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lenchner_j
October 16th, 2009, 09:03 AM
I have trouble flipping directly over and landing on my back for the push off. I usually flip diagonally and do an immediate corskscrew type of push-off. Are there exercises (possibly using some sort of swimming gadget) that can help me correct this flip turn flaw? -Jon

smontanaro
October 16th, 2009, 09:24 AM
Some thoughts:

How bent are your legs when you flip/tumble? If you tend to flip with fairly straight knees something as simple as tightening up your tuck might help.
Do you have trouble when doing backstroke flip turns? Maybe try coming off the wall doing backstroke as a drill.
Where are your hands? They should be at your side. If not, maybe they are compensating for some other balance isse.
Are your feet close together during your flip? If so, try keeping them about shoulder width apart. That might make the upside down position (when your legs are out of the water) more stable and have less tendency to fall to one side or the other.


Skip

notsofast
October 16th, 2009, 11:36 AM
I've had a similar problem. I corrected it by focusing on the 'T' at the bottom of the pool as I began the flip. Don't know why that helped, but it did.

__steve__
October 16th, 2009, 05:19 PM
Video yourself so you can see and experience where your going wrong. I will be getting my camera sometime soon - my turns are likely worst than anyones... except for The EEL's turn:afraid:

swim4me
October 16th, 2009, 05:26 PM
I also do a corkscrew type of turn - the way I was taught in the 70's. Why is it now preferred to flip straight and then turn on your belly? For me it seems to be slower. :fish2:

smontanaro
October 16th, 2009, 06:52 PM
Why is it now preferred to flip straight and then turn on your belly? For me it seems to be slower. :fish2:

I suppose it depends on when you roll over. We were just working on flip turns at practice last night. Flip straight over (really, tumble is more like it), push off, then while doing your streamline dolphin kicks roll back over onto your stomach.

Skip

swim4me
October 16th, 2009, 10:18 PM
I suppose it depends on when you roll over. We were just working on flip turns at practice last night. Flip straight over (really, tumble is more like it), push off, then while doing your streamline dolphin kicks roll back over onto your stomach.

Skip

What I am trying to ask, is why is that type of flip turn faster than the corkscrew type?

Allen Stark
October 16th, 2009, 10:34 PM
I also do a corkscrew type of turn - the way I was taught in the 70's. Why is it now preferred to flip straight and then turn on your belly? For me it seems to be slower. :fish2:
Done perfectly the corkscrew is not necessarily slower,but it is very easy to have some hesitation as you push off.If you can do it without hesitation,great,but that is a very common flaw that I see frequently at meets.

swim4me
October 17th, 2009, 11:04 AM
Done perfectly the corkscrew is not necessarily slower,but it is very easy to have some hesitation as you push off.If you can do it without hesitation,great,but that is a very common flaw that I see frequently at meets.

Thanks Allen, for me, I think the corkscrew is faster, today I tried the other way and it just isn't 'right'.:fish2:

Thrashing Slug
October 17th, 2009, 02:39 PM
I don't see any value in changing from a corkscrew to a straight tumble if you already have good turns. As long as you keep your knees together and get a tight streamline, there isn't any difference in speed. I think I'm actually faster when I come off the wall on my side instead of flipping upside down and waiting until after the push-off to turn face up. In fact I've gradually taught myself to turn that way on purpose, because it made me faster.

There are some definite benefits of a tilted turn, like the ability to see your competitors during a race, or your lanemates during a group swim.

lenchner_j
October 19th, 2009, 11:38 AM
Some thoughts:

How bent are your legs when you flip/tumble? If you tend to flip with fairly straight knees something as simple as tightening up your tuck might help.
Do you have trouble when doing backstroke flip turns? Maybe try coming off the wall doing backstroke as a drill.
Where are your hands? They should be at your side. If not, maybe they are compensating for some other balance isse.
Are your feet close together during your flip? If so, try keeping them about shoulder width apart. That might make the upside down position (when your legs are out of the water) more stable and have less tendency to fall to one side or the other.

Skip

Thanks for all the advise. My legs are sometimes bent, sometimes not too bent. If I think about it and tuck more, I seem to get better results.

My backstroke turns are horrible - each one an adventure. I have tried the drill of flipping into backstroke quite a bit - but tend to either pause, or double clutch, to make sure my legs plant properly on the wall.

My hands are not crazy busy like I've seen some swimmers, but not as quiet and by my sides as they should be, especially when I have to do a half stroke to get close enough to the wall to flip.

My legs are fairly close together - I will try your suggestion of spreading them slightly.

Jon