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ande
February 16th, 2011, 11:34 AM
This is a great topic of discussion for us.

When does working out and training for an event take too much time away from family?

Is it different if your spouse isn't a swimmer or athletic?

How does your spouse feel about how much you train each week?

What comprimises have you made?

2011 WSJ Article:
A Workout Ate My Marriage
Exercise Can Set Off Conflict About Family, Free Time; Errands vs. English Channel (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703439504576116083514534672.html)

What's funny is I trained with Jordan (featured in the article) on Thursday July 5th, 2007 at Asphalt Green in NYC, he gave me a ride back by my hotel which was pretty close to his office. Very nice guy.

bzaks1424
February 16th, 2011, 11:44 AM
Is it different if your spouse isn't a swimmer or athletic?

I don't workout for "hours" and I don't know anything about spousal units, but I was dating a girl for a couple of weeks who rarely worked out when she started to rip on the fact that I wanted to go to the gym 3-4 days a week and swim 4 days a week. She kind of crossed the line when she called me her "meathead".

So I think I'm going to avoid dating non-athletes from now on.

orca1946
February 16th, 2011, 12:50 PM
positive & negitive attract. She is a 5 am gym rat & my swim times are at 7:30 - 9:15 at night

That Guy
February 16th, 2011, 01:16 PM
What comprimises have you made?

I trained for and raced Ironmans in 2007 and 2008. I erased Kona off my bucket list, even though I never got there. This article more or less details why.

darrinlajoie
February 16th, 2011, 01:24 PM
The whole family is asleep while I workout. Last year I attended one event, an open water swim, and the family came to cheer me on and shop (their priority was not necessarily in that order). I caught the bug so this is my first year training for multiple events - lake swims in Oregon, another trip to SF bay for sharkfest and a pool meet or two. We'll see how this year goes, but my first pool meet was followed by shopping again, so no complaints so far.

couldbebetterfly
February 16th, 2011, 01:45 PM
I swim 2 x week when hubby is at work and the kids are in school. Also once on a weekend depending on our plans. I would love to do more, but with DH being a night owl and me needing to be back to get my oldest to school, its just not possible for me to swim the 5.15am - 6.30am sessions. When the outdoor pool 5 mins away opens over the summer I'll be there at 6am - he'll cope with the early mornings because it puts me in a better mood, keeps my weight down (a bit) and its only temporary!

A wise lady once said to me.....
"Even though I've swum some great swims and achieved some great times, my proudest achievement was giving birth to my kids"

ourswimmer
February 16th, 2011, 02:17 PM
When does working out and training for an event take too much time away from family?

Well, I would say, "when you have three kids under 12 and a M-F day job but you eat dinner with your family only once a week and you spend 1/3 of your weekend waking hours, every weekend, with people other than your partner and kids." One could blame the career or the sports, depending on one's biases, but something does look pretty unbalanced there.

Redbird Alum
February 16th, 2011, 02:45 PM
I'm with Louise on the kids being my greatest acheivment in life. That said, I try to mitigate by working out immediately following my age-group coaching twice a week, and then once on the weekend.

I wouldn't trade my relationship with my wife for anything (even swimming in the Olympiad).

Waterdog7946
February 16th, 2011, 03:02 PM
I think I found a happy compromise with my girlfriend. Even though she doesn't work out, she doesn't get on me about my workout schedule during the season.( 4 days swimming, 4 days dryland a week) I back off a bit during the summer so I can spend more time w her and my son. But I can see where this can cause a problem with other couples. Ya gotta find a balance....

ande
February 16th, 2011, 03:48 PM
Well, I would say, "when you have three kids under 12 and a M - F day job but you eat dinner with your family only once a week and you spend 1/3 of your weekend waking hours, every weekend, with people other than your partner and kids." One could blame the career or the sports, depending on one's biases, but something does look pretty unbalanced there.

Spending that much time away from your spouse and kids could lead to resentment and trouble. We all need to strike a balance.

2 top emotional needs (http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3300_needs.html) for most women are affection (http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3305_aff.html) and conversation (http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3315_conv.html).

It's likely that an absent exercise obsessed spouse might not be meeting those needs as well as they could.


2 top emotional needs for most men are Recreational Companionship (http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3320_rec.html) and Physical Attractiveness (http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3330_att.html)

It's not good if our spouse isn't our primary recreational companion and being around very fit healthy members of the opposite sex could cause unrealistic expectations.


One of the biggest Love Busters (http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3400_lovebust.html) is Independent Behavior (http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3406_independent.html) I'm going to train or go to competitions when I want, no matter what, end of discussion, could cause trouble.


The Policy of Joint Agreement (http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3500_policy.html)
"Never do anything without an enthusiastic agreement
between you and your spouse" might help couples in conflict.

The spouse at home could start feeling ignored, neglected, or put upon.

KEWebb18
February 16th, 2011, 08:42 PM
Is it different if your spouse isn't a swimmer or athletic?
My husband is also former college athlete, so he understands how I need some balance in my life. He doesn't know much about swimming, but has enjoyed (or pretends to enjoy :)) learning about it.

How does your spouse feel about how much you train each week?
He actually complains when I train less because I am crabby when I can't work out!

I agree with Ande, it's all about finding a balance!

TheCaveman
February 16th, 2011, 10:46 PM
I took the time to explain to my wife that that wasn't something that I wanted to do but something that I needed to do. I set a workout schedule that minimized time away from the family (mornings). When I do workout in the evenings, weekends, or attend meets family commitments come first. She has a veto on these times. She understands how important this is, though, and doesn't use it unless it's necessary.

IMHO, you have to be open about why you're working out and be willing to be flexible. It's all in the give and take.

analazy
February 17th, 2011, 02:55 AM
This subject always makes me smile , combine sport with marriage.:bitching:
Being a marriage non believer , incapable of losing most of my freedom , incapable of imagining long term commitments (around age 22 decided would not have children) always astonished , positively, people being able to make vows. :bow:Any successful situation involving children , marriage and sport is fabulous:cheerleader:
Most of the situation have seen one of the partners always give more than the other, there is some resentment:bolt:
Mostly humans want the whole successful package: job, family, sport, freedom, immortality:blah:

magick17
February 17th, 2011, 02:04 PM
Most of my swims are early in the morning when my family is in bed. And I'm planning to do maybe 3-4 races...and my family loves to go to the open water events.
I think my husband loves it. I'm stronger, happier and leaner.
My son who's an age group swimmer loves that we can talk about our workouts and I'm not focused on his swimming.

ElaineK
February 17th, 2011, 06:43 PM
I feel very fortunate to have a husband who understands, supports, and encourages my swimming! :applaud: It works out great where we live, because we both get up and go together to the amenity center, so he can "bike to nowhere and race Lance" (on a recumbent bike) while I swim. There is a window between the gym and pool, so he watches me swim while he's on the bike or lifts weights. Then, we meet up in the hallway afterward to share a water bottle full of icy chocolate soy milk and fill each other in on our workouts. Sometimes, on his rest days, he comes in and films my strokes, so I can review them. And, even though he's a non-swimmer, he has become a pretty good coach, pointing out my stroke flaws when I ask him to keep an eye on things. :D I am one luck Aqua Dog! :bliss:

The Fortress
February 17th, 2011, 07:31 PM
2 top emotional needs (http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3300_needs.html) for most women are affection (http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3305_aff.html) and conversation (http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3315_conv.html).


2 top emotional needs for most men are Recreational Companionship (http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3320_rec.html) and Physical Attractiveness (http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3330_att.html)



Great, once again I'm a guy.

I didn't start competing in masters swimming until I was 44. Just too busy with a job and 3 kids, though I did usually exercise either at lunch or at night after my kids went to bed (no swimming though, I am not a recreational or lap swimmer). I did occasionally resent my husband (an obsessive runner) for being gone every single morning. But this was partially my own fault for letting mommy guilt prevent me from doing my own thing more. Now, we both compete in our respective sports, which works out well, though we have to carefully plan our schedules on weekends. It also helps that he is a morning workout person and I am a night owl, so he can always have the early am slot. I've already submitted my list of meets for 2011. He signed up for a series of trail races without first consulting management and one of them conflicted with my pre-approved meet. Bad boy!

Elaine -- is this the husband who won't let you get up early to avoid noodlers?

ElaineK
February 17th, 2011, 09:23 PM
Elaine -- is this the husband who won't let you get up early to avoid noodlers?

No, you have that incorrect. He has never once in 25 years not "let" me do anything. It is, in fact, quite the opposite. He encourages me to pursue my passions in the way I see fit. And, I do the same for him.

The decision to not set an alarm regularly was my choice and I made that clear in the noodling thread. Bruce used to get up for work at 4:45am every morning, for years, and grew to detest the alarm clock. When I encouraged him to take retirement at 55, together we made a pact that we would never set an alarm clock again, unless it was to catch a plane or for some other non-routine event. On his own, he has made the sacrifice to adjust to an earlier sleep schedule, so I can get a full swim in before the noodlers invade the pool. He hits the gym while I'm swimming.

mrubacky
February 17th, 2011, 10:20 PM
I guess it all depends on how you work it out. I get up for my morning swims 15 minutes before she gets up for her day and that's only because I make the lunches for the kids. I swim 7 days a week, 1 1/2 - 2 hours per day plus wieghts 3 days a week, but we plan my workouts around family events and her workouts (hers are just to stay in shape). They come to most of my meets and we work together to pick and choose which meets I will go too. From reading the article, it looks to just be an excuse for the true problem that every relationship issue is based on, lack of communication. My wife knows that if she needs me to skip a workout all she has to do is ask.

philoswimmer
February 18th, 2011, 12:24 AM
I think my partner really respects the commitment that I've made to stick to my workout schedule, rain or shine (that means something when you swim outdoors all year round!), and he encourages me to go on the few times that I think about skipping. I'd like him to come to meets, but he's not keen on that (though he will "crew" me for open swims). I guess that's too much to expect -- they can be kind of boring for non-swimmers, after all.

aquageek
February 18th, 2011, 09:44 AM
Fort - in our house we do the same workout shuffling/negotiating as you and your husband. The great thing is that neither of us have to ask permission to get up early or use an alarm clock.

ElaineK
February 18th, 2011, 01:57 PM
Fort - in our house we do the same workout shuffling/negotiating as you and your husband. The great thing is that neither of us have to ask permission to get up early or use an alarm clock.


Yep, same here! I've never had to ask permission to get up early or use an alarm clock. I voluntarily decided not to, giving my husband a break. But, he, on his own, decided to make adjustments, so we could go to bed earlier and wake up earlier naturally, without the alarm clock. And, he wants to go to all of my meets, alarm clock and all! :D

The Fortress
February 18th, 2011, 02:03 PM
Fort - in our house we do the same workout shuffling/negotiating as you and your husband. The great thing is that neither of us have to ask permission to get up early or use an alarm clock.

Just think, when we're retired and kick the kids out of the house, we won't have to do this anymore.

Mr. Fort shows up at a meet maybe one day a year (someone's got to mind the kids). I really don't care; they're extremely dull for non-swimmers. And it gives me a nice break from the fam and a chance to see my friends. Guess I'm engaging in "love busting."

pwb
February 18th, 2011, 02:18 PM
Just think, when we're retired and kick the kids out of the house, we won't have to do this anymore. For sure, I'm hoping to really rock when I get to the 60-64 age group ;)

swimshark
February 18th, 2011, 02:21 PM
Just think, when we're retired and kick the kids out of the house, we won't have to do this anymore.

Mr. Fort shows up at a meet maybe one day a year (someone's got to mind the kids). I really don't care; they're extremely dull for non-swimmers. And it gives me a nice break from the fam and a chance to see my friends. Guess I'm engaging in "love busting."

And we enjoy seeing him that once a year :)

aquageek
February 18th, 2011, 02:57 PM
Just think, when we're retired and kick the kids out of the house, we won't have to do this anymore.

That's right, we can move to a convalescent center, eat mushy food and complain about other residents full-time. Sounds awful, to be honest.

couldbebetterfly
February 18th, 2011, 03:26 PM
Mr. Fort shows up at a meet maybe one day a year (someone's got to mind the kids). I really don't care; they're extremely dull for non-swimmers. And it gives me a nice break from the fam and a chance to see my friends. Guess I'm engaging in "love busting."

That sounds pretty similar to how we used to be/will be again - my husband would show up at our home meet which was less than 10 mins from our house for maybe 30 mins, then get bored. He always managed to just miss my best swim too!

However he has started to take an interest in kiddo's swimming, when she is actually swimming, so maybe he'll become a swim-dad yet?

I just wish he'd engage in some regular exercise himself, but that's a whole other subject........

knelson
February 18th, 2011, 03:38 PM
That's right, we can move to a convalescent center, eat mushy food and complain about other residents full-time. Sounds awful, to be honest.

Did you just finish reading "Water for Elephants" by any chance?

pmccoy
February 18th, 2011, 03:52 PM
That's right, we can move to a convalescent center, eat mushy food and complain about other residents full-time. Sounds awful, to be honest.
You forgot to mention taking up noodling while complaining about the water being cooler than 90 degrees and those fast swimmers splashing around getting everyone's hair wet.

ElaineK
February 18th, 2011, 04:06 PM
That's right, we can move to a convalescent center, eat mushy food and complain about other residents full-time. Sounds awful, to be honest.

Or, you can move to an active adult community, eat your own healthy food at your own house, and only complain about the noodlers part-time! It's a great place to live, honestly!

knelson
February 18th, 2011, 04:38 PM
Or, you can move to an active adult community

And wage a constant battle with the noodlers at the community pool? No thanks! :bolt:

Jeff Commings
February 18th, 2011, 04:42 PM
I know there are plenty of married swimming couples in Masters (the Roddins, the Santoses), and as one of those married swimming couples I have to say it's great having a spouse who is also a swimmer.

Nothing needs to be said. Both of us know pool time is important -- me for competition, him for sanity and fitness.

aquageek
February 18th, 2011, 04:43 PM
Or, you can move to an active adult community, eat your own healthy food at your own house, and only complain about the noodlers part-time! It's a great place to live, honestly!

Maybe once you get super old, like gull and matysekj, you fall for that marketing bologna. Calling a geezer village an active adult community is like calling McDonald's coffee "premium" or Branson, MO a "destination vacation."

pmccoy
February 18th, 2011, 04:50 PM
Maybe once you get old, like gull and matysekj, you fall for that marketing bologna. Calling a geezer village an active adult community is like calling McDonald's coffee "premium" or Branson, MO a "destination vacation."
:popcorn:

ElaineK
February 18th, 2011, 05:12 PM
:popcorn:

Hey, is that a new Smilie or did I just miss this one? Cool! :D You will be going through a lot of bags of that stuff as long as 'Geek continues to get his digs in about me- every chance he gets! It all started with his dislike for the appearance of my posts and it hasn't stopped yet. Start poppin' more of that corn, Peter!

pmccoy
February 18th, 2011, 05:19 PM
Hey, is that a new Smilie or did I just miss this one? Cool! :D
At the bottom of the smilies, there's a link that says "more". Not that you need anything "more" to liven up your posts.

ElaineK
February 18th, 2011, 05:32 PM
At the bottom of the smilies, there's a link that says "more". Not that you need anything "more" to liven up your posts.

Oh, I know about those Smilies; I've used most of them at one time or another. I just somehow missed THAT one! :)
(Hey, if I'm going to spend my time posting on the forums, I may as well have fun doing it!)

pmccoy
February 18th, 2011, 05:38 PM
At the bottom of the smilies, there's a link that says "more". Not that you need anything "more" to liven up your posts.

Oh, I know about those Smilies; I've used most of them at one time or another. I just somehow missed THAT one! :)
(Hey, if I'm going to spend my time posting on the forums, I may as well have fun doing it!)
Gotcha! You keep on using those smilies! It's ok w/ me.

The Fortress
February 18th, 2011, 05:47 PM
Maybe once you get super old, like gull and matysekj, you fall for that marketing bologna. Calling a geezer village an active adult community is like calling McDonald's coffee "premium" or Branson, MO a "destination vacation."

"Active adults" and "noodlers" are contradictory terms.

I live in an active adult community; it's called suburbia.

ElaineK
February 18th, 2011, 05:53 PM
"Active adults" and "noodlers" are contradictory terms.

I live in an active adult community; it's called suburbia.

That's true! :D Fortunately, very few of the residents are noodlers and many are just as active as I am. The gym rocks with VERY active adults of all ages. This is a 55+ community, but 10% of the homes can be sold to 50+. Since only one of the homeowners has to qualify, there are a bunch of younger spouses.

Our community is just like the forums; most of the people are really nice, encouraging, supportive, friendly, and all around great people! But, like the forums and any community (even in suburbia...), there are also those who are bullies or just plain jerks. Always one in a crowd... :shakeshead:

bzaks1424
February 18th, 2011, 06:05 PM
When I've given up all hope, I'll move to an "active adult community," whatever that means. Dinner at 4 pm! Sweet.

Make sure to get there by 3:30 to catch the early bird special!

mcountryman
February 18th, 2011, 06:20 PM
I know that I am a very lucky gal. My husband has always given me the support and freedom to pursue my goals and I do the same for him. When I got back in the pool less than a year ago for fitness, I never dreamed that swimming would become such a big part of my life. He has been there to support me and cheer me on every step of the way!!

ElaineK
February 18th, 2011, 06:57 PM
I know that I am a very lucky gal. My husband has always given me the support and freedom to pursue my goals and I do the same for him. When I got back in the pool less than a year ago for fitness, I never dreamed that swimming would become such a big part of my life. He has been there to support me and cheer me on every step of the way!!

:cheerleader: Yeah, Tom! Our guys were great at Auburn, weren't they? Nice having our own photographers/videographers, too! :applaud:

mcountryman
February 18th, 2011, 07:29 PM
:cheerleader: Yeah, Tom! Our guys were great at Auburn, weren't they? Nice having our own photographers/videographers, too! :applaud:

Our guys rock!!

Kurt Dickson
February 18th, 2011, 08:18 PM
I think this article deals more with Ironman. I have done (and I use that term loosely) 5 of them. To do one of these properly (never done by me) is, in my opinion, an incredibly selfish endeavor, especially if you have a family. One- sport pursuits are much more reasonable (unless combined with trolling the forums:)).

philoswimmer
February 18th, 2011, 11:14 PM
I am really tired of all the side-jabs at ElaineK (about her fonts and smilies, husband, where she lives, how she deals with the noodlers, etc.) in this thread and elsewhere. I wish the moderators would be a little more active in talking privately to the perpetrators and asking them to stop. This is an interesting thread that I'd like to follow without having to read about others' personal gripes about other forumites. But in case the moderators don't want to do this, I'd like to ask, please, that it be stopped. It isn't funny and it certainly isn't about swimming.

That Guy
February 19th, 2011, 01:26 AM
I am really tired of all the side-jabs at ElaineK (about her fonts and smilies, husband, where she lives, how she deals with the noodlers, etc.) in this thread and elsewhere. I wish the moderators would be a little more active in talking privately to the perpetrators and asking them to stop. This is an interesting thread that I'd like to follow without having to read about others' personal gripes about other forumites. But in case the moderators don't want to do this, I'd like to ask, please, that it be stopped. It isn't funny and it certainly isn't about swimming.

philoswimmer is right.

:cheerleader::banana: GO :banana: eLaINE :banana: G0! :banana::cheerleader:

mcountryman
February 19th, 2011, 07:21 AM
I am really tired of all the side-jabs at ElaineK (about her fonts and smilies, husband, where she lives, how she deals with the noodlers, etc.) in this thread and elsewhere. I wish the moderators would be a little more active in talking privately to the perpetrators and asking them to stop. This is an interesting thread that I'd like to follow without having to read about others' personal gripes about other forumites. But in case the moderators don't want to do this, I'd like to ask, please, that it be stopped. It isn't funny and it certainly isn't about swimming.

I have to agree as well. As I am becoming active on this forum, I have noticed this too...and I don't appreciate it. Both ElaineK and her husband are wonderful people and I feel lucky to know them. She is an awesome swimmer and trains very hard. Her enthusiasm for swimmming inspires me.

KEWebb18
February 19th, 2011, 08:01 AM
I think this article deals more with Ironman. I have done (and I use that term loosely) 5 of them. To do one of these properly (never done by me) is, in my opinion, an incredibly selfish endeavor, especially if you have a family. One- sport pursuits are much more reasonable (unless combined with trolling the forums:)).

I agree that training for an Ironman is a lot more time-consuming than training for swimming.
I swim at a pool where there are a lot of triathletes; they always seem to be either swimming before or after another workout. I always wonder if they have families who support their decision to train. I like to exercise, but I like to spend time with my family more.

Bobinator
February 19th, 2011, 08:28 AM
I think any activity done in excess is bad for marrige and family life.
I've seen couples broken by partying/drinking, training (swimming/ running/basketball/ soccer, etc), and working too many hours.
I know from experience that throwing a bunch of kids on top the mix makes the balancing act quadruple at least.
Probably the only thing worse than suffering through an unbalanced marrige is raising 3 kids alone. It sucks.

aquageek
February 19th, 2011, 08:46 AM
I will take a contrary view on fit families. If it weren't for fitness my family would be like ships passing in the night. It is something we can all do together, and a common bond. There are definitely times when I have pushed it a bit far but, for the most part, it is something we share, all four of us. And, there's nothing like a good intra-familiar rivalry on results.

Bobinator
February 19th, 2011, 09:06 AM
I will take a contrary view on fit families. If it weren't for fitness my family would be like ships passing in the night. It is something we can all do together, and a common bond. There are definitely times when I have pushed it a bit far but, for the most part, it is something we share, all four of us. And, there's nothing like a good intra-familiar rivalry on results.

I think you've got that one right Geek! I know other families doing the same thing!
When my kidoos were home I was a runner. I did my running either at 4:30 a.m. or after 10 p.m. I didn't mind it cause I was young and had boundless energy back then. Most of the rest of my time was spent at their swimming events, cooking, or work.
I love my kids ferociously but I'll admit it is a tremendous break having them mostly on their own now!!

Chris Stevenson
February 19th, 2011, 10:41 AM
I think this article deals more with Ironman. I have done (and I use that term loosely) 5 of them. To do one of these properly (never done by me) is, in my opinion, an incredibly selfish endeavor, especially if you have a family. One- sport pursuits are much more reasonable (unless combined with trolling the forums:)).

I have friends who do the IM seriously. I would agree that training is very time-consuming. The events themselves are pretty expensive too, not to mention the equipment.

Whether it is "incredibly selfish" will depend on the context and I'm not willing to generalize further than that.

The Fortress
February 19th, 2011, 11:25 AM
I am really tired of all the side-jabs at ElaineK (about her fonts and smilies, husband, where she lives, how she deals with the noodlers, etc.) in this thread and elsewhere. I wish the moderators would be a little more active in talking privately to the perpetrators and asking them to stop. This is an interesting thread that I'd like to follow without having to read about others' personal gripes about other forumites. But in case the moderators don't want to do this, I'd like to ask, please, that it be stopped. It isn't funny and it certainly isn't about swimming.

I undertand your POV, Philo, but it was Elaine who put her personal life on the forums. If certain posters don't like her whining about noodlers or don't think it's profound that her husband got up every morning until he retired, they are entitled to say so as long as there is no breach of forum rules. This is a fairly civil forum, and there have been many many vastly more contentious threads. It's best to try to not be so thin skinned. And I say this based on my own experience from years ago. If Elaine or others view every contrary opinion as a personal attack, they might as well pack it in. This is a discussion forum; we don't have to hold hands and sing kumbaya every day. And there are threads for that, e.g., attaboy/attagirl. Just don't expect Geek not to be Geek.

ElaineK
February 19th, 2011, 11:44 AM
I am really tired of all the side-jabs at ElaineK (about her fonts and smilies, husband, where she lives, how she deals with the noodlers, etc.) in this thread and elsewhere. I wish the moderators would be a little more active in talking privately to the perpetrators and asking them to stop. This is an interesting thread that I'd like to follow without having to read about others' personal gripes about other forumites. But in case the moderators don't want to do this, I'd like to ask, please, that it be stopped. It isn't funny and it certainly isn't about swimming.

Thanks for speaking up, Philo! :) You know, 'Geek and I have never even met in person. But, he has singled me out as his target on these forums. I had never done any social networking until this site (and still don't), so I don't know how it is on Facebook and other sites. But, I've heard stories... It's just too bad some people have to be so negative.

That Guy: You SO rock! :applaud: A big :bighug: and :smooch: to ya! :D

ElaineK
February 19th, 2011, 11:52 AM
I have to agree as well. As I am becoming active on this forum, I have noticed this too...and I don't appreciate it. Both ElaineK and her husband are wonderful people and I feel lucky to know them. She is an awesome swimmer and trains very hard. Her enthusiasm for swimmming inspires me.

Thanks, Marianne; the feeling is mutual! You and Tom are so nice and I have never met such a humble swimmer as you! Check out your rankings at the end of this year; I see some Top Tens in your future! :cheerleader:

I really appreciate your friendship and look forward to seeing you at St. Pat's! :)

ElaineK
February 19th, 2011, 12:11 PM
I undertand your POV, Philo, but it was Elaine who put her personal life on the forums. If certain posters don't like her whining about noodlers or don't think it's profound that her husband got up every morning until he retired, they are entitled to say so as long as there is no breach of forum rules. This is a fairly civil forum, and there have been many many vastly more contentious threads. It's best to try to not be so thin skinned. And I say this based on my own experience from years ago. If Elaine or others view every contrary opinion as a personal attack, they might as well pack it in. This is a discussion forum; we don't have to hold hands and sing kumbaya every day. And there are threads for that, e.g., attaboy/attagirl. Just don't expect Geek not to be Geek.

It's not what you say, but HOW you say it. Rudeness is not necessary. The civil forumites express their views in a polite, respectful way.

knelson
February 19th, 2011, 12:48 PM
Just don't expect Geek not to be Geek.

I agree. Most of us who have been here a long time have taken a jab or two from Geek. OK, maybe Elaine is taking more of it than anyone right now, but in my opinion it's fairly light-hearted. I'd be lying if I said I didn't laugh at Geek's post about "Active Adults."

That Guy
February 19th, 2011, 01:58 PM
I agree. Most of us who have been here a long time have taken a jab or two from Geek. OK, maybe Elaine is taking more of it than anyone right now, but in my opinion it's fairly light-hearted. I'd be lying if I said I didn't laugh at Geek's post about "Active Adults."

When Geek calls BS on something, he's generally spot on. I enjoy his weakness for smilies and non-default fonts.
:cheerleader::banana: GO :banana: GeEk :banana: G0! :banana::cheerleader:

ElaineK
February 19th, 2011, 02:19 PM
When Geek calls BS on something, he's generally spot on. I enjoy his weakness for smilies and non-default fonts.
:cheerleader::banana: GO :banana: GeEk :banana: G0! :banana::cheerleader:

:lmao:

The Fortress
February 19th, 2011, 03:09 PM
I agree. Most of us who have been here a long time have taken a jab or two from Geek. OK, maybe Elaine is taking more of it than anyone right now, but in my opinion it's fairly light-hearted. I'd be lying if I said I didn't laugh at Geek's post about "Active Adults."

Precisely. It was hysterical, as are many of his posts and jabs. And, honestly, active adult communities are frequently the butt of jokes, are they not?

I guess over the years I've gotten used to the banter and back and forth on the forums. To quote Geek, there is no "nicey mcnice" requirement. People are allowed to dislike fonts and smilies (and love old fashioned arguments), just as people are allowed to dislike Geek. One can always use the ignore function.

It also takes awhile to get used to the on line personalities, which don't always correspond to the in person personalities. Why, it took me at least a year to get used to and recognize our poor banned Gull's sarcasm or to recognize that Geek was just joshing when he called me a "bar maid" for months. And some posters still don't get my Jimslie at all. Moreover, while Elaine can be very sweet and encouraging, I think she also can be an agent provocateur, thread hijacker and downright astonishing to some.

aquageek
February 19th, 2011, 03:23 PM
...called me a "bar maid" for months.

That takes me back to the good old days of the forum, the golden age. I'm so ashamed that knelson has come to my defense - befriended by a commie, the death sentence for an Ayn Rand devotee.

ElaineK
February 19th, 2011, 03:43 PM
Moreover, while Elaine can be very sweet and encouraging, I think she also can be an agent provocateur, thread hijacker and downright astonishing to some.

???? Please send me a PM and explain... (Thread hijacker? :shakeshead: )

Kurt Dickson
February 19th, 2011, 04:10 PM
Whether it is "incredibly selfish" will depend on the context and I'm not willing to generalize further than that.

14-20 hours per week training, 5-12K for a bike, 600 dollar racing fees, all on top of a full-time job...the only context in which that wouldn't be selfish, is if your family didn't like you (or if you were independently wealthy).

knelson
February 19th, 2011, 04:22 PM
I'm so ashamed that knelson has come to my defense - befriended by a commie, the death sentence for an Ayn Rand devotee.

Sorry about that, comrade.

Chris Stevenson
February 19th, 2011, 04:32 PM
14-20 hours per week training, 5-12K for a bike, 600 dollar racing fees, all on top of a full-time job...the only context in which that wouldn't be selfish, is if your family didn't like you (or if you were independently wealthy).

Here are some others:

-- no kids (or unmarried, for that matter), or kids are grown up and moved on
-- your wife trains with you, or trains mostly the same times as you do
-- you do the bulk of your training in the morning hours or during lunch breaks or on weekends, or in some other manner that doesn't take too much time away from family
-- you make money at it
-- you don't, in fact, have a full-time job

I have no interest in IMs and I do think that many practitioners are too obsessive about it. I have seen my share of broken marriages due to the "triathlete widow" (or even the "triathlete affair") syndrome. But some people also manage it just fine with a full-time job and while being good parents/spouses.

And I certainly do not think the article was IM-specific, either. In fact, the sub-title mentions the English Channel, not Kona.

aquageek
February 19th, 2011, 04:35 PM
It is unfortunate that since the forces of evil, led by Chris and Chaos, banned the tech suits and Torres has gone into seclusion, we are are forced to argue the merits of Del Boca Vista living.

philoswimmer
February 19th, 2011, 08:09 PM
Precisely. It was hysterical, as are many of his posts and jabs. And, honestly, active adult communities are frequently the butt of jokes, are they not?

I guess over the years I've gotten used to the banter and back and forth on the forums. To quote Geek, there is no "nicey mcnice" requirement. People are allowed to dislike fonts and smilies (and love old fashioned arguments), just as people are allowed to dislike Geek. One can always use the ignore function.

It also takes awhile to get used to the on line personalities, which don't always correspond to the in person personalities. Why, it took me at least a year to get used to and recognize our poor banned Gull's sarcasm or to recognize that Geek was just joshing when he called me a "bar maid" for months. And some posters still don't get my Jimslie at all. Moreover, while Elaine can be very sweet and encouraging, I think she also can be an agent provocateur, thread hijacker and downright astonishing to some.

Since you ignored my PM and thus my attempt not to clutter up this thread with more off-topic posts, I'll reply here, but I'm going to try to make it my last one.

I am not saying that you have to be nice all of the time, or agree all of the time, and I don't have any problem with your online personality or with Geek's online personality. I think both of you make a lot of interesting swimming-related posts. What I have a problem with is your going out of your way to bring up issues about Elaine, again and again. That is, you don't have to be nice, but you don't have to go out of your way to be snide either. If it was just once or twice, it wouldn't be so bad, but it's gotten really tiresome, many posts over many months. And I am sorry, but it feels like playground bullying to me.

So, I would respectfully ask, now for the third time: please stop.

swimshark
February 19th, 2011, 08:47 PM
Here are some others:

-- no kids (or unmarried, for that matter), or kids are grown up and moved on
-- your wife trains with you, or trains mostly the same times as you do
-- you do the bulk of your training in the morning hours or during lunch breaks or on weekends, or in some other manner that doesn't take too much time away from family
-- you make money at it
-- you don't, in fact, have a full-time job

I have no interest in IMs and I do think that many practitioners are too obsessive about it. I have seen my share of broken marriages due to the "triathlete widow" (or even the "triathlete affair") syndrome. But some people also manage it just fine with a full-time job and while being good parents/spouses.

And I certainly do not think the article was IM-specific, either. In fact, the sub-title mentions the English Channel, not Kona.

I agree with Chris. My sister and brother-in-law do IMs. They try for a minimum of 1 per year in addition to multiple halfs. For them, they train together, no kids and they are able to afford them plus the travel. Their last IM was an 8 hour drive from home. Usually they fly to their destinations and have to fly their bikes as well. Both of them work full-time in management jobs but train early in the day and after work. They also do lots of training time on the weekends and have a tri coach gearing them towards what to train and when. Training for one does take a lot of time but they manage to do it and balance each other, their jobs and their friends.

Forum Moderator
February 19th, 2011, 08:55 PM
Please stay on topic and refrain from comments about other forum members.

Debate the points not the people.

Kurt Dickson
February 19th, 2011, 11:31 PM
some people also manage it just fine with a full-time job and while being good parents/spouses.

I still submit "managing it just fine" is different than being a good parent when you work 40-60 hours/week and train another 20...not that I would know anything about being a good parent.

I agree, training with a spouse has theoretical benefits (unless you are married to mine...she was once temporarily DQ'd from the largest local triathlon because her bike split was faster than the winning pro male...one race official was quoted as saying, "no way a girl went that fast")...my fragile ego and my weak body can't take the beating.

BTW I kinda miss geek insulting me.

The Fortress
February 20th, 2011, 11:49 AM
I still submit "managing it just fine" is different than being a good parent when you work 40-60 hours/week and train another 20...not that I would know anything about being a good parent.

I agree, training with a spouse has theoretical benefits (unless you are married to mine...she was once temporarily DQ'd from the largest local triathlon because her bike split was faster than the winning pro male...one race official was quoted as saying, "no way a girl went that fast")...my fragile ego and my weak body can't take the beating.

BTW I kinda miss geek insulting me.

I wouldn't count on it to last!

Agree with the first sentence. While I'm not a fan of obsessive helicopter parenting, being absent for substantial periods of time for training, especially while the kids are young, is not much better. "Quality time" is a bit of a rationalization IMO. I sometimes wish Mr. Fort and I did the same sports, though we have done tri relays together. On the other hand, if we did this, who would tend/have tended the kids?

Apparently, the person featured in the article is a friend of Chaos. It will be interesting to see what he has to say after his ban is over.

I am also mildly surprised that most seem to have always supportive amazing spouses. Endurance sports are time consuming. Thus, far only the smilie That Guy :banana: has fessed up to any issues (and I admitted to periodic annoyance.) But, then, perhaps people do not want to discuss sleeping arrangements and such.

That Guy
February 20th, 2011, 12:46 PM
I wouldn't count on it to last!

Agree with the first sentence. While I'm not a fan of obsessive helicopter parenting, being absent for substantial periods of time for training, especially while the kids are young, is not much better. "Quality time" is a bit of a rationalization IMO. I sometimes wish Mr. Fort and I did the same sports, though we have done tri relays together. On the other hand, if we did this, who would tend/have tended the kids?

Apparently, the person featured in the article is a friend of Chaos. It will be interesting to see what he has to say after his ban is over.

I am also mildly surprised that most seem to have always supportive amazing spouses. Endurance sports are time consuming. Thus, far only the smilie That Guy :banana: has fessed up to any issues (and I admitted to periodic annoyance.) But, then, perhaps people do not want to discuss sleeping arrangements and such.

Although I've quit triathlons, it's not like my routine changed wildly as a result. No long bike ride on Saturday, no long run on Sunday, less running on weekdays. I still exercise every day and I still bike for transportation. Overall it amounts to about 10-20% less time exercising. The big difference is that I'm not exhausted all the time. That's the win right there.

Gull and Chaos got bant? I guess I missed the fireworks. :badday:

The Fortress
February 20th, 2011, 12:50 PM
Although I've quit triathlons, it's not like my routine changed wildly as a result. No long bike ride on Saturday, no long run on Sunday, less running on weekdays. I still exercise every day and I still bike for transportation. Overall it amounts to about 10-20% less time exercising. The big difference is that I'm not exhausted all the time. That's the win right there.

Gull and Chaos got bant? I guess I missed the fireworks. :badday:

Well, being exhausted all the time is a problem for other family members! I've heard people complain about "spousal uselessness."

They (and Wookiee) got banned on the Welsford thread for off-topic posts about religion and such.

That Guy
February 20th, 2011, 01:00 PM
Well, being exhausted all the time is a problem for other family members! I've heard people complain about "spousal uselessness."

<shifts uncomfortably in chair>


They (and Wookiee) got banned on the Welsford thread for off-topic posts about religion and such.

Then I guess I didn't miss the fireworks. :) At some point I did resume not visiting NSR-land though.

Chris Stevenson
February 20th, 2011, 01:24 PM
I am also mildly surprised that most seem to have always supportive amazing spouses. Endurance sports are time consuming. Thus, far only the smilie That Guy has fessed up to any issues (and I admitted to periodic annoyance.) But, then, perhaps people do not want to discuss sleeping arrangements and such.

Okay, I'll bite.

I am married to a former college swimmer and we met thru masters swimming, so if anyone is going to be understanding/supportive, she is.

Which doesn't mean there are no issues, ever. Complaints are generally not about parenting (those disagreements are almost always about philosophical differences, not about how much time we are spending on it), but the ones I hear most often are:

-- I swim in the mornings which means that I am gone by the time my wife wakes up. I try to swim 5-6 times per week. Sometimes she misses waking up together. Most often I'll hear this if I want to swim on a weekend morning (something I always clear with her beforehand) after having swum every day during the week. In fact, I'd say that if I *have* swum M-F (doesn't always happen) then she'll ask that I not swim Sat AM. Which is absolutely reasonable, of course, and I'll accept that without complaint (and maybe try to squeeze in a mid-day workout if possible).

-- I go absolutely batty if I have to go more than 1-2 days without working out (yes, I recognize that I am an endorphin addict. There are worse things). This can sometimes make vacation planning a little stressful, especially if we are in the middle of nowhere (eg, a camping trip). We have learned to negotiate things prior to a vacation: some will involve no trips to the gym, some will involve bike rides or OW swimming, other times we will try to find a pool or even a masters team. Now that our son is old enough to be alone for an hour or two, things are a little easier b/c we can work out together. And sometimes we take vacation a little before a major meet (ie during taper time): I don't object to that as long as she doesn't object to me needing to find a pool or other body of water on an almost-daily basis, in an unobtrusive manner as possible.

I'd say those are the two most stressful and recurring training-related points, though others come up off and on. And I'd probably say that my exercise (and hers) has far less effect on our child-rearing than it does on own relationship. But since we've been married for more than 18 years, I guess it has been working out so far.

Mostly my advice would be: clear everything ahead of time, but don't assume that consent always means the other person is happy about it. It needs to be clear that family comes before exercise. On the other hand, for many of us I would assume that regular exercise is associated with happiness too (not to mention health) and in a good relationship I would think that would carry some weight too, as long as it isn't carried to unreasonable extremes. What is "unreasonable" will unfortunately differ from person to person...

I also think that husbands need to be sensitive to the fact that exercise (or lack thereof) can be an especially touchy subject with wives. WE aren't the ones who get pregnant and have to lose the extra pounds; WE generally don't suffer "mommy guilt" as acutely; and I think that we don't have as big a problem with it when we are carrying around a few extra pounds (I realize I may be generalizing outrageously).

aquageek
February 20th, 2011, 02:55 PM
...but don't assume that consent always means the other person is happy about it.

The outward appearance of consent is sufficient for me to assume happiness.

Herb
February 20th, 2011, 04:47 PM
With me and my wife both working full time and raising two kids (oldest one now 7) I feel like I spend half my life trying to figure out how to get to the pool 3 or 4 times a week.
I usually cheat on my job before my wife.

taruky
February 21st, 2011, 02:45 PM
Well, I'm definitely in the category of having a wife who is tolerant but feels worse about herself the more I commit to exercise. I can feel it, I can see it in her eyes. My wife has never been, nor do I think she will ever be into regular exercise. She enjoys yoga once or twice a week and might go on the treadmill once a week for 10 minutes. She is petite naturally and pretty (5'3 105) but not especially strong or toned. She tires easily with exercise, just doesn't seem to have the motivation (and she has regular checkups, no medical reasons for this). She's also a terrible sleeper. She is an educated stay at home mom. Anyone recognize this profile?

I am perfectly happy with her and love her as she is, yet the more in shape I get the less secure she becomes. I am not getting in shape for other women, but I am happy seeing myself fit and I'm really aiming to swim in a master's national meet some day. I exercise maybe 1.5-2 hours a day, usually early in the morning either before or as they are waking up, then go to work (often a 12 hour shift). I purposefully avoid talking about my workouts or my goals with her because she doesn't seem interested or happy when I bring the topic up. At times she has flat out said that the topic makes her feel worse about herself. If I try to encourage her to swim or get involved in something I worry it might come across as not being happy with her as she is.

I admit it would be nice if she shared this interest and we could swim together or talk about our workouts (like some of you). But you can't have everything.

slingshot
February 21st, 2011, 04:02 PM
As the subject of this hatchet job of an article, I will just counsel people not to believe every word they read. That being said, it has come to my attention that I have become the catalyst (or rather lightning rod) for a wide dialogue about life choices and goals and working through relationships.

Mankind is quick to judge and slow to forgive.
G-d is slow to judge and quick to forgive.

I have my utter faith in and fear of G-d. This is my edge, my drive, and the One to whom I answer. I am gifted to have a G-d-fearing family as well, and we are navigating our course as a family.

I have been a competitive athlete for about 30 years now, and those who know me know I am not a gifted athlete, but one who loves training, sport, competition, expanding my boundaries through endurance challenges and the Channels and mountains I navigate with other kindred souls.

Everyone must find his or her way. I was truthful in that I believe some of this is quite selfish. However, the reflection and prayer I undertake while on day-long swims, bike rides and Ironman races empower me to be a better, more patient and compassionate human.

With love,

philoswimmer
February 21st, 2011, 04:15 PM
Well, I'm definitely in the category of having a wife who is tolerant but feels worse about herself the more I commit to exercise. I can feel it, I can see it in her eyes. My wife has never been, nor do I think she will ever be into regular exercise. She enjoys yoga once or twice a week and might go on the treadmill once a week for 10 minutes. She is petite naturally and pretty (5'3 105) but not especially strong or toned. She tires easily with exercise, just doesn't seem to have the motivation (and she has regular checkups, no medical reasons for this). She's also a terrible sleeper. She is an educated stay at home mom. Anyone recognize this profile?

I am perfectly happy with her and love her as she is, yet the more in shape I get the less secure she becomes. I am not getting in shape for other women, but I am happy seeing myself fit and I'm really aiming to swim in a master's national meet some day. I exercise maybe 1.5-2 hours a day, usually early in the morning either before or as they are waking up, then go to work (often a 12 hour shift). I purposefully avoid talking about my workouts or my goals with her because she doesn't seem interested or happy when I bring the topic up. At times she has flat out said that the topic makes her feel worse about herself. If I try to encourage her to swim or get involved in something I worry it might come across as not being happy with her as she is.

I admit it would be nice if she shared this interest and we could swim together or talk about our workouts (like some of you). But you can't have everything.

Is there some exercise that she might like that you could do together? Maybe go for family walks on the weekends or evenings? (We always went for family walks when I was a kid. It set me up for a lifetime of good habits. Thanks, Mom and Dad). Maybe that would make her feel better about herself and your workouts? Just a thought.

The Fortress
February 21st, 2011, 04:20 PM
Well, I'm definitely in the category of having a wife who is tolerant but feels worse about herself the more I commit to exercise. I can feel it, I can see it in her eyes. My wife has never been, nor do I think she will ever be into regular exercise. She enjoys yoga once or twice a week and might go on the treadmill once a week for 10 minutes. She is petite naturally and pretty (5'3 105) but not especially strong or toned. She tires easily with exercise, just doesn't seem to have the motivation (and she has regular checkups, no medical reasons for this). She's also a terrible sleeper. She is an educated stay at home mom. Anyone recognize this profile?



Tell her often that she has a rockin' bod.

How old is she? That might effect sleep. Or have her explore other causes of the sleep problem. Sleep debt can definitely kill anyone's motivation to exercise.

Would she be interested in a workout group? My gym has body pump classes and the like. Many people need a buddy or class to prompt them to exercise.

Chris Stevenson
February 21st, 2011, 04:55 PM
I purposefully avoid talking about my workouts or my goals with her because she doesn't seem interested or happy when I bring the topic up. At times she has flat out said that the topic makes her feel worse about herself.

Change the subject: mention how easily you can lose weight, too. She'll get a plenty good workout smacking you around for an hour or two. :bolt:

(Sorry, I know you were being serious. I think Fortress and philoswimmer gave great advice.)

couldbebetterfly
February 21st, 2011, 06:25 PM
Well, I'm definitely in the category of having a wife who is tolerant but feels worse about herself the more I commit to exercise. I can feel it, I can see it in her eyes. My wife has never been, nor do I think she will ever be into regular exercise. She enjoys yoga once or twice a week and might go on the treadmill once a week for 10 minutes. She is petite naturally and pretty (5'3 105) but not especially strong or toned. She tires easily with exercise, just doesn't seem to have the motivation (and she has regular checkups, no medical reasons for this). She's also a terrible sleeper. She is an educated stay at home mom. Anyone recognize this profile?

I am perfectly happy with her and love her as she is, yet the more in shape I get the less secure she becomes. I am not getting in shape for other women, but I am happy seeing myself fit and I'm really aiming to swim in a master's national meet some day. I exercise maybe 1.5-2 hours a day, usually early in the morning either before or as they are waking up, then go to work (often a 12 hour shift). I purposefully avoid talking about my workouts or my goals with her because she doesn't seem interested or happy when I bring the topic up. At times she has flat out said that the topic makes her feel worse about herself. If I try to encourage her to swim or get involved in something I worry it might come across as not being happy with her as she is.

I admit it would be nice if she shared this interest and we could swim together or talk about our workouts (like some of you). But you can't have everything.

I recognise some similarities with my husband's situation. Pre-kids I would swim 4 times per week and would get the "swimming is taking over your life" attitude. He obviously hadn't met some of my team-mates, nor was he interested in meeting them :). However I was working full time and we ended up having our separate social lives as well as our together social lives, so it wasn't like he didn't get out.

Now, I'm the educated stay at home mom that cherishes my 2 days when both kids are in school and I can get to the pool. He has a very demanding job and if he wanted to get in some regular exercise I'm not sure I'd see much of him at all. I do sometimes wonder if he feels bad about not exercising or worries about his weight. I certainly worry about his weight, but know better to tell him he's a fat lazy oaf, as really he's not (overweight yes, but lazy-not really), he's just not particularly disciplined in that area.

I actually agree with him that swimming is a very boring spectator sport and I don't expect him to attend meets, but I do need him to look after the girls if I go to one, which then means that he is doing my job so I can swim. I do sometimes feel bad about that, but then again I make myself available 24/7 to look after the kids due to his long hours. I rarely if ever say if I've had a good workout, cos he really doesn't care, and I don't need his approval.

It does sound like your wife needs something that is "hers" to kind of balance out your swimming time. It doesn't necessarily need to be exercise, particularly as she already has that "rockin' bod". Swimming is my escape, other people I know go to a weekly knitting circle.

:blah::blah::blah::blah: Another long post which has some point to it somewhere, honestly.....but I can empathise with both of you.

taruky
February 21st, 2011, 07:19 PM
My wife is 39, going to be 40 in April (I'm 43). In spring and summer we do bike as a family and go on walks a couple days a week. Although my wife made the decision to be a stay at home mom I think it adds to the self-esteem issues. That's another dangerous topic to broach; you have to walk a fine line between appreciating what she does and recognizing what she could have done had she wanted, lol.

Maybe I should do yoga with her. She does do some group classes but pretty sporadically.

Chris, my wife could out lose weight me any day of the week. She would just chuckle if I talked about how easily I lose weight. Now if I stared at my muscles in the mirror and said "you know how many women want this...", that might get her blood boiling, lol.

swimshark
February 21st, 2011, 08:22 PM
My wife is 39, going to be 40 in April (I'm 43). In spring and summer we do bike as a family and go on walks a couple days a week. Although my wife made the decision to be a stay at home mom I think it adds to the self-esteem issues. That's another dangerous topic to broach; you have to walk a fine line between appreciating what she does and recognizing what she could have done had she wanted, lol.

Maybe I should do yoga with her. She does do some group classes but pretty sporadically.

Chris, my wife could out lose weight me any day of the week. She would just chuckle if I talked about how easily I lose weight. Now if I stared at my muscles in the mirror and said "you know how many women want this...", that might get her blood boiling, lol.

Tell her to call me. She and I can go for walks once the weather warms up a bit. A few of us are going to start walking from our kids' school. The more the merrier. I'd love to meet her one day. Maybe we can meet up at the Freedom Ctr for a class.

As for the muscles in the mirror :bolt: hee-hee

couldbebetterfly
February 21st, 2011, 10:20 PM
Although my wife made the decision to be a stay at home mom I think it adds to the self-esteem issues. That's another dangerous topic to broach; you have to walk a fine line between appreciating what she does and recognizing what she could have done had she wanted, lol.



Oh yes - I must admit, I go through ups & downs about it myself. I worked for a while after my 1st was born, but decided that my incremental salary after childcare just wasn't worth the stress and feeling that I wasn't being a good mom or a good department manager. I guess moving here changed things in that I have no work permit, so until I do I can't get a job anyway!

Right now I take the attitude that my job is to look after the kids, be their taxi service, cook, clean (when I have to! I sometimes think I would go back to work solely to justify a housekeeper!),do laundry, pay bills, run errands etc. His job is to go out and make the money so we can have a nice house, nice cars and afford all the stuff we have.

It sounds pretty anti-feminist and all that, but I for one would rather be able to stay home with our 3 yo and pick our 7yo up from school everyday than be a stressed out partner in an accountancy firm, living on fast food and seeing my kids for a couple of hours in the evening.

A lot depends on your outlook, appreciate everything she does, and respect her intelligence and education. My husband still sometimes asks me for input on problems he has at work!

Didn't this start out as a workout thread? :bolt:

gobears
February 22nd, 2011, 07:37 AM
A lot depends on your outlook, appreciate everything she does, and respect her intelligence and education.



That's the key right there. Until you've stayed at home with small children 24/7, 365 days a year, you'll never know just how difficult a job it can be. Respect goes a long way.

taruky--have you ever given your wife a weekend (or longer) where she could get away from all of you? It's a win/win--she gets time off and you gain a whole new appreciation for her situation. She may just need a break!

thewookiee
February 22nd, 2011, 03:40 PM
When I started dating my current gf, she knew up front that I swim for fun and fitness. She understands that I like to swim 5-6 days a week. I need the fix from swimming to make me somewhat sane. Lucky for me, she is very supportive.

taruky
February 22nd, 2011, 07:39 PM
That's the key right there. Until you've stayed at home with small children 24/7, 365 days a year, you'll never know just how difficult a job it can be. Respect goes a long way.

taruky--have you ever given your wife a weekend (or longer) where she could get away from all of you? It's a win/win--she gets time off and you gain a whole new appreciation for her situation. She may just need a break!

Actually this April for her 40th birthday she is going to this fancy spa in Williamsburg. I will take the kids to Busch Gardens and other touring while she stays back at the fancy hotel (whose price made me sweat while making the reservations) and gets 2 full days of pampering. Does that count? LOL.

I think to make my wife really appreciate my newfound love of swimming, I should bring her to a meet like that in the "too much skin" thread.

gobears
February 23rd, 2011, 07:41 AM
Actually this April for her 40th birthday she is going to this fancy spa in Williamsburg. I will take the kids to Busch Gardens and other touring while she stays back at the fancy hotel (whose price made me sweat while making the reservations) and gets 2 full days of pampering. Does that count? LOL.


:applaud: You should definitely get some points for this!

Though I do think that mom going away completely (as in full days and nights away--getting to sleep in and just plain not having to think about anyone else for a few days) is necessary as well. And, that way, dad gets to see what it's like to work as a full-time parent (with every waking and sleeping moment on-call).

My husband was always very supportive and respectful of my staying at home with my kids. But, I left him to parent while I coached at a swim meet on a three-day weekend after we had our first baby. He called me on the second day of the meet and told me he had a whole new level of respect for what I had to do every day. And that was with just one kid! It was a great experience for both of us.

swimshark
February 23rd, 2011, 07:46 AM
Actually this April for her 40th birthday she is going to this fancy spa in Williamsburg. I will take the kids to Busch Gardens and other touring while she stays back at the fancy hotel (whose price made me sweat while making the reservations) and gets 2 full days of pampering. Does that count? LOL.

I think to make my wife really appreciate my newfound love of swimming, I should bring her to a meet like that in the "too much skin" thread.

Oh, can I join her?

chaos
February 25th, 2011, 04:52 PM
let the fact that the same person who owns fox news also owns the WSJ be your guide as to how factual this article might be.

i did a lot of training with jordan this year, and we both swam to france in the shadow of the Pace Arrow. it certainly required a big commitment, and none of us could achieve success without the full support of family and friends, and since this is the 21st century, it is quite easy to keep in close contact with loved ones back home while we are holed up in dover... waiting for the call.

Bobinator
February 25th, 2011, 05:29 PM
I think your Spa birthday gift should score major points!!!!! Great choice!

I only had 3 kids and I stayed home for 8 years so I'm not necessarily an expert. (I always did part-time things such as judging gymnastics, worked 2 nights in a private gym for 4 hours, etc) I'd say the important thing is that you both have mutual respect for each others pursuits and interests and try to help each other have time to do the things you need to do to be a happy and functional person. Family time must also be respected and attended to.
As a mostly stay-home mom I expected to render most services to the kids and family, but again I only had 3 kids so it really wasn't a monumental task.
I normally did my workouts (running back then) 4:45-7:00 a.m. in the morning so my hubby could go to work and I'd be there for kids.
Oh by the way my marriage ended up with a divorce however we are better friends now than when we were married. :chug:

The Fortress
February 25th, 2011, 05:39 PM
but again I only had 3 kids so it really wasn't a monumental task. :chug:

It wasn't?!

Yikes, I'm pretty nackered from it.

Bobinator
February 25th, 2011, 06:09 PM
It didn't make me as tired as I get now. Although now I'm much older.
I really enjoyed the time I spent at home when the kids were little. By the time they were all 3 in school I was back to work full time and the whole situation sucked.
I guess I'm sentimental for the old days.

Celestial
February 25th, 2011, 07:38 PM
Well, I'm definitely in the category of having a wife who is tolerant but feels worse about herself the more I commit to exercise. I can feel it, I can see it in her eyes.

I am perfectly happy with her and love her as she is, yet the more in shape I get the less secure she becomes. I am not getting in shape for other women, . . . At times she has flat out said that the topic makes her feel worse about herself. If I try to encourage her to swim or get involved in something I worry it might come across as not being happy with her as she is.


I have a similar life - I'm about 5'7" and 130lb, my sweetie is 5'9" and about 230lb - he can barely swim at all (IMO) let alone swim the way we do. He was (I think) jealous, at first when I started working out, because a lot of the people I would talk about from the pool were men, just happens there are more men who swim than women (probly due to the childbearing thing) - I have 5 kids, went back to school in my 30's to pursue my doctorate while raising those five - and I think he's absolutely SUPER - so supportive of all my new incarnations. I think what might have helped him was taking him to practice to see that I wasn't flirting with my practice buddies, introducing them to him (so see, he had a "claim" on me) and taking him to meets (my son's meets at this time) so he could get a hold of the excitement. We've been married almost 30 years now & he sure wishes I would play tennis with him, but it messes with my butterfly, so I don't do that much. I wonder if your sweetie gets out of breath or tires easily with exercise because she is not used to it. Remind her that it takes time, and that exercise comes in all forms - chasing after children & keeping the house spotless is a LOT of work & can completely wear me out! More than swimming, I'm sorry to say! :)

couldbebetterfly
February 25th, 2011, 08:52 PM
II only had 3 kids so it really wasn't a monumental task.


Good grief - I must be doing something wrong then. I only have 2, am a SAHM and still find it hard work :afraid:

AnnG
March 1st, 2011, 11:14 AM
The whole family is asleep while I workout. Last year I attended one event, an open water swim, and the family came to cheer me on and shop (their priority was not necessarily in that order). I caught the bug so this is my first year training for multiple events - lake swims in Oregon, another trip to SF bay for sharkfest and a pool meet or two. We'll see how this year goes, but my first pool meet was followed by shopping again, so no complaints so far.

Darrin if you make it to only one open water event in Oregon, make it to the Cascade Lakes series at Elk Lake, five events over three days in a beautiful alpine lake with majestic snow topped mountains as your backdrop, one of my all time favorite places on earth doing one of my all time favorite activities - swimming! You can swim as many or few of the events as you wish. Very social family friendly beach with kid activities planned for Saturday between races.

chowmi
March 1st, 2011, 12:54 PM
I think it really, really helps when your relationship is based on similar values and financial management. I don't think it's absolutely necessary that you and your significant other be athletes, but that you have activities that follow the same path and agreement of time & effort involved (daily schedule), and resources spent.

I can see compatibility with other activities as well. My mother-in-law shows flowers - roses, iris, dayliliies. I've helped her for some of the competitions and it is every bit as competitive as any sport. She's pretty much asked me to leave or be quiet, which I found really funny because she was "in the zone" and getting her game face on. I laugh at myself because it would have been along the lines of her coming to my swim meet and trying to carry my bag for me, or constantly asking who's who because everyone has the same black colored kneeskin and is about 5 10 and 140 lbs. (Yes, those flowers all look alike to me!) (And i'm actually 5 8 1/2 but the optical illusion is that I am taller! hooray!)

And if you aren't in alignment for the template of your life, then it's even that much more exacerbated (sp?) when you have kids. I don't like hearing parents complain about the other parent and how they "aren't supportive" of the ways their kids are raised. It usually is a difference in their core values to begin with.