BR, 4 swimmers from the fastest 3 heats were DQed. Anyone know what these were for?

DPC
July 30th, 2009, 01:19 PM
Great for Lochte - what a sweet swim, led wire to wire - didn't even seem to be breathing heavily after, must be the laid back attitude even his breathing isn't in a hurry.

knelson
July 30th, 2009, 02:45 PM
Is "reaction time" the time between the gun and when your feet leave the block?

If so, wouldn't tall swimmers tend to have slower reaction times? - their hands/body could be ahead of other swimmers while their feet are still on the blocks making their reaction time slower.


Yes, that's how it's measured. The real reason to have this at all, of course, is to judge relay takeoffs automatically.

You're probably right about taller swimmers having slower reaction times. You can't really leave the block until your body is fully extended, after all, and it stands to reason taller swimmers will take longer to do this since they've got more distance to cover to become fully extended.

Yeah, purely using reaction time to judge someone's start is about as useful as evaluating a baseball player's offensive contribution by only stating his batting average.

swimcat
July 30th, 2009, 02:47 PM
pellegrini openly blamed teammates for not placing in relay. she says she and filippi couldnt pull the weight for all of them.
i don't think anybody was gonna to beat china.

knelson
July 30th, 2009, 02:54 PM
i don't think anybody was gonna to beat china.

China won with their consistency. Unfortunately the U.S. team had a (relatively speaking, of course) weak swimmer in Nymeyer. If Hoff had been on her game at Trials the U.S. could have beaten them.

ande
July 30th, 2009, 03:38 PM
In the 2004 olympics kitajima dolphin kicked as he completed his pull down, with hands & arms next to his side, he later changed & started doing it before his pull down while his arms were still streamlined. The rules changed saying that there had to be some arm motion & a slight parting of the hands sufficed

some breastrokers take a dolphin kick on their dive in the bubbles, where officials can't see


While I used to hate him too, I now respect Kitajima and chose to view him as an innovator. I really like the dolphin kick at the commencement of the pulldown. It's very natural. When I swim butterfly, I do a kick at the commencement of my pulldown so it translates over very easily...

tjrpatt
July 30th, 2009, 04:40 PM
China won with their consistency. Unfortunately the U.S. team had a (relatively speaking, of course) weak swimmer in Nymeyer. If Hoff had been on her game at Trials the U.S. could have beaten them.

Maybe find another good 200 freeer and really forget about Hoff. Just remember, when she was on the 4 x 200 relay in Beijing, they got 3rd. Vollmer, Schmitty, and Kukors are great together. They just need to find that fourth person to solve the puzzle. Maybe it will be Coughlin, who knows. Those three girls really brought some light back to the US 4 x 200 relay. :applaud:

orca1946
July 30th, 2009, 04:55 PM
Great swims & the talk of the suit !!

tjrpatt
July 30th, 2009, 05:15 PM
It was great to see 28 year old Hehn almost make the finals of the 200 breast. Gosh, remember when breaststrokers used to burn out at 18. Heck, I initially thought that Beard and Megan Jendrick were in that category until their comebacks. It is great for someone to reach their peak at 28.

ehoch
July 30th, 2009, 05:42 PM
Is there any chance those crazy Russians will upset the US tomorrow in the 800 Free relay ? The top 2 guys are certainly right there -- they had a blistering 400 Free relay and the Russians often come through with great relay swims (as do the Americans ...) ?

selkie
July 30th, 2009, 06:57 PM
Speculation on cs.com is that the Americans might have done better putting Julia Smit (1:56 last year, nice 100M free this meet) on the 4x200 instead of Nymeyer

knelson
July 30th, 2009, 07:04 PM
Speculation on cs.com is that the Americans might have done better putting Julia Smit (1:56 last year, nice 100M free this meet) on the 4x200 instead of Nymeyer

Yeah, but Smit didn't even break 2:00 at Trials. Nymeyer earned her way on with her prelims split. It was the right call.

Frank Thompson
July 30th, 2009, 07:06 PM
Is there any chance those crazy Russians will upset the US tomorrow in the 800 Free relay ? The top 2 guys are certainly right there -- they had a blistering 400 Free relay and the Russians often come through with great relay swims (as do the Americans ...) ?

I don't think so. I think they had more depth in there 400 Free Relay swimmers than they do in there 800 Free Relay swimmers. You are correct that there top 2 guys are very close to our top 2 guys. Izotov improved his 200 Free time from Beijing from a 1:45. 85 to a 1:43.90 and Lobintsev improved his time from a 1:46.64 to a 1:45.31 this year. Sukhorukov has gone 1:44.65 in a relay but has not swam as well as last year. There 4th guy Lagunov has gone 1:46.46.

With Phelps at 1:43.22 and Walters at 1:44.95 gun starts, I give the those 2 legs about 1.25 advantage and that is being very conservative. For them to have a chance to win they would have to go 6:58 and to get there they would need a 1:43 and 3 guys in the 1:45 for splits. It very possible they will do that but I think the USA will go 6:55 tomorrow for a 3 second improvement from Beijing.

It will be interesting to see if Ryan Lochte will swim the morning preliminary heats. Traditionally the 3rd - 6th place swimmers from trials swim with the 1st and 2nd swimming finals only. But because of the 200 Back final tomorrow night, I think the coaches will pass on him in the morning and swim, Walters, Berens, Tarwater, and Vanderkaay. They will take the fastest swimmers out of these 4 plus what they think Ryan could do and those will be the swimmers that swim with Phelps in the final.

With the way Ryan has been swimming, I think he will be on the relay in the finals. My hunch is that VDK, Berens, and Walters will battle it out for the last 2 spots. Tarwater would have to beat all of them to make it. They might have the same relay as last year. I think all of these swimmers are swimming faster than last year and you could actually have 3 swimmers in a LZR (Phelps, VDK, Lochte) and one swimmer in a Jacked. Even with this I give the USA a 2 second advantage to beat the Russians.

At the 2008 Olympics, the Russians were 5.14 seconds behind at 7:03.70 and they will see improvement in the 6:58 range. USA went 6:58.56 in Beijing and I can see a 2 to 3 second improvement for a new World Record.

KeithM
July 30th, 2009, 07:45 PM
Yeah, but Smit didn't even break 2:00 at Trials. Nymeyer earned her way on with her prelims split. It was the right call. It's hindsight in my opinion so can't fault the decision too much. Especially since it wasn't an obvious call there. Nymeyer is an experienced relay swimmer. However I'm not of the belief that people earn spots on relays. Coaches should always go with who they believe will make up the fastest quartet. Smit's time at trials was misleading since that was a case of conserving and miscalculating. I don't think Grevers should lead off the 100 back because Aaron misjudges his heat earlier.


Is there any chance those crazy Russians will upset the US tomorrow in the 800 Free relay ? The top 2 guys are certainly right there -- they had a blistering 400 Free relay and the Russians often come through with great relay swims (as do the Americans ...) ? Even if the U.S. wins it will not be a blowout like it has been the last several years. Lochte will be backing up from the 200 back final but he's done that before. He'll get much more time to swim off the lactic than Phelps though since the 200 back final is toward the beginning of the session. Michael won't be able to conserve too much over a shorter race like the 100 fly to finish in the top 8 given how fast this meet has been. Much will depend on how things go in the prelims. Walters is feeling much better and did more than a half sec pb in the 100. Two 47s after a 48.1 at trials. If he can at least do what he did a trials I think the US wins. PVK should be a little bit quicker. He dropped a couple seconds from trials in the 400. Berens will be a wild card too. If he puts in a great morning prelim (like in Santa Clara or better) the coaches will have some decisons to make. This Isotov kid could be the story by London rather than Biedermann or Phelps.

Muppet
July 30th, 2009, 07:49 PM
Berens will be a wild card too.

So too will be his swimsuit!

ehoch
July 30th, 2009, 07:51 PM
I know it won't happen - but I would LOVE to see Phelps put on a Jaked and drop a 1:41 in the lead off....

I think the US should win it - but they also can not afford any letdowns -- Phelps has a little bit of a history to go slower in this one. Walters should be swimming fast - but he swam "slow" TWICE earlier in the week.

selkie
July 30th, 2009, 07:52 PM
Rumor mill says that Walters got sick at training camp. He seems to have been doing better as the meet has gone along.

KeithM
July 30th, 2009, 07:58 PM
So too will be his swimsuit! Hopefully they'll be less chance of that happening in the 200! He did well given the circumstances.



I think the US should win it - but they also can not afford any letdowns -- Phelps has a little bit of a history to go slower in this one. Walters should be swimming fast - but he swam "slow" TWICE earlier in the week. He was still recovering on the back end of a tummy bug. It's why he was left completely out of 4x100 relay the first day. He didn't swim the heats or finals despite placing second at trials. But given how he rebounded for the 100 he could be a key guy for the relay.

tjrpatt
July 30th, 2009, 09:07 PM
Hopefully they'll be less chance of that happening in the 200! He did well given the circumstances.

He was still recovering on the back end of a tummy bug. It's why he was left completely out of 4x100 relay the first day. He didn't swim the heats or finals despite placing second at trials. But given how he rebounded for the 100 he could be a key guy for the relay.

I was wondering why Grevers was in the relay over Walters. He broke the American record so I think that Walters is pretty healthy.

hrietz
July 30th, 2009, 10:21 PM
Maybe find another good 200 freeer and really forget about Hoff. Just remember, when she was on the 4 x 200 relay in Beijing, they got 3rd. Vollmer, Schmitty, and Kukors are great together. They just need to find that fourth person to solve the puzzle. Maybe it will be Coughlin, who knows. Those three girls really brought some light back to the US 4 x 200 relay. :applaud:

UMMM...Katie Hoff had the fastest split on that relay by far (she was 1:54) so she was probably the primary reason that they even won a medal. Coughlin was a 1:57 and I believe that Burckle and Schmitt were also 1:57's. I don't think that Hoff should be written off. Unfortunately illness hit her too close to World Trials but I believe that she will be back and will be a major player in the 200 free! On the other hand, I can see Coughlin sticking to shorter events once she returns.

Rykno
July 31st, 2009, 08:05 AM
so who is in the final line up tonight for the mens 4x200?

Phelps, walters, Lochte and ??

Vanderkaay, Berens, someone else I am not thinking of????

I think the WR will go down tonight but I would love to see Phelps as leadoff swimmer and go under 1:42!!

swimming is between 18:00-19:30 my time, so I'll have to pick up something to keep my two girls happy for 90 minutes so I can watch all the fun races tonight!

That Guy
July 31st, 2009, 01:29 PM
so who is in the final line up tonight for the mens 4x200?

Phelps, walters, Lochte and ??

Vanderkaay, Berens, someone else I am not thinking of????

I think the WR will go down tonight but I would love to see Phelps as leadoff swimmer and go under 1:42!!

swimming is between 18:00-19:30 my time, so I'll have to pick up something to keep my two girls happy for 90 minutes so I can watch all the fun races tonight!

It's Berens there in the waiting room.

Atlantic
July 31st, 2009, 01:31 PM
GO SHANTEAU!

smontanaro
July 31st, 2009, 01:51 PM
Vanderkaay, Berens, someone else I am not thinking of????

Berens will certainly bring in the female viewers. :)

selkie
July 31st, 2009, 01:58 PM
Berens could rescue Michael Phelps and a basketfull of kittens from terrorists at this point, and he would still be known as the guy with the wardrobe failure in Rome in 2009.

Atlantic
July 31st, 2009, 01:58 PM
Andrea Kramer is really starting to tick Phelps off everytime she asks him about the "trashtalking" from Cavic.

knelson
July 31st, 2009, 02:04 PM
That was really a pretty ugly relay by the Americans and they need to thank Ricky Berens and Ryan Lochte big time. Phelps led off poorly and Walters swam a terrible race. His second 100 was seven seconds slower than his first. I didn't think Lochte looked great, but he did exactly what he needed to do and he has to be exhausted after the schedule he's had. I thought Berens looked great.

Atlantic
July 31st, 2009, 02:07 PM
That was really a pretty ugly relay by the Americans and they need to thank Ricky Berens and Ryan Lochte big time. Phelps led off poorly and Walters swam a terrible race. His second 100 was seven seconds slower than his first. I didn't think Lochte looked great, but he did exactly what he needed to do and he has to be exhausted after the schedule he's had. I thought Berens looked great.

It was an ugly relay. I think guys knew it too judging from their reaction at the finish. Walters just plain died and Lochte worried me at his halfway mark... but he really got up and raced the last 50.

swimcat
July 31st, 2009, 02:08 PM
berens did the job.
heck, trash talking gets mp going. my masters team even trash talks. usually it is the men doing most of it,

BillS
July 31st, 2009, 03:09 PM
Except for Berens' solid swim, that relay was ugly. Walters died like I do at the end of a 200. Lochte scared me for 150m, but when I saw his underwater kicking after the 150 turn and his first 3 strokes, I thought he was home free.

Notwithstanding his comment to Andrea afterward (something to the effect of "I have no idea -- tried to keep my head down and swim" when asked what he did to hold it together on the last 50), Ryan impresses me as a guy who really knows how to swim his own race. He obviously knew to keep enough in the tank to finish that last 50 strong. I thought that was especially impressive coming after the 200 back and with all the pressure from relatively weak legs from Phelps and Walters.

tjrpatt
July 31st, 2009, 06:13 PM
Cool, the world champs is the top search on Yahoo.

Syd
August 1st, 2009, 03:45 AM
The Dutch girl, Veldhuis... is her name Marleen or Magdalena? Or are they two different people. I am confused. Marleen has the world record but Magdalena came fourth in the heats.:confused:

smontanaro
August 1st, 2009, 07:13 AM
Looks like her given name is Magdalena and her nickname is Marleen:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marleen_Veldhuis

Syd
August 1st, 2009, 09:59 AM
Looks like her given name is Magdalena and her nickname is Marleen:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marleen_Veldhuis


Thanks. :) Should have thought to Wiki it.

Robert Strand
August 1st, 2009, 10:09 AM
Our girls don't make final in the 400 medley relay swimming our second tier swimmers-that is just great. Man, Soni has got to be just pissed. Her meet sure turned upside down. The coaches have to feel awful. With the consistant level of the other teams I think we needed more fire power. Little bit of an ego trip for us. Those days in international swimming are gone. Carlson went a high 1:06 where as Soni alone would have picked us up 1 1/2 seconds which would have done the trick easily. To bad.

hofffam
August 1st, 2009, 10:31 AM
Our girls don't make final in the 400 medley relay swimming our second tier swimmers-that is just great. Man, Soni has got to be just pissed. Her meet sure turned upside down. The coaches have to feel awful. With the consistant level of the other teams I think we needed more fire power. Little bit of an ego trip for us. Those days in international swimming are gone. Carlson went a high 1:06 where as Soni alone would have picked us up 1 1/2 seconds which have done the trick easily. To bad.

It really pisses me off when the coaches underestimate the competition. there is really no reason for this to happen.

The USA team didn't final at the World Championships! I feel like shouting that to the entire coaching staff.

tjrpatt
August 1st, 2009, 10:38 AM
Well, they got more work to do. They almost have their 800 relay straighten out. Now, they need to get their 400 relays in gear.

ande
August 1st, 2009, 01:53 PM
Men's 100m Butterfly Final
13th FINA WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS
17 JULY - 2 AUGUST 2009
ROME (ITA)
Record Split Name NOC Code Location Date
WR 50.01 22.83 CAVIC Milorad SRB Roma (ITA) 31 JUL 2009
CR 50.01 22.83 CAVIC Milorad SRB Roma (ITA) 31 JUL 2009

1 5 PHELPS Michael USA 0.69 (4)
23.36 26.46 49.82 WR

2 4 CAVIC Milorad SRB 0.72 (1) 22.69 49.95 0.13
27.26
3 3 MUNOZ Rafael ESP 0.70 (2) 23.24 50.41 0.59
27.17
4 6 SUBIRATS Albert VEN 0.68 (6) 23.75 50.79 0.97
27.04
5 1 LAUTERSTEIN Andrew AUS 0.70 (3) 23.28 50.85 1.03
27.57
6 2 DUNFORD Jason KEN 0.72 (5) 23.41 51.07 1.25
27.66
7 8 MCGILL Tyler USA 0.68 (8) 24.14 51.42 1.60
27.28
8 7 MANGABEIRA Gabriel BRA 0.67 (7) 23.80 51.74 1.92
27.94

Salnikov22
August 1st, 2009, 01:55 PM
VIDEO: 100m Butterfly final (http://vinovo.magnify.net/video/Phelps-vs-Cavic-100m-Butterfly)

Phelps WR

Warren
August 1st, 2009, 02:02 PM
Who is going to swim the free leg for the medley relay tomorrow?

Walters did better in the 100 free than Adrian. But Adrian had a great split in the freestyle relay.

That Guy
August 1st, 2009, 02:22 PM
Phelps took 17 strokes down and 18 back. I take 19 or 20 on my first 50 and (guessing because I don't remember) 24 or 25 on the second... then again, I'm 8 inches shorter than him, and the word "wingspan" does not apply to me...

I watched the whole 2 hour broadcast on NBC, and don't recall seeing a single shot of Bowman, nor do I recall hearing mention of him.

Jazz Hands
August 1st, 2009, 02:31 PM
Who is going to swim the free leg for the medley relay tomorrow?

Walters did better in the 100 free than Adrian. But Adrian had a great split in the freestyle relay.

I'd put Walters on it. He was only 0.54 off Adrian's split. Either one would do great, and it should be a solid win unless something goes wrong.

rodent
August 1st, 2009, 03:53 PM
Men's 100m Butterfly Final
13th FINA WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS
17 JULY - 2 AUGUST 2009
ROME (ITA)
Record Split Name NOC Code Location Date
WR 50.01 22.83 CAVIC Milorad SRB Roma (ITA) 31 JUL 2009
CR 50.01 22.83 CAVIC Milorad SRB Roma (ITA) 31 JUL 2009

1 5 PHELPS Michael USA 0.69 (4)
23.36 26.46 49.82 WR

2 4 CAVIC Milorad SRB 0.72 (1) 22.69 49.95 0.13
27.26
3 3 MUNOZ Rafael ESP 0.70 (2) 23.24 50.41 0.59
27.17
4 6 SUBIRATS Albert VEN 0.68 (6) 23.75 50.79 0.97
27.04
5 1 LAUTERSTEIN Andrew AUS 0.70 (3) 23.28 50.85 1.03
27.57
6 2 DUNFORD Jason KEN 0.72 (5) 23.41 51.07 1.25
27.66
7 8 MCGILL Tyler USA 0.68 (8) 24.14 51.42 1.60
27.28
8 7 MANGABEIRA Gabriel BRA 0.67 (7) 23.80 51.74 1.92
27.94
Something Cavic said after the race was interesting, he said that at the 50 he saw how close Phelps was to him and knew he was going to lose. He was almost .7 seconds in front of Phelps.
1. In a 100M race against the best swimmer in the world, how can anyone expect to have an insurmountable lead at the 50? You have to be able swim the whole race hard.
2. I think that Cavic's loss in the Olympics had to be on his mind every day since then, causing him to make some rash comments earlier this week.
3. If Cavic feels that he needs more than .7 seconds lead at the 50 to beat Phelps and swims the second 50 of the 100 fly waiting and expecting Phelps to sprint by him at the end, he is NEVER going to beat Phelps.
4. Cavic has better speed than Phelps but until he can hold that speed until the end, Phelps will have his number. :2cents:

tjrpatt
August 1st, 2009, 05:41 PM
Did the Brazilian guy get emotional again on the medal stands for the 50? Too lazy to find that clip. Brett Hawke did a good job with Cesar and Bousquet. From the clips I saw of Cesar on floswimming, it seems like Cesar busts his hump at practice.

Mark Savage
August 1st, 2009, 06:16 PM
Phelps took 17 strokes down and 18 back. I take 19 or 20 on my first 50 and (guessing because I don't remember) 24 or 25 on the second... then again, I'm 8 inches shorter than him, and the word "wingspan" does not apply to me...

I watched the whole 2 hour broadcast on NBC, and don't recall seeing a single shot of Bowman, nor do I recall hearing mention of him.

Yep- no sign of Bowman

Mark Savage
August 1st, 2009, 06:21 PM
Something Cavic said after the race was interesting, he said that at the 50 he saw how close Phelps was to him and knew he was going to lose. He was almost .7 seconds in front of Phelps.
1. In a 100M race against the best swimmer in the world, how can anyone expect to have an insurmountable lead at the 50? You have to be able swim the whole race hard.
2. I think that Cavic's loss in the Olympics had to be on his mind every day since then, causing him to make some rash comments earlier this week.
3. If Cavic feels that he needs more than .7 seconds lead at the 50 to beat Phelps and swims the second 50 of the 100 fly waiting and expecting Phelps to sprint by him at the end, he is NEVER going to beat Phelps.
4. Cavic has better speed than Phelps but until he can hold that speed until the end, Phelps will have his number. :2cents:

Cavic reminds me of Crocker with that initial sheer speed. Phelps' power and endurance for the last 5-10 meters never ceases to amaze.

Syd
August 2nd, 2009, 12:37 AM
Lots of good racing to look forward to on the final day.

I am wondering what the 1500 record is going to look like at the end of the day. Likewise the mens and women's 400IM. Will Lochte get the 400 IM WR, too? He has a good chance. And has Dara being saving herself up? Is she going to surprise us in the 50 free?

KeithM
August 2nd, 2009, 02:04 AM
I think the 400IM will come down to Hosszu and Coventry. The Hungarian girl was my firm favorite but after Coventry's 200 back I'll make Hosszu my slight favorite. I think Rice, Miley, and Beisel will battle for the bronze. Rice had a good 200IM but struggled a bit in the 200 and may be a bit discouraged but she'll be back.

I think Lochte will have a battle on his hands with Cseh. I think if Lochte swims it smartly and just stays with him the first 200 he can make his move on the breast. Cseh set a good pb in the 200IM so expect him to faster than Beijing. The 1500 will come down to a battle between Zhang and Ous again. I think Cochrane takes the bronze again. Steffen who always paces the heats well should win the 50. Peirsol will be chasing down the WR time he set at Indy on the lead-off of the relay assuming they don't botch the prelims like women's medley.

Rykno
August 2nd, 2009, 06:19 AM
Yep- no sign of Bowman

Bowman and phelps were side by side in the swedish interview after the 100 fly. bowmans only comment was how that was phelps' fastest opening 50 and how en knew then that he would go under :50.

Jazz Hands
August 2nd, 2009, 12:09 PM
Aussie announcers? Okay.

orca1946
August 2nd, 2009, 01:42 PM
What a great meet for the world to see our sport. I wonder if this will bring more to our teams this fall like the Olympics did ?

tjrpatt
August 2nd, 2009, 03:45 PM
The speed work that Phelps did in the last 6 months really benefited his 100 fly. Now, if the meet was a few months later, He might have had the endurance to meet Biedermann. He was really struggling in the 400 at Santa Clara. Distance swimmer Ryan Cochrane almost got him.

He is still far ahead of everyone in the 400 IM. Good job to Tyler Clary on his silver medal finish. Lazlo must be getting sick of getting beat by American. What happened to the Brazilian guy? I think that maybe he didn't have the training for this meet. I remember him saying at Charlotte that he was out of the water for a while for some injury.

I am so bummed that Biesel didn't medal in the 400 IM. Gosh, Rice and Coventry have totally lost their stanglehold on the IMs. Plus, if Kukors is still on fire without the suits, maybe she could be a major threat in the 400 IM as well.

Fishy
August 2nd, 2009, 04:29 PM
"Lazlo must be getting sick of getting beat by American."

Well, he did get sick...on the way to Rome from Hungary. They rushed with him to a hospital straight from the airport...40 Celsius fever, Diarrhea,etc.
He got infusions and stuff.
It was questionable if he can compete in Rome at all. He skipped 200 Butterfly to rest more. In Beijing he almost beat Phelps on 200 Butterfly. 5 meters more and Cseh would have got the Gold.
Oh well, there is always another Olypics and WC...

That Guy
August 2nd, 2009, 04:46 PM
"Lazlo must be getting sick of getting beat by American."

Well, he did get sick...on the way to Rome from Hungary. They rushed with him to a hospital straight from the airport...40 Celsius fever, Diarrhea,etc.
He got infusions and stuff.
It was questionable if he can compete in Rome at all. He skipped 200 Butterfly to rest more. In Beijing he almost beat Phelps on 200 Butterfly. 5 meters more and Cseh would have got the Gold.
Oh well, there is always another Olypics and WC...

I was wondering why he pulled out of the 200 fly. I'm glad he recovered in time for his other events. Thanks for the info!

Fishy
August 2nd, 2009, 04:56 PM
Well, he "recovered" enough to be able to swim but obviously not enough to win. 400 IM was his to win...
He said in an interview that the sickness threw him back. He will never tell this to the international press as he is a very modest guy.

tjrpatt
August 2nd, 2009, 05:41 PM
"Lazlo must be getting sick of getting beat by American."

Well, he did get sick...on the way to Rome from Hungary. They rushed with him to a hospital straight from the airport...40 Celsius fever, Diarrhea,etc.
He got infusions and stuff.
It was questionable if he can compete in Rome at all. He skipped 200 Butterfly to rest more. In Beijing he almost beat Phelps on 200 Butterfly. 5 meters more and Cseh would have got the Gold.
Oh well, there is always another Olypics and WC...

Well, Lochte got sick before the 400 IM in Beijing and had to do the 200 IM 20 minutes after winning the 200 back gold. Now, they just need to compete against each other without the sickness and time management issues. I was wondering why he was swimming so Lazlo in the IMs and skipped the 2-fly.

The Fortress
August 2nd, 2009, 05:57 PM
I'm just so relieved that Soni's 50 breaststroke wasn't "worthless." ;)

KeithM
August 2nd, 2009, 06:49 PM
Ooh look some buts and ifs


400 IM was his to win...
Well that's one view. Another view is that he was good enough to go a personal best time many days ago in the 200IM so one might think on the last day of the meet he would be game for the 400IM. Let's not forget Lochte is still the 2nd fastest all time in this event so I'm not sure where you get the notion that the race was "his to win" as if Cseh has assumed superiority in this race.




It was questionable if he can compete in Rome at all. He skipped 200 Butterfly to rest more. In Beijing he almost beat Phelps on 200 Butterfly. 5 meters more and Cseh would have got the Gold. Likewise if Phelps didn't have his goggles fill up with water your scenario would be moot anyway. Given how he improved his other 2007 records he may have been 1:50. Cseh at his best is capable of competing against and potentially beating Lochte at his best. That's not true of Phelps in the 200 fly if both are "on." What ifs ... butt sniffs! Ever heard of the Australian outback town of Koodabeen? Maybe you can drop in some time!

tjrpatt
August 2nd, 2009, 06:50 PM
I'm just so relieved that Soni's 50 breaststroke wasn't "worthless." ;)

Me too. Those last 30 meters of the 200 breast looked painful.

The Fortress
August 2nd, 2009, 06:51 PM
What ifs ... butt sniffs! Ever heard of the Australian outback town of Koodabeen? Maybe you can drop in some time!

It's good sh*t like this that really helps the taper bitchies!

Lump
August 2nd, 2009, 08:27 PM
In Beijing he almost beat Phelps on 200 Butterfly. 5 meters more and Cseh would have got the Gold.


Well until there is a 205 Fly I guess he's SOL. I hate when people say this stuff...its a 200, not a 205, make your move earlier.

Allen Stark
August 2nd, 2009, 10:10 PM
I still can't believ the US doesn't race the 50s and so our 100 swimmers double up.Soni did great,but Bal held the 50 BK WR and should have had the chance to compete in it at trials.

tjrpatt
August 3rd, 2009, 08:05 AM
I still can't believ the US doesn't race the 50s and so our 100 swimmers double up.Soni did great,but Bal held the 50 BK WR and should have had the chance to compete in it at trials.

If they aren't going to race the 50s, at least use the first 50s splits of the 100s stroke. Why does Torres get to swim the 50 fly. She didn't do the 100 fly. But, Bal doesn't get to swim the 50 back. Different rules for different accomplished swimmers.

tjrpatt
August 3rd, 2009, 08:09 AM
I heard Rowdy said during the 1500 that you can't put the counters in the water for the longer distances. Why did FINA ever make this rule? Thank god, it is still legal in the US. The last thing I want to do when I do an 800 or 1500 is figured out what lap I am on. Just ridiculous. Put the gosh darn counters in the pool for Pete's sake!!!!! So, for the people that are going to Sweden next year, they have to be their own counter on the 1500 and 800???

cjquill
August 3rd, 2009, 09:24 AM
For the 800M in Munich (2000 Worlds) there were counters assigned to each lane - you weren't allowed to bring your own. Since the cards were on the deck I lifted my head to site just like an open water race.

tjrpatt
August 3rd, 2009, 10:33 AM
For the 800M in Munich (2000 Worlds) there were counters assigned to each lane - you weren't allowed to bring your own. Since the cards were on the deck I lifted my head to site just like an open water race.

That sounds awful.

selkie
August 3rd, 2009, 10:42 AM
If they aren't going to race the 50s, at least use the first 50s splits of the 100s stroke. Why does Torres get to swim the 50 fly. She didn't do the 100 fly. But, Bal doesn't get to swim the 50 back. Different rules for different accomplished swimmers.

Vollmer didn't enter (presumably because she otherwise had a pretty full dance card for the meet) and if one or both of the people from the stroke 100s doesn't want the entry, the spot rolls down to the swimmer with the highest world ranking in the stroke 50.

Ian Smith
August 3rd, 2009, 10:55 AM
I heard Rowdy said during the 1500 that you can't put the counters in the water for the longer distances. Why did FINA ever make this rule? Thank god, it is still legal in the US. The last thing I want to do when I do an 800 or 1500 is figured out what lap I am on. Just ridiculous. Put the gosh darn counters in the pool for Pete's sake!!!!! So, for the people that are going to Sweden next year, they have to be their own counter on the 1500 and 800???

Well, we can't have technological advances (like counters under the water) undermine the purity of the sport can we?

Records with underwater counters need to be asterisked. ;)

tjrpatt
August 3rd, 2009, 05:53 PM
Well, we can't have technological advances (like counters under the water) undermine the purity of the sport can we?

Records with underwater counters need to be asterisked. ;)

If Grant Hackett's records were done with counters under the water, then there is your first astericks. Does anyone know when this rule started? I guess that this has been around for a while but I didn't notice it until I got back into swimming and got into the distance events again.

Frank Thompson
August 3rd, 2009, 07:01 PM
If Grant Hackett's records were done with counters under the water, then there is your first astericks. Does anyone know when this rule started? I guess that this has been around for a while but I didn't notice it until I got back into swimming and got into the distance events again.

This rule has been in existence for at least 20 years. Every international meet that I have swam in, you could not put lap counters in the water. The timers ring a bell on the last 50 of a short course race and the last 100 of a long course race. My first international meet was in 1989 at the Pan Pacific Championships and this is where I first experienced this.

FINA details this in there rule book in SW 2.6 titled Inspectors of Turns and lap counters are not permitted to be used for under water display. However, semi electronic equipment may be used for under display. I think the main point behind the rule is that they don't want someone inter fearing with the the Inspector of Turns.

knelson
August 4th, 2009, 11:34 AM
So, for the people that are going to Sweden next year, they have to be their own counter on the 1500 and 800???

There's only an 800, no 1500.

It's not really that big of a deal. You can count in practice without someone putting a counter in the water, right?

thewookiee
August 4th, 2009, 11:44 AM
There's only an 800, no 1500.

It's not really that big of a deal. You can count in practice without someone putting a counter in the water, right?

Yes, but some of us lose count after the 300. If you a distance speed stud like Tom, he will be done with the race before he knows it. If you are a distance sloth like geek,they will use a sun dial to do the timing.

selkie
August 4th, 2009, 12:06 PM
There usually is a way to sneak a look at the official timing system clock while you're in the water at some point in the pool. You should be able to figure out that at time X, you've probably done distance Y.

ande
November 9th, 2009, 12:58 PM
FINA Announces Record Number of European Viewers for World Championships (http://www.swimmingworldmagazine.com/lane9/news/22602.asp?q=FINA%20Announces%20Record%20Number%20o f%20European%20Viewers%20for%20World%20Championshi ps)

pwb
November 9th, 2009, 03:58 PM
It's not really that big of a deal. You can count in practice without someone putting a counter in the water, right?

Actually, no. That's why I rarely swim over a 500 in workout ... too taxing for my simple mind.

ehoch
November 9th, 2009, 05:43 PM
Don't these silly Euros realize that this was the worst thing that ever happened to swimming ?

This championship was close to destroying the swim sport - nobody wants to see all these records being broken by a bunch of cheaters. I am so glad that we can now go back to the 90s and before - I just wish we could also eliminate the dolphin kicks and turn back to the old backstroke turns.

:bump:

ande
November 25th, 2009, 12:35 PM
FINA Worlds: Best swimming photos (http://www.universalsports.com/photos/galleryid=363543.html)

tjrpatt
November 25th, 2009, 01:12 PM
There's only an 800, no 1500.

It's not really that big of a deal. You can count in practice without someone putting a counter in the water, right?

I think that there is something different about counting in a race than counting in practice. I have been able to keep track of my yardage at a recent 30 minutes swim at practice. I guess that I will have to test out solo counting at a 500 for one of our local Masters meets in January.

tjrpatt
November 25th, 2009, 01:14 PM
Yes, but some of us lose count after the 300. If you a distance speed stud like Tom, he will be done with the race before he knows it.

:rofl:

ande
May 6th, 2010, 11:10 PM
under water footage of Loris Facci (http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000015950002&ref=search&sid=7921551.505306868..1#!/video/video.php?v=1346857443395&ref=mf)