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View Full Version : Legal suits foe S C Nats in April



orca1946
January 11th, 2011, 07:09 PM
I am having a tough time about whether a Speedo Endurance jammers will be legal at Nats. It does not show up on any list that I have found as legal. Who will I need to contact to find out? Most of the legal FINA approved suits stop at size 34 or maybe 36. I need a 38 , what am I to do? I know lose more LBS, but really where do I look for a size 38 Legal jammer ?

Legal suits " FOR" S C Nats - sorry I did not proof it fast enough.

jaadams1
January 11th, 2011, 07:55 PM
I am having a tough time about whether a Speedo Endurance jammers will be legal at Nats. It does not show up on any list that I have found as legal. Who will I need to contact to find out? Most of the legall FINA approved suits stop at size 34 or maybe 36. I need a 38 , what am I to do? I know lose more LBS, but really where do I look for a size 38 Legal jammer ?

Legal suits " FOR" S C Nats - sorry I did not proof it fast enough.


Just because the specific suit or size is not listed on the FINA listing, doesn't mean it is banned from competition. The list was created for those "tech suits" out there, or at least the new 2010's versions and later. Shoot, you could swim in a pair of guys swim trunks at Nationals and it would be okay! :) Not that this is the best advice of course!! :D

orca1946
January 13th, 2011, 05:28 PM
I would sure hate to swim my P R in the 1,000 & them be D Q ed :badday:

Jeff Commings
January 14th, 2011, 11:43 AM
Any suit that goes from the hip to the knees and does not contain non-porous material (i.e. rubber, neoprene) is legal for any competition. Do not be concerned about not seeing the suit you wear on the FINA list.

You will not be disqualified for wearing a Speedo Endurance suit. If you are, I will swim the 1000 for you as an apology.

orca1946
January 14th, 2011, 01:22 PM
I'm not sure of the content in the Endurance. Maybe your time will be better than mine in the 1000, this would be a cool move for me.
Old - 65 for Nats - over weight, big bone & likes to eat! Masters for 23 years.

ElaineK
January 14th, 2011, 01:34 PM
I'm not sure of the content in the Endurance.

Speedo Endurance suits are 50% polyester/ 50%PBT (which is a type of long-lasting polyester). Believe me; no worries for you, Orca! I competed in my Speedo Endurance at Nationals and everybody was asking why I wasn't wearing a tech suit!

KEWebb18
January 14th, 2011, 05:13 PM
The Lycra suits are a little faster than the endurance suits, if you don't want to spend the $$$.

pwb
January 14th, 2011, 06:39 PM
I thought I had posted this earlier, but it didn't show up. Try a Yingfa jammer from geochuck at http://swimdownhill.com for $33 and fully FINA approved. I'll admit to not having raced yet in mine (I will on Jan 22nd), but the dry fit is way better than an Endurance suit and tighter than a lycra suit like an Aquablade. Out of the water, the feel approaches my current favorite racing suit, TYR Tracer Light ($105 @ swimoutlet). If it feels great in the water and close to the TYR suit, it'll likely become my racing suit of choice.

I used to be able to justify spending the money of body suits, but have a hard time thinking there's value in a $150 -> $300 jammer.

orca1946
January 15th, 2011, 04:23 PM
I'm not spending big $:2cents:$$:2cents:$$$ on jammers !
Thanx Elaine:applaud: for the content & nats wear .
That is what I wanted to know. :banana:
I will look into Yangfa from George.:anim_coffee:

ElaineK
January 15th, 2011, 09:48 PM
I'm not spending big $:2cents:$$:2cents:$$$ on jammers !
Thanx Elaine:applaud: for the content & nats wear .
That is what I wanted to know. :banana:
I will look into Yangfa from George.:anim_coffee:

Your welcome! I'll look for you at Nats.; it would be fun to meet you and cheer you on! :cheerleader:

orca1946
January 17th, 2011, 03:11 PM
Meeting you will be fun! :banana:
We seem to cross paths a lot on these forums :bump:

ElaineK
January 17th, 2011, 09:00 PM
Meeting you will be fun! :banana:
We seem to cross paths a lot on these forums :bump:

:welcome: :wave:

Bobinator
January 17th, 2011, 10:28 PM
I just ordered one of George's knee-skin suits. I was told to order very large. I hope it works! It's a great deal for $43.00!!!! I'll get another if I like it!

orca1946
January 18th, 2011, 12:38 PM
I will be looking into these soon.

orca1946
March 9th, 2011, 10:28 AM
I tried the Yagfa suit. It was way too short for my body type! :badday:
About 4 inches of my sorry butt was uncovered!! :bolt:

couldbebetterfly
March 9th, 2011, 10:31 AM
I just ordered one of George's knee-skin suits. I was told to order very large. I hope it works! It's a great deal for $43.00!!!! I'll get another if I like it!

How is it working out for you? and if you don't mind me asking, what is your "normal" swimsuit size? I've been thinking of trying one of these - I need to double my race-suit collection.

orca1946
March 9th, 2011, 01:09 PM
I'm 6 ft 222 lbs The Yagfa suit did not have more than 4 inches from crotch to the top of the suit front or back! I don't have much of a butt & it still was WAY TOO short for me. Maybe if I was built like a 160 lb teenager it might fit, but not on this 64 year old swim machine!

Snillor84
March 9th, 2011, 03:14 PM
I also ordered one of the Yingfa suits. I have spoken with George and the size I got was a little too big for me. I am 6'5 225 and the large was a little too big. I have asked for a Medium to try it out.

I like the suit very much. It has a great draw cord that does not slip and will stay tied. The material is also nice, keeps water out and does not absorb much.

Ill keep y'all posted on the smaller suit.:D

orca1946
March 10th, 2011, 06:28 PM
I just got into a Speedo F S II & it fits my chubby bod as well as I can hope for!

Miguelrod
March 27th, 2011, 02:08 PM
Hi guys, I'm new to masters swimming and this seemed like a nice and popular thread to get this discussion going. I stopped swimming at the end o the full body era and haven't kept up with the rules/ advancers of this issue. Going into nats in Mesa, what will be the fastest suit I can get?

I need to make up for two years of non-competitive mass eating with this bad boy.

Cheers

ande
March 28th, 2011, 10:12 AM
Here's what's legal:
They have the Blue & White FINA approved circle beside the suits

Think I'm going to wear a B70 NEROTX

Ande

List of FINA Approved swimsuits
Valid for the period from 01 January 2011 to 31 December 2011
(the List of FINA Approved swimsuits for 2012 will be published before December 31, 2011). (http://www.fina.org/H2O/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=917&Itemid=461)

USMS RULES (http://www.usms.org/rules/part1.pdf)

102.14 Swimwear for Pool Competition

102.14.1 Design—The swimsuits worn for competition shall be nontransparent and
conform to the current concept of the appropriate. The referee shall have
authority to bar offenders from competition until they comply with this
rule.

A Swimwear shall include only a swimsuit, cap and goggles (a nose clip
and ear plugs are allowed). Armbands or legbands shall not be regarded
as parts of the swimsuit and are not allowed.

B In swimming competitions, the competitor must wear only one swimsuit
in one or two pieces. All swimsuits shall be made from textile materials.
For men, the swimsuit shall not extend above the navel nor below the
knees, and for women, shall not cover the neck, extend past the shoulder
nor extend below the knees.

C Only swimsuits complying with FINA swimsuit specifications may be
worn in any USMS sanctioned or recognized competition.

D Exemptions to the foregoing restrictions may be granted to a swimmer,
on a case by case basis, by the chair of the Rules Committee or designee.
Exemptions will be granted only for conflicts due to the swimmer’s
verified religious beliefs or verified medical conditions.
(1) Procedures for applying for an exemption will be established by
the Rules Committee and posted on the U.S. Masters Swimming
website.
(2) No exemption to these restrictions will be granted for a swimsuit
that will give the swimmer a competitive advantage.
(3) The decision of the Rules Committee chair may be appealed only
to the entire Rules Committee, whose decision shall be final and
binding on all parties.

E No swimmer is permitted to wear or use any device or substance to
enhance speed, pace, buoyancy or endurance during a race (such as
webbed gloves, flippers, fins, etc.). Goggles may be worn, and rubdown
oil applied if not considered excessive by the referee. Any kind of tape
on the body is not permitted unless approved by the referee.


FINA List of Approved Suits for 2010 (http://www.usaswimming.org/_Rainbow/Documents/0a37d9dc-0219-4689-a222-41f09d398e4b/Approved%20swimsuits%20for%202010%20effective%201. 25.10.pdf)


USA Swimming Rules (http://www.usaswimming.org/DesktopDefault.aspx?TabId=1636&Alias=Rainbow&Lang=en)

102.8 SWIMWEAR (http://www.usaswimming.org/_Rainbow/Documents/92062db1-06cf-4c09-99a0-f8a0e2a17007/2011%20Rule%20Book.pdf)

.1 Design

A Swimwear shall include only a swimsuit, cap, and goggles. Armbands or leg bands
shall not be regarded as parts of the swimsuit and are not allowed.

B In swimming competitions, the swimmer must wear only one swimsuit in one or two
pieces, except as provided in 205.10.1. All swimsuits shall be made from textile materials.
For men, the swimsuit shall not extend above the navel nor below the knees, and for women, shall not cover the neck, extend past the shoulder, nor extend below the knee (see 701.4.4 for open water exception).
(1) Exemptions to the foregoing restriction may be granted to a swimmer, on a case
by case basis, by the Chair of the Rules & Regulations Committee, or his/her designee.
Exemptions will be granted only for conflicts due to the swimmer’s verified
religious beliefs or verified medical conditions.
(2) Procedures for applying for an exemption will be established by the Rules & Regulations
Committee and posted on the USA Swimming website.
(3) No exemption to this restriction will be granted for a swimsuit that will give the
swimmer a competitive advantage.
(4) The decision of the Rules Chair may be appealed only to the entire Rules & Regulations
Committee, whose decision shall be final and binding on all parties.

C Only swimsuits complying with FINA swimsuit specifications may be worn in any USA
Swimming sanctioned or approved competition.

D Swimsuits worn for competition must be non-transparent and conform to the current
concept of the appropriate.

E No swimmer is permitted to wear or use any device, substance or swimsuit to help his/
her speed, pace, buoyancy or endurance during a race (such as webbed gloves, flippers,
fins, etc.). Goggles may be worn, and rubdown oil applied if not considered
excessive by the Referee. Any kind of tape on the body is not permitted unless
approved by the Referee.

F The Referee shall have authority to bar offenders from the competition until they comply
with the rule.
.2 Insignia — Swimmers may wear the insignia and/or name of the club or organization they
represent or of which they are a member or the insignia of their FINA National Federation or
Organizing Committees for Olympic, World, Continental or Regional Championships, except
as otherwise provided in 202.6.3 for international competition and in FINA rules GR5 and
GR6. Swimmers shall not be allowed to wear the insignia and/or name of any club or organization
which they are not entitled to represent in open competition, if such action is objectionable
to that club or organization.

.3 Advertising (effective 10-01-10)

A Advertising means the normal display of the name, designation, trademark, logo, or any
other distinctive sign of the manufacturer of the item or any other advertiser permitted
in accordance with this rule. FINA labeling and the USA Swimming logo or club logo
shall not be considered as advertisements. Logos of the swimwear manufacturer shall
be considered as advertising and are included in the limits described in (1) through (3)
below. In the competition venue or complex of all events conducted by and under the
control of USA Swimming or any LSC or division thereof, advertising appearing on
swimwear is allowed as follows:
(1) Swimsuits — A total of two separate advertising logos of a maximum size of 20
square centimeters (3.1 sq. in.) each, as measured as applied, shall be permitted.
(2) Caps — A total of two separate advertising logos of a maximum size of 20 square
centimeters (3.1 sq. in.) each, as measured as applied, shall be permitted. A club
logo is not considered as advertising and is not subject to the size limitations.
(3) Goggles — A total of two separate advertising logos of a maximum size of 6
square centimeters (.9 sq. in.) each, as measured as applied, shall be permitted,
but only on the spectacle frame or band.

B Body advertising in the form of temporary tattoos or other embellishments is not
allowed.

C Advertising for the following shall not be allowed:
(1) Products involving tobacco, alcohol or pharmaceuticals containing substances
banned under IOC or FINA rules;
(2) Political statements; and
(3) Any products or services that would be counter to the values of the sport or bring
disrepute to USA Swimming.

D Swimmers in violation of the above provisions may be barred from the competition venue
until they comply. However, any swimmer who competes in an event wearing swimwear
in violation of these advertising provisions shall not be subject to disqualification.

bethcoop
March 28th, 2011, 02:30 PM
Has anyone raced in their Yingfa suit, yet? Love to hear about it. I'm tempted to just get a pretty, lycra Speedo, but those Yingfas are the same price.

pwb
March 28th, 2011, 02:48 PM
Has anyone raced in their Yingfa suit, yet? Love to hear about it. I'm tempted to just get a pretty, lycra Speedo, but those Yingfas are the same price.My guy's viewpoint is that these are excellent suits; I find it only marginally (very marginally) different than my TYR Tracer Light. I'll still be racing in a Tracer Light at Nationals, because they're only $100, but I'm using my Yingfa in all other meets. It's a solid suit and I think way better than any of the 'standard' / non-tech lycra suits I've tried.

YMMV and it might be different for women vs. men

Jimbosback
March 28th, 2011, 03:11 PM
Just bought a Yingfa. The price is sweet. I went by the size chart and got an xl. Hope that's right -- my waist is 32, and my Aquablade is a 32.

orca1946
March 28th, 2011, 03:36 PM
Let me know how they fit you !
They were too short for me.

jaadams1
March 28th, 2011, 08:34 PM
Just bought a Yingfa. The price is sweet. I went by the size chart and got an xl. Hope that's right -- my waist is 32, and my Aquablade is a 32.

I've been using my Yingfa suit like crazy in all my meets. my waist is 32 I guess for jeans, I use a 30 for my suits though... My Yingfa is a Large size, and seems to fit pretty good. I may try a Medium next time since they're only $33. I've had very good results with the suit so far. I'm happy, especially since I don't have the kind of $$$ to spend on the "big name" suits. I'd rather race in a "grab bag" suit for $10 than spend $150+ for something that may wear out just the same. :)

jaadams1
March 28th, 2011, 08:36 PM
Let me know how they fit you !
They were too short for me.

That's cause they're only supposed to go from your waist to just above the knees! :lmao:

Jimbosback
March 28th, 2011, 08:40 PM
I've been using my Yingfa suit like crazy in all my meets. my waist is 32 I guess for jeans, I use a 30 for my suits though... My Yingfa is a Large size, and seems to fit pretty good. I may try a Medium next time since they're only $33. I've had very good results with the suit so far. I'm happy, especially since I don't have the kind of $$$ to spend on the "big name" suits. I'd rather race in a "grab bag" suit for $10 than spend $150+ for something that may wear out just the same. :)


I can't wait to try it out. Maybe it will become the forum 'team' suit. :)

pwb
March 29th, 2011, 02:05 AM
Just bought a Yingfa. The price is sweet. I went by the size chart and got an xl. Hope that's right -- my waist is 32, and my Aquablade is a 32.
I originally got an XL Yingfa (my waist 33/34) and, while I liked, felt it had a little extra room so I got the large and that was a tighter fit.

Karen Duggan
March 29th, 2011, 03:46 PM
I HIGHLY recommend the Yingfa for comfort and price. Because the suits are: XS, S, M, L, and XL they are tough at first to size. I think I ended up with a medium and I'm about 25lbs overweight.

George has all the answers if you ask the right questions.

I also compared the Yingfa to the B70 and my estimate was that the Yingfa was just a hair slower than the B70.

:2cents:

Good luck :cheerleader:

orca1946
April 2nd, 2011, 12:50 PM
Geo is very helpful to all that work with him :applaud:

Jimbosback
April 2nd, 2011, 01:45 PM
I originally got an XL Yingfa (my waist 33/34) and, while I liked, felt it had a little extra room so I got the large and that was a tighter fit.


I just tried it on and it fits great -- a little lower in the back than my other suits, but not too low. :applaud: I'll test drive it Monday.

orca1946
April 2nd, 2011, 07:21 PM
That was my fit as well. Very low in the butt.

Jimbosback
April 4th, 2011, 10:27 PM
I just tried it on and it fits great -- a little lower in the back than my other suits, but not too low. :applaud: I'll test drive it Monday.

Loved the suit. The low back can be pulled up and tied just fine -- I thought it might slip but it didn't.

Not sure if it was the suit or the fact I had to take a week off last week, but my repeats were very fast (for me) today, especially backstroke.

jaadams1
April 4th, 2011, 11:35 PM
Loved the suit. The low back can be pulled up and tied just fine -- I thought it might slip but it didn't.

Not sure if it was the suit or the fact I had to take a week off last week, but my repeats were very fast (for me) today, especially backstroke.

I love the low $33 price tag that comes with it. :)

Bobinator
April 5th, 2011, 07:56 AM
How is it working out for you? and if you don't mind me asking, what is your "normal" swimsuit size? I've been thinking of trying one of these - I need to double my race-suit collection.

Hi! I wore a size 24 blue seventy long-leg suit and size 30 to 32 workout suit. I am getting a medium yingfa as soon as I get home from vacation (he ships them very fast). I raced in mine this week-end and loved it even though it was too big. It seems very sturdy, a great value I'd say!

Chris Stevenson
April 5th, 2011, 11:03 AM
Hadn't visited this thread in awhile.

First off, I saw this article that might be helpful to many in "championship" season:

http://www.usms.org/articles/articledisplay.php?a=314

About the Yingfa, I just wore one for the first time last weekend in NC. My impressions:

First of all, you gotta love the price. And the service was just awesome. I ordered it online, no expedited delivery or anything. Within an hour I got an email from George saying it had been send and I received it at home (Richmond VA) two days later.

The material feels very durable. I wasn't worried about ripping or anything and (although I haven't tested directly) I think it will last for several meets.

About sizing...I wear size 32 jeans comfortably (tho I'm not willing to say I have a 32-in waist due to the possibility of "vanity" sizing). I ordered the XL based on the size chart. It is probably too big for me, the suit definitely "gathers" a little in places.

BUT I am not sure I would want to go smaller b/c even with the XL I felt like it was a little low in the back and felt like I was getting a little bit of a "wedgie." Shades of Junior High...

I have two common fit issues with jammers. First of all, often they are uncomfortably constricting at the bottom. No issue at all with the Yingfa on that score, and I don't think it would be an issue even if I sized down. Secondly, I have a long torso/short body combination (to give you some idea: I am 7 inches taller than my wife but our jeans are the same length). So often jammers will go too low for me, a few even "flap" a little bit in the water near the knees. Again, no problem with the Yingfa in that regard.

At present time my plan is to use the Yingfa only for in-season meets and stick with XL. I have a couple taper/race suits still in good shape and will use them up, that may take a year or more. After that I'll revisit the issue of whether to size down (possibly being less comfortable) and use the Yingfa in a taper meet. As someone mentioned, they are cheap enough that experimentation is no big deal.

couldbebetterfly
April 5th, 2011, 02:49 PM
Hi! I wore a size 24 blue seventy long-leg suit and size 30 to 32 workout suit. I am getting a medium yingfa as soon as I get home from vacation (he ships them very fast). I raced in mine this week-end and loved it even though it was too big. It seems very sturdy, a great value I'd say!

Thanks - I'm on the verge of ordering and as I'm a 25 fastskin and 32/34 trainig suit, it sounds like a large would probably work for me then. :)

BillS
April 5th, 2011, 06:59 PM
About the Yingfa, I just wore one for the first time last weekend in NC. My impressions:

First of all, you gotta love the price. And the service was just awesome. I ordered it online, no expedited delivery or anything. Within an hour I got an email from George saying it had been send and I received it at home (Richmond VA) two days later.

The material feels very durable. I wasn't worried about ripping or anything and (although I haven't tested directly) I think it will last for several meets.

About sizing...I wear size 32 jeans comfortably (tho I'm not willing to say I have a 32-in waist due to the possibility of "vanity" sizing). I ordered the XL based on the size chart. It is probably too big for me, the suit definitely "gathers" a little in places.

BUT I am not sure I would want to go smaller b/c even with the XL I felt like it was a little low in the back and felt like I was getting a little bit of a "wedgie." Shades of Junior High...

I have two common fit issues with jammers. First of all, often they are uncomfortably constricting at the bottom. No issue at all with the Yingfa on that score, and I don't think it would be an issue even if I sized down. Secondly, I have a long torso/short body combination (to give you some idea: I am 7 inches taller than my wife but our jeans are the same length). So often jammers will go too low for me, a few even "flap" a little bit in the water near the knees. Again, no problem with the Yingfa in that regard.

At present time my plan is to use the Yingfa only for in-season meets and stick with XL. I have a couple taper/race suits still in good shape and will use them up, that may take a year or more. After that I'll revisit the issue of whether to size down (possibly being less comfortable) and use the Yingfa in a taper meet. As someone mentioned, they are cheap enough that experimentation is no big deal.

I just ordered one. With prices cheaper than a grab bag suit and free shipping, why not? And I got an email from George 12 minutes after I paid saying my suit will go out tomorrow. I'll post a follow up after I get the suit.

orca1946
April 5th, 2011, 07:39 PM
He is fast & a lot of you a very happy with the suits!:banana:

BillS
April 13th, 2011, 02:22 PM
I ordered a Yingfa jammer late Tuesday, and it arrived in Friday's mail. That's pretty great service.

I am 6'2" and just under 200 pounds. I wear a 34 practice and race suit. Based on Chris' comments I figured the XL would be perfect. I tried it on and liked the fit. The fit reminds me of one of my first tech suits, TYR leggings, which were very low rise in the hips. The Yingfa is at least as low, and probably lower in the back than the TYR. Those babies who got back may find it a little too low. But as my wife frequently points out, this baby got no back, and so I'm not too worried about the timers mistaking me for a plumber. And if they do, hey, it wasn't me that outlawed the full coverage suits.

My post suit ban race suit has been an older Speedo FSII jammer. I never really liked it when I first got in the pre-B70 days, and I liked it even less after the ban. But I paid $149 for it, and I'm cheap so I wear it. The fit never felt quite right in ways that I can't really articulate, but the biggest issue with the Speedo was that the bottom of the legs constricted my thighs something fierce, to the point of feeling like they cut off some of the circulation at times. I do not have big thighs by any means, but I would regularly be jamming fingers in the bottom of the legs and tugging and adjusting to try and stretch it out a little.

I tried on the Yingfa at the end of practice this morning and swam a few hundred meters in it. My practice suit is a TYR nylon jammer that is at least a couple months past its mandatory retirement age, but we're all friends on my team and, as mentioned, I'm cheap. And so it swims on, ballooning and billowing here and there when waterlogged, with me regularly tugging the legs up and adjusting.

So the Yingfa felt wonderfully compressive in comparison, and seemed like a very good race suit. The fabric micro-bubbled and seemed to repel water like the tech suits of yore, it felt sleek and fast, and I even swear I felt a little float from it. The bottom of the legs are snug at the thighs, but not overly so. Some suits I have tried felt like they restricted the breaststroke kick, but I didn't feel that with the Yingfa.

So my whopping 33 bucks seems well spent at this point. I plan to wear it at Mesa, and find it hard to imagine that a $200 jammer could be significantly better.

orca1946
April 13th, 2011, 04:17 PM
His price of $33 can not be beat!:2cents::2cents::2cents:

jaadams1
April 13th, 2011, 08:36 PM
So my whopping 33 bucks seems well spent at this point. I plan to wear it at Mesa, and find it hard to imagine that a $200 jammer could be significantly better.

Exactly the reason I like it too. I bought 2 originally and have used one for all my meets since January (like 6 of them I think), and have saved the other one for it's virgin run at Nationals. I'll be buying more...because $33 is right where I can afford.
I also like that the legs of the Yingfas are not so overly constricting at the bottom. I had a TYR Fusion 2 to compare it with, which was quite snug around the bottom of the thigh.
:applaud: to Yingfa!

orca1946
April 14th, 2011, 05:11 PM
How does he get the price so low ?:2cents::2cents::2cents:

Chris Stevenson
April 14th, 2011, 07:49 PM
How does he get the price so low ?:2cents::2cents::2cents:

I dunno. But maybe a better question is why the other suits are so pricey.

jaadams1
April 14th, 2011, 08:04 PM
I dunno. But maybe a better question is why the other suits are so pricey.

Same reason the price of gas is where it is. Greed.

mollyfied
April 15th, 2011, 12:15 AM
George should love the USMS forum. I'm buying one, too.

MSwan
April 15th, 2011, 12:33 PM
I just received mine. It fits fine. Great service, it showed up a couple of days after I ordered it.

orca1946
April 15th, 2011, 05:01 PM
He must have suits packed up & ready to go!!:bolt: