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Paredes
November 15th, 2011, 06:35 PM
I guess some background information may help you in answering my question. Hello, my name is Alex and I am quickly approaching my last year of high school swimming. Last high school season I finished my 200 yard free with my best time of 2:12.17 (not that stellar I know :cry: ) However I did end up getting second place overall. Now next high school season I'm ranked first in the 200 yard free, but there's always room for improvement. I would LOVE to get the school record (1:55.45) by may 2012 but that's pushing it I think. So how do you swim a 200 free?

Last 200 yard free I swam I got a time of 2:17.09 I tried breathing every 4 the whole race and it really tired me out.

I believe my next strategy is going to be

1st 25 - go 99% breathing every 4
75 - 500 pace breathing every 2
50 - going 100% breathing every 6
50 - anything I got left

jaadams1
November 15th, 2011, 07:23 PM
How do you swim a 200 yard free?

Honestly...it's basically an all out adventure. BUT this is more of a controlled sprint. You HAVE TO BREATHE!!! Don't try to go without air on this race or it will bite you hard!!! I go fast but start breathing every stroke (always to the right) after the initial 25 (which I breathe every 4 or 2 strokes). 3rd 50 is where you've got to give it everything...that's the 50 that will win the race, when most people want to give in to the pain and back off a little. Continue breathing though all the way to the end...it's okay to put your head down for those final 4-5 strokes to the finish.
Your training background is key though. You can't just do a bunch of shorter stuff with lots of rest. You need to train for pain, with shorter rest between your reps of 50s, 100s, etc. I like doing lots of 125s and 150s as well, because I can put more speed into them and get a little more yardage per rep, but I still try to set an interval that gives me ~10-15 seconds of rest or so (depending on the distance being covered).
For example, yesterday I did 10 x 150s @ 2:00 (holding between 1:45-1:50s on each one). Find an interval that works well for you and try doing multiple fast paced (80-85%) repeats while having about :10-:15 seconds rest. This will build your endurance a lot more for the 200 Free.
It's gonna take hard work, but you'll be happy with yourself, even with a 10-15 second drop will be great!!! Depending on how much you can train...Go get that record!!

quicksilver
November 15th, 2011, 08:37 PM
I believe my next strategy is going to be

1st 25 - go 99% breathing every 4
75 - 500 pace breathing every 2
50 - going 100% breathing every 6
50 - anything I got left

The intentions are great, but this is definitely a recipe for crash and burn. It's better to build in to the race rather than giving it all you've got right up front.

Some people try going with easy speed on the first 3 or 4 laps, and then they hang on for the back half. Maybe try going out with less effort on your next attempt, and really work the last three laps. I like your last 50 startegy. That's perfect.

And why are you so intent on breathing every six? There's much to be said about getting air! Breathing less on the back half is going to deplete every muscle of much needed oxygen. If you try taking more breaths as an experiment next time, you may see a noticeable improvement.


Good luck.

swimshark
November 15th, 2011, 08:52 PM
First 100 is relaxed, breathing as I want.
3rd 50 is a build to a sprint, breathing as I can.
4th 50 is all out sprint, breathing every 3 usually.

This is how my coach has taught us and it's done well for me.

Paredes
November 15th, 2011, 11:41 PM
Thanks for all your help!

knelson
November 16th, 2011, 12:36 AM
I tried breathing every 4 the whole race and it really tired me out.

Don't worry about breathing in a 200. You definitely don't want to beathe every 6 on the third 50. That's just insanity! Most people will breathe every two the entire time. If you like to bilateral breathe than breathe every 3.

And if you want to swim fast you can't really hold back too much in the first 100. No, you can't start out at a dead sprint, but ideally you should only be a few seconds slower than what you can go for an all-out 100 (maybe three seconds slower or so?). Then the key is being able to hold on for the second hundred without dropping much speed. Simple, right? :)

pwb
November 16th, 2011, 10:59 AM
I'll concur with Kirk on breathing. Watch videos of Phelps and Lochte swimming this and I think you'll see them breathe every 2 practically the entire race. The key place where you gotta train yourself NOT to breathe is the first stroke off the turn; breathing right off the wall can really disrupt the flow and the speed created by a strong pushoff and streamline. As far as pacing the 200, I particularly like to think about building my legs/kick gradually throughout the race, about keeping my stroke length as long as possible for the first 100 and then build the stroke rate over the last 100. If you are a good dolphin kicker, learn to build that in as part of each underwater pushoff.

fmracing
November 16th, 2011, 11:33 AM
What they said. I breathe every 3rd for the first 100 keeping the kick light, ramp up the kick the last 12 yards of the first 100. 3rd 50, switch to every 2nd stroke for breathing and start blasting the kick. Bring it home that last 50. Fight the pain.

If you want to go 1:55, you're gonna need to take that race out in 55-56ish as easy speed. If your sprint 100 is currently 55, you may have a hard time maintaining your speed to make 1:55. If you can do 55 as reasonably easy speed, you shouldn't have any problem breaking 1:55.

EJB190
November 16th, 2011, 11:36 AM
200 is debatably the hardest race in swimming. If you've ever run a 400 (1 lap) in track I think they are very similar. If you imagine just building to full speed over the entire length of the track, that's the most efficient route.

I would agree with building your speed throughout the 50's. I don't think it's in your best interest to go 99% on the first 50. That implies that you only have 1% for the rest of your race :). You don't need to psych out your competition since they can't necessarily see you. Kicking is also important. I feel all to often people focus too much on their arms and not enough on their legs.

Turning is definitely important. If you're not in a tight streamline, breathing on the first stoke, and breathing in-between the flags, you're adding a lot of time. When I was in HS I can't tell how much time I was able to cut off my races just by improving my turns.

Good luck with your goal. 1:55 is tough time to beat but if you're focused you can do it. What is your 50 Free time?

Paredes
November 16th, 2011, 11:51 AM
What is your 50 Free time?


My 50 free time is a 26.56 :)

jaadams1
November 16th, 2011, 12:16 PM
My 50 free time is a 26.56 :)

That will be tough to be a 1:55 with a 26.5 as a best 50 time.

This is how I split my 200 Free at Nationals last spring. Yeah, it's not the best splitting there, and I went out too fast considering the conditioning I was in prior to the meet.

25.67 / 28.76 (54.4) / 30.17 / 30.33 (1:00.5) = 1:54.93

You've got to have the right mix of speed and pacing in the 200. It's tough because you can't go out too slow because you just won't be able to come back fast enough to make up for it, but also the reverse...if you go out too fast (like my above splits), you don't have enough left on the back half. It's a very tough race to get perfect.

__steve__
November 16th, 2011, 12:23 PM
Definitely read through the suggestions above, excellent information. :)

26.56 - 50
2:12 - 200
Just curious, what's your 500?

fmracing
November 16th, 2011, 12:34 PM
That will be tough to be a 1:55 with a 26.5 as a best 50 time.

Indeed. You need an average of 28.7's. That's gonna be really tough to do unless you can fix some other things for easy speed like turns and the start/finish. If you're wasting time somewhere on those currently, its conceivable you'll be able to use those to help bring that average down.

Whats your 100 time? What is the split time for the 100?

fatboy
November 16th, 2011, 12:55 PM
Lots of good advice here. I think everyone can give more specific advse once you post your 100 and 500 times (with splits if possible). Good luck on your quest for the record.

Sojerz
November 16th, 2011, 01:36 PM
As is somewhat obvious, a 200 is about stringing 4 - 50s together. I think most swimmers and coaches will tell you that it's often won and lost in the 3rd 50, and like others have said it may be one of the toughest events to train for (the 400 IM is in a league of its own), because it's not a sprint or a long distance event. As jaadams1 and others have said, sets of 50s, 100s, 125s, and 150 repeats get you there. Swimming some sets of repeats as "builds" (build your speed during each repeat) seems helpful to me and also swimming some negative split sets (each repeat in the set faster than the other) seems to help too. The builds will help you learn to pace so that you have gas left for that 3rd 50. The negative splits will help you learn to swim faster when you are getting tired in the 200. My :2cents:

knelson
November 16th, 2011, 02:19 PM
200 is debatably the hardest race in swimming. If you've ever run a 400 (1 lap) in track I think they are very similar.

I'm not a runner, but wouldn't it be more similar to an 800 in track? The 400 in track should be more analogous to a 100 meter swim. The WR in the 400 meter run in 43 seconds and for a 100 meter swim (LC) it's a hair under 47 seconds.

Karl_S
November 16th, 2011, 02:28 PM
OK, so you are 26.56 for the 50 and 2:12 for the 200.
You want to get to 1:55 for the 200.

I like to do this kind of analysis so here goes:
Based on a statistical analysis of NCAA swims,
this source compiled ideal split fractions:
http://www.baymasters.org/pacing.html
For men's 200 free they are:
0.2339 + 0.2543 + 0.2562 + 0.2556
You want to swim a 1:55 = 115s, so your target splits are:
26.90 + 29.24 + 29.46 + 29.39

In principle you have the raw speed to accomplish this,
but as a practical matter you will need a little more
high-end speed.

According to: "Swim to Win: Train Like a Champion, By Ed Nessel"
The racing formula for a 200 free is:
Let X = (best 50 time + 2s)
1st 50 = X
2nd 50 = X + 1.8
3rd 50 = X + 2
4th 50 = X+2.4

In your case, X = 28.56, so your current "ideal" 200 is:
28.56 + 30.36 + 30.56 + 30.96 = 2:00.44

(Note that this doesn't correspond exactly to the ideal
split fractions based on the analysis of NCAA swims,
but it is very close.)

So the good news is that through proper splitting
and working on your endurance, you should be capable
of 2:00.44 with your current high-end speed limit.
That's a 12s drop, and that would be really sweet.

Now you need to find another 5s in the 200.
Given your target of 1:55 = 115s, according
to Nessel's racing formula,
4X + 6.2 = 115 => X=27.2,
so you need a 25.2 for your best-effort 50.

We haven't seen you swim, but I'd mention
that a lot of HS swimmers focus too much on
propulsion (trying to go faster) and not enough
on drag (not doing things that slow you down).
If breathing is slowing you down, instead of breathing
less, learn how to breathe so it does not slow you down.
Watch this video:
Michael Phelps freestyle multi angle camera - YouTube
from about :02 - :08 and again from :20 - :25 and again
from :45 - :58. Drill that streamline into your head.

I hope you get your name on the record board.
Post a pic if you do.

Paredes
November 16th, 2011, 02:41 PM
Lots of good advice here. I think everyone can give more specific advse once you post your 100 and 500 times (with splits if possible). Good luck on your quest for the record.

My 100 free time is a 57.94 with a split of 26.66

My best 500 free time is a 6:08, but the splits weren't taken at the meet lol, instead I have the splits from last season where I went a 6:11.95 with


Laps 30.79 ,34.60 ,37.33 ,37.82 ,38.13 ,38.78 ,39.03, 39.26, 39.26, 36.95

I also have the splits from a 200 free where I went a 2:15.26

Laps 29.84, 33.81, 36.03, 35.58

Paredes
November 16th, 2011, 03:05 PM
Now you need to find another 5s in the 200.
Given your target of 1:55 = 115s, according
to Nessel's racing formula,
4X + 6.2 = 115 => X=27.2,
so you need a 25.2 for your best-effort 50.

We haven't seen you swim, but I'd mention
that a lot of HS swimmers focus too much on
propulsion (trying to go faster) and not enough
on drag (not doing things that slow you down).
If breathing is slowing you down, instead of breathing
less, learn how to breathe so it does not slow you down.
Watch this video:
Michael Phelps freestyle multi angle camera - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ax77_hHq9Dc)
from about :02 - :08 and again from :20 - :25 and again
from :45 - :58. Drill that streamline into your head.

I hope you get your name on the record board.
Post a pic if you do.

Thanks for all your advise! I truly think I'm very capable of going a 25 on a 50. I'll take your advise and focus on less drag, but for breathing I don't know if its a problem or not. Just most coaches have taught me less breathes = more aerodynamic = less time. And for that record board pic, we don't even have a pool haha, but then we're still the fastest high school boy's team in the city! Funny how that works huh :)

quicksilver
November 16th, 2011, 03:39 PM
Just most coaches have taught me less breathes = more aerodynamic = less time. They're right. The fastest 50 specialist often don't breathe at all. If they do, it's only a couple.

Head position has a lot to do with remaining in the ideal position without a negative impact on speed. If you work on this particular aspect (stealthy head position), it's very possible to breath all you want and still go just as fast.

Jason Lezak can be seen breathing every stroke while anchoring one of the most exciting relays ever. Not saying you should copy his style, just pointing out that breathing doesn't necessarily slow someone down.

4x100M freestyle relay Jason Lezak's amazing finish - YouTube

ourswimmer
November 16th, 2011, 04:15 PM
Just most coaches have taught me less breathes = more aerodynamic = less time.

If this statement is true at all it is true only for races lasting less than about 45 seconds. Someone who can swim :57 for the 100 should be able to go under 2:10 in the 200 and under 5:45 in the 500, but not without breathing.

rxleakem
November 16th, 2011, 05:21 PM
Ande has good advice here for even/negative splitting:

U.S. Masters Swimming Discussion Forums - View Single Post - Ande's Swimming Tips: Swimming Faster Faster


I think of the race as 4 50's, with the third as your all out like many here say. You need to be strong in the first half, but conserve a bit to power through the last 100. Resist the temptation to go out like a jack rabbit; contrary to Steven Tyler, they do die. You don't want to.

__steve__
November 16th, 2011, 05:22 PM
Here's workout (by Mr. Thornton)::)

U.S. Masters Swimming Discussion Forums - View Single Post - How much time on a broken 200?

orca1946
November 16th, 2011, 05:25 PM
You need to breathe to run all the 4 x 25. I go 85 - 90 - 95 & all out the last 25.

Ex-distance guy
November 16th, 2011, 07:19 PM
The 200 hurts. A lot (in almost every stroke). Its like a long sprint to some of us.

Sojerz
November 16th, 2011, 07:49 PM
There are different strategies for swimming this race in HS duel meets where you are competing for points, as opposed to a meet where you are competing for times and for qualifying.

In duel HS meets, I always tried to know who i was swimming against in the 200 and what else i would be swimming and expecting in the meet. The 200 was early in the meet event sequence, so strategy was important. Our coach tracked opponent times from other HS meets and in some cases we scouted the meets to get times. Knowing the opponents times indicated what you were up against. So for instance, if the opponent takes off like a bat, but has slower times than you, you know not to let the "hare" drag you out too fast -- knowing times, you can plan and know that you will catch them on the back end. Also, if you will be swimming the 500 about 20 - 30 min. later and maybe still a relay or two, all in about 1.5 hours, you might want to just swim the 200 to get your place/points and save it for your next races. In a duel meet 200 you can follow a strategy and even change the strategy according to conditions.

The startegy for swimming against time is to work out the splits you need as described previously and then work on technique and conditioning to be able to reach and hold them.

In HS swimming (in my experience) it was hard to be a distance swimmer and lower times a great deal during the meet season. Between practicing hard and 1 or 2 meets a week, plus all the other stuff going on, your body, which is still growing/developing, can't get enough rest to make the big adaptations that come from the training until you rest it. You can easily "plateau" and think you aren't improving, become discouraged, etc. If you've been training hard and eating right, times may drop substantially at the end of the season when the duel meets are over and you can taper, get rest, and let the adaptations resulting from training occur and pay-off. Adaptations from training occur when you rest after you train. No rest, no adaptation.

So as you swim your 200s this year focusing on the 1:55 goal, don't get discouraged if improvement doesn't seem contiuous or proportional to the work you are putting in, and you don't reach the goal before the end of the duel meets. At your age and current times, the taper can produce huge time drops in a 200, provided you've worked to improve your technique and worked hard in your training sets. Good luck and most importantly enjoy the journey.

darrinlajoie
November 16th, 2011, 09:58 PM
I just swam a 200M free earlier this month, my splits:
32.44 1:07.61(35.17) 1:43.31(35.70) 2:17.32(34.01)
The guy next to me was:
32.63 1:07.17(34.54) 1:41.77(34.60) 2:17.56(35.79)

You can see there were different approaches to the race. I knew I had more in me on the 2nd & 3rd 50, but I also had a more important race later. If your last 50 is 1.5 sec faster than the 3rd, somethings not right.

You can check out a bunch of splits on the USMS competition tab - meet results database - event ranking. But also watch for things that don't look right.

ande
November 17th, 2011, 02:47 PM
I guess some background information may help you in answering my question. Hello, my name is Alex and I am quickly approaching my last year of high school swimming. Last high school season I finished my 200 yard free with my best time of 2:12.17 (not that stellar I know :cry: ) However I did end up getting second place overall. Now next high school season I'm ranked first in the 200 yard free, but there's always room for improvement. I would LOVE to get the school record (1:55.45) by may 2012 but that's pushing it I think.
So how do you swim a 200 free?
Last 200 yard free I swam I got a time of 2:17.09 I tried breathing every 4 the whole race and it really tired me out.

I believe my next strategy is going to be

1st 25 - go 99% breathing every 4
75 - 500 pace breathing every 2
50 - going 100% breathing every 6
50 - anything I got left

My comment on your strategy for your next 200 is
NO NO NO NO NO

YOU WILL NOT SWIM THE FASTEST TIME YOU ARE CAPABLE OF BY GOING ALL OUT ON THE 1st 25 or 50 OF YOUR 200.
All that will do is
Make you swim slower than you could have and
make you hurt way worse than you should have.

1st.
Breathe every 2 or 3,
the only exception is, if you can,
don't breathe the last 5 meters of your race.
air is CRITICAL VITAL ESSENTAL ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY

2nd
200's should be swum at 200 pace.
Correct splitting is critical.
Control the effort you expend during the race.
Breathe often. Don't go all out. Keep your last 3 50's around the same time.
Finish strong and fast.

Swim Faster Faster can help you a lot.

SFF tips on correct splitting


Tip 12 Correct Splitting


Tip 74 How to Correctly Split the 200 Breast and 200 Fly


SFF Tip 266 how to correctly split & incorrectly split a 200 (revisited)


Tip 345 Correct Splitting


What are your times for 50, 100, & 500?
How many times a week do you train?
How far per practice?
Do you have a coach?
What intervals can you hold?
What kinds of sets do you do?

Consider this:

1st 50 Go 89% to 93% breathe every 2 or 3, feel like you could go faster, gentle kick, lots of air
2nd 50 stay steady (your 100 SPLIT should be 2 - 4 sec slower than your ALL OUT 100
3rd work it
4th bring it home as fast as you can, be fierce and tough.

Proper race strategy might help you improve your time by 1/2 to 1.5 sec per 100
Proper training is how you breakthrough and make massive improvements.

If you're 26 in the 50, 57 in the 100 & 2:12 in the 200, you need to get in better condition.
Train for the 500, 200 & 100.

knelson
November 17th, 2011, 03:26 PM
Proper race strategy might help you improve your time by 1/2 to 1.5 sec per 100
Proper training is how you breakthrough and make massive improvements.

Ande speaks the truth! Based on the splits you provided earlier in the thread it is clear that you need to tighten up your splits. An eight second drop-off from the first to the second 100 is too much. This tells me you don't have the aerobic conditioning to swim a great 200 and/or your stroke technique needs improvement. If your technique is poor it will ruin your efficiency and you will tire more quickly.

cclarke
November 17th, 2011, 04:17 PM
Agree with Ande and Kirk's comments. Similar advice to Ande but this is how I approach my 200 free:

1st 50 - I tell myself to hold back a little - in the excitement of the race you want to go out hard! Don't do it! "Easy" speed here.
2nd 50 - Maintain a good steady strong pace
3rd 50 - This is where you start to go harder - bring in the kick a little more and build - you should "feel" like you are going faster than the 2nd 50
4th 50 - Give this 50 everything you have left and focus on a good turn off the last wall (200 scy/m) - bring it home

Good conditioning will allow you to bring the 2nd 100 home and have that split closer to the 1st 100. I breathe every two or three strokes the whole way. I have a big frame that needs as much O2 as I can get in!
:2cents:

scyfreestyler
November 18th, 2011, 05:14 PM
I went 26, 56 and 2:01 last year, so my 50 and 100 times aren't too far off from you. I think my 200 was 29, 30, 31, 31. I breathed every stroke to the left and tried to hold back a bit on the first 50. Withholding oxygen in a race like this isn't something I would care to experiment with.

There is no shortage of great advice in this thread. Good luck!

EJB190
November 21st, 2011, 12:21 AM
I'm not a runner, but wouldn't it be more similar to an 800 in track? The 400 in track should be more analogous to a 100 meter swim. The WR in the 400 meter run in 43 seconds and for a 100 meter swim (LC) it's a hair under 47 seconds.

I say the 200 in swimming is much like the 400 in track not because of the duration, but how the race is not long enough to be distance, but not a short sprint. It's a long sprint. Basically you have to give it your all the entire time. A 100 is only 4 laps and doesn't seem that long to sprint. An 800 in track is 2 laps, so you're getting closer to a distance event. A 200 in swimming however is a rather lengthy sprint, as is a 400.

I don't know if you've ever tried running a 400 on a track but it's not as easy task, nor is a 200 as far as I'm concerned. I had pretty good 50F (23.1), 100F (49.9), and 500F (4:58.2) times back in HS. My 200F though, was awful in comparison, if not pathetic. I don't even remember what it was.

__steve__
November 21st, 2011, 09:50 AM
I say the 200 in swimming is much like the 400 in track not because of the duration, but how the race is not long enough to be distance, but not a short sprint.
I agree on this comparison, after running 400's for time.

Even though the 400M run's time is closer to 100 LCM, doesn't it seem like it needs to be approached more like the 200 swim in regards to effort level at various stages of the race? As factor it also possesses greater quantity of suffering and net time penalty if taken out too hard.

It would be an interesting read to find what energy systems are involved with each (or to understand such an article:coffee:)

Eaglesrest
November 21st, 2011, 10:20 AM
I agree on this comparison, after running 400's for time.

Even though the 400M run's time is closer to 100 LCM, doesn't it seem like it needs to be approached more like the 200 swim in regards to effort level at various stages of the race? As factor it also possesses greater quantity of suffering and net time penalty if taken out too hard.

It would be an interesting read to find what energy systems are involved with each (or to understand such an article:coffee:)
This article has an interesting description of which energy systems are prioritised during different stages within a race/time periods:

http://www.brianmac.co.uk/energy.htm

there are a couple of other good articles too:
http://www.brianmac.co.uk/swimming/swimplan.htm
http://www.brianmac.co.uk/swimming/swimspeed.htm

Speedo
November 21st, 2011, 11:04 AM
Mike Ross (letsrace) wrote a nice description of his 200 free strategy a while back. I have lost my ability to pace that race effectively, so I will be going through the forum archives when I have the chance, and will post what I find here.

ande
November 21st, 2011, 11:33 AM
your times & splits are:

50 fr
26.56

100 fr
57.94
26.66 31.28

200 fr
2:15.26
29.84, 33.81
36.03, 35.58

500 fr
6:08 no splits
6:11.95
30.79 34.60
37.33 37.82
38.13 38.78
39.03 39.26
39.26 36.95

If you compare your 50 & 100 to your 200 & 500
you have OK speed but need conditioning & endurance.
in 100 your 50 splits are 4.6 seconds apart
in your 200 your 100 splits are 7.9 seconds apart
it is a splitting or race strategy issue but it more about conditioning,
you need to train harder faster further more often.

You might have some technique issues, but can't help you unless we see you swim.

How many times a week do you train?
How far per practice?
What kind of sets can you make?
What sort of intervals can you hold?
How fast can you flutter kick with a board? 25. 50, 75, & 100
Have you taken breaks between seasons?
Where do you train?
Who's your coach?
Who's your team mates?
What kind of suit do you wear in meets?
how tall are you?
How much do you weigh?

Train for the 500, 200, 100 & 50 & everything will improve
Train with the best team, coach and swimmers in your area
Put in some serious work. for weeks and months
Do 4 - 6k per practice
swim 6 to 9 times a week

get to where you can hold repeat 100's in practice on 1:20, then 1:15, then 1:10 then 1:05

EJB190
November 22nd, 2011, 10:54 AM
I agree on this comparison, after running 400's for time.

Even though the 400M run's time is closer to 100 LCM, doesn't it seem like it needs to be approached more like the 200 swim in regards to effort level at various stages of the race? As factor it also possesses greater quantity of suffering and net time penalty if taken out too hard.

It would be an interesting read to find what energy systems are involved with each (or to understand such an article:coffee:)

I'm not quite sure why a 400 feels more like a 200 than a 100, either. It seems that if you use all your energy in ~50 seconds, you'd be dead faster swimming rather than running. Thus a 400 should feel more like a 200. Good question.

I did track for one year. I did very well in the 400. I was actually in the state tournament for it. The 200F, never mastered to my standards haha. In my coach's words "Why are you so bad at the 200" haha. I guess I have a goal now.

XC_Stallion92
November 22nd, 2011, 11:50 AM
I'm not quite sure why a 400 feels more like a 200 than a 100, either. It seems that if you use all your energy in ~50 seconds, you'd be dead faster swimming rather than running. Thus a 400 should feel more like a 200. Good question.

I did track for one year. I did very well in the 400. I was actually in the state tournament for it. The 200F, never mastered to my standards haha. In my coach's words "Why are you so bad at the 200" haha. I guess I have a goal now.

I've done both at a high level and still run collegiately. A good rule of thumb that's always worked for me is to just multiply the swimming distance by 4 and that's a pretty good comparison, especially on the shorter distance end. The 800 is usually run by just getting through the first 500 as quickly but easily as possible, then you're all out for 300 meters. It's still a glorified sprint, very similar in tactics and effort to a hard 200 swim. As for the systems used, it's a pretty even aerobic/anaerobic mix, which is always what I felt necessary for the 200 swim.

EJB190
November 22nd, 2011, 11:57 AM
I think I was turned off from the 200 long ago when I lost count and swam 250 yards. That's my 2nd most embarrassing moment in swimming.

Paul Smith
November 22nd, 2011, 12:50 PM
"out" with the arms, "back" with the legs hammer the middle 100 and hang on best you can the last 50...never hold your breath in this race.

TRAIN IT/RACE IT A LOT...it's all about conditioning and tempo.

couldbebetterfly
November 23rd, 2011, 09:04 PM
"out" with the arms, "back" with the legs.

I'll remember that.

Here's my latest 200m for the OPs comparisons:
35.55 1.13.98 1.53.44 2.32.64

A guy in the same heat, but way across the pool went:
33.89 1.11.95 1.51.75 2.32.81

chris@mvm
December 7th, 2011, 12:42 AM
i used to have all sorts of trouble with the fry and die when I thought about the 200 as a sprint. Per the late great George Haines, it isn't. You work the middle 100. Here's how I do it, and when I changed to this way in high school, my 200 went from 2:10 to 2:03. Got even better as I went through college, and I love swimming it as a 50 year old Masters swimmer.

First 50--control. Set your rhythm and breathing. Light kick unless you have the legs of a god. If you're going more than 3 strokes between breaths, make sure your will is in order. You will die like a pig.

Second 50--build. Hold onto your breathing, and begin pressing your pace forward. Don't let your mechanics go.

Third 50--go. Open it up and go, but keep the air coming in. Always keep sharp on the mechanics. If you've got the legs left, bring 'em, but don't burn them out.

Fourth 50--keep it up and bring it home. This is where you find out if you've been putting forth an honest effort in practice.

I am happy if the drop off between my first 100 and second 100 is 3 sec or less.