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cnw126
February 13th, 2012, 04:09 PM
Hello,

I have a question regarding etiquette when sharing/splitting a lane that is against the wall (with the ladders).

Today a woman wanted to share my lane with me but was perturbed when I told her that I wanted the pool side of the lane.

It is my feeling that if I am in the lane first I get to decide what side I want, either the wall side or the pool side.

Is there a general rule or some type of etiquette that I am not aware of?

cjquill
February 14th, 2012, 09:52 AM
The person who was in the lane first gets first choice. I often split with a lady who prefers the wall side.

ggridley
February 14th, 2012, 09:52 AM
I doubt the pool has a rule. Probably the best practice for etiquette is to chill. If she wants the wall, let her. If your side of the wall is the ladder, when you get to the wall, unless she's standing right there, you can always move over and flip turn a little in the middle and then glide to your side. No big deal. Otherwise doing a turn 3 feet from the wall is a good drill anyway.

Peace

slow
February 14th, 2012, 10:08 AM
Hello,

I have a question regarding etiquette when sharing/splitting a lane that is against the wall (with the ladders).

Today a woman wanted to share my lane with me but was perturbed when I told her that I wanted the pool side of the lane.

It is my feeling that if I am in the lane first I get to decide what side I want, either the wall side or the pool side.

Is there a general rule or some type of etiquette that I am not aware of?

A pool I swim at occasionally has a sign saying that all shared lanes are circle swim. So there would be no splitting lanes there, apparently.

But in the absence of such signs, I think what you did was fine. If I were in her position, I would have been 100% okay with things.

knelson
February 14th, 2012, 10:29 AM
My opinion is the person there first gets to choose. That only seems fair.


Is there a general rule or some type of etiquette that I am not aware of?

The only thing you seem to be forgetting is some people think everything is about them! You did nothing wrong.

pwb
February 14th, 2012, 11:27 AM
You did the right thing.

However, if you do ever find yourself in that situation again (where the other person is not being polite), I always find that some fast 25s butterfly tends to ward off lane interlopers.

Butterfly is to noodlers (or lap swimmers who don't know how to share lane-space or circle properly) as garlic is to vampires

gdanner
February 14th, 2012, 11:49 AM
Offer to do a swim-off. Winner picks the side.

EJB190
February 14th, 2012, 12:25 PM
First person in the lane should have the choice.

You should have told her to get her own lane if she wasn't happy.

The Fortress
February 14th, 2012, 12:42 PM
Butterfly is to noodlers (or lap swimmers who don't know how to share lane-space or circle properly) as garlic is to vampires

I haven't found this to be true. :( Where I swim, there can be one person in each lane and an oblivious noodler will still want to jump in my lane even if I'm swimming butterfly or using my monofin. I know it's rude, but on a couple occasions where I'm in the middle of an AFAP fly set, I've asked them to try another lane. My theory is that sprinters are more vulnerable to noodlers since we are "wall hangers," not continuous lap swimmers.

I actually witnessed a screaming match the other day between a noodler and a lap swimmer. The lap swimmer was in the wall lane first. The noodler tried to kick the man out, claiming that only noodlers can have the wall lane and asking him to join another lane. The lifeguard had to intercede.

And first person in definitely gets to choose.

SwimStud
February 14th, 2012, 12:45 PM
It's funny how when using the pool everyone seems to think that it's ok to have an incumbent swimmer adjust to the new arrival's exacting needs beyond just sharing. If you don't they seem to feel you are unreasonable or rude. I wonder how many people would think it OK to walk into the weight room, order the person doing bench press to get up between sets and unrack their weights so you can use the bench to do reverse crunches...basically I feel it's the same thing.

Your response should always be polite but it can be along the lines of sure, you can have that side of the lane.

Patrick I wish fly was a deterrent...it seems like a magnet for double arm backstrokers for me...perhaps they like to get in to try to force me to abandon fly...

knelson
February 14th, 2012, 01:32 PM
I'm sure I've told this story here before, but it's one of my favorites. My wife was lap swimming in her own lane. She noticed a guy on deck kind of staring at the pool, presumably waiting for a lane to open up or something. My wife kept going for a while but then she saw him standing over her lane so she stopped and asked him if he would like to split the lane. He said yes, got in and started swimming. After about a 100 or so I guess he stopped my wife and said something like "this isn't going to work. I think you're going to cross into my half of the lane, so I think you should move." Let's recap: my wife was in the lane first and she wasn't crossing into his side, he was just afraid she might, so she should move.

jaadams1
February 14th, 2012, 02:17 PM
I haven't found this to be true. :( Where I swim, there can be one person in each lane and an oblivious noodler will still want to jump in my lane even if I'm swimming butterfly or using my monofin. I know it's rude, but on a couple occasions where I'm in the middle of an AFAP fly set, I've asked them to try another lane. My theory is that sprinters are more vulnerable to noodlers since we are "wall hangers," not continuous lap swimmers.

I actually witnessed a screaming match the other day between a noodler and a lap swimmer. The lap swimmer was in the wall lane first. The noodler tried to kick the man out, claiming that only noodlers can have the wall lane and asking him to join another lane. The lifeguard had to intercede.

And first person in definitely gets to choose.

I find it true as well, that butterfly doesn't always scare away the lap swimmers. I think they're looking more at sharing with the single person, vs. circle swimming in general. This happens to me all the time. Should I feel guilty that I'm doing fly and the nearly 80 year old lady is almost drowning? :) I vary my sets depending on who's with me, don't worry. :)

Also, if I'm swimming at the Y, I just assume that at some point, I'll have a lanemate, so I just start swimming on the side that works best for me from the beginning.

Celestial
February 15th, 2012, 08:33 AM
Also, if I'm swimming at the Y, I just assume that at some point, I'll have a lanemate, so I just start swimming on the side that works best for me from the beginning.

I do the same thing. While Butterfly may not scare people off, I have found that monster paddles will. I have two sets - the small ones I use the majority of the time, and the ones I put on when I feel threatened by possible lane encroachers!

I sort of have the opposite problem - when I have the good fortune to swim at lunch, because I am able to get there early, I get my own lane at first. Then this really nice, younger, and MUCH faster guy, who can't get there as early, knows I am agreeable to sharing (so many are NOT) - but then I nearly drown! He is very sweet, so I don't say a thing, but inside I'm kinda groaning! Like, if I could keep up with him, I would!! But neither of us complain, because swimming together is definitely better than sharing with a "leisure" swimmer or a noodler! :blush:

KEWebb18
February 15th, 2012, 08:50 AM
Also, if I'm swimming at the Y, I just assume that at some point, I'll have a lanemate, so I just start swimming on the side that works best for me from the beginning.

I tend to do the same thing. I prefer to swim on one side of the lane anyways. I'm not a fan of circling if I don't have to.

I did have one kind lap swimmer last week tell me that I should get the pool side because I was in the lane first and it was bigger. I thought that was very nice of her to say! I told her that I was finishing up and she would have the lane to herself in a few minutes anyway.
Its amazing what being nice will do. Some people are just flat out rude.

2fish&1whale
February 15th, 2012, 09:54 AM
I avoid that lane like the plague.I learned my lesson the hard way by breaking my small toe on the ladder while doing breast stroke kick-I did not realize how much I drifted toward the wall and next thing I know I'm in agony,hopping on one foot.
Needless to say,since then,if I have to swim in the dreaded lane,I stick to the laneline-and it is understood that who ever gets in with me can have the rest of the space-at their own risk.

no200fly
February 15th, 2012, 06:48 PM
I am so glad that I get to swim in an organized workout. I don't know how you can stand the frustration of trying to fit in with casual pool users.

January is distance month for our team so I went in on Sunday to try to get in some extra distance. There is 1 six lane 25 yd pool and half of it was roped off for free swim. In the three "lap" lanes there were the following:

Lane 1 - an elderly woman who swam a combination breaststroke/sidestroke with a twisting 2 1/2 layout breathing technique who swam so slowly that she literally defied the laws of physics.

Lane 2 - an elderly man in full Sea Hunt regalia (sans tank and regulator) who swam what could be best described as a spider crawl - arms and legs never leave the water but instead move to the sides of the body but in the water in a manner that must be designed to make maximum use of the most water possible. Needless to say, this technique is on the slow side of a crawl (that's "a" crawl not "the" crawl).

Lane 3 - a younger (compared to Lanes 1 & 2) person who apparently is training for the boy scout swimming merit badge and is trying to perfect the sidestroke and elementary backstroke sections of the test.

It was apparent that sharing a lane would be dangerous at best and while I was not confident that any of the existing occupants would be able to last very long, there were 2 other people waiting for their chance to take over a lane of their own.

Back to the subject of this thread, if that happened to me I would make a strong suggestion that the new person in the lane go and find another lane that did not have a wall.

Sojerz
February 15th, 2012, 07:38 PM
I find it true as well, that butterfly doesn't always scare away the lap swimmers. I think they're looking more at sharing with the single person, vs. circle swimming in general. This happens to me all the time. Should I feel guilty that I'm doing fly and the nearly 80 year old lady is almost drowning? :) I vary my sets depending on who's with me, don't worry. :)

Also, if I'm swimming at the Y, I just assume that at some point, I'll have a lanemate, so I just start swimming on the side that works best for me from the beginning.

I was also yelled at by a bunch of 70+ yr old busy-body noodlers for swimming fly and allegedly swamping an 80 yr old - she later told me she was just fine. The noodlers also try to get in the lanes ahead of time to clog it up and complain loudly about making waves in the pool, which apparenlty inhibits floating and chatting (must make them sea sick). Even the lap swimmers at the Y don't like faster swimmers cause of the wake. The lanes are marked slow, medium and fast, and no one pays any attention - the guards don't care cause they're chatting with the noodlers.

I don't mind swimming doubled up, stop my fly for an approaching swimmer, and always ask someone standing on the deck to jump in, no matter how big there mask and snorkel. However, I am dying to put my thumb over the snorkel hole (Caddie Shack) when standing at the pool end and one these guys makes a closed U-turn.:D

EJB190
February 16th, 2012, 10:29 AM
My my my... The perception of noodlers here is quite funny. There's probably a water aerobics site somewhere that complains about all those stupid lap swimmers. The fact is, they pay as much as we do to be there. That said, they should be respectful enough to know that lap swimmers can't swim with a ladder in the way and that's its more efficient to "circle noodle" (new term) than to take up 7.5 lanes.

The pool I use in boston is 3 lanes. One of them has a ladder in it. Usually I can get my own lane, occasionally I have to share, but sometimes I have to circle swim. This is extremely frustrating because I am almost always the fastest swimmer in the water. I feel awkward touching people's feet, especially every lap or so. I'm not sure if they understand that I'm being polite, asking them to pass, and not trying to be rude***. I actually love circle swimming when doing it with people of my ability. The choppiness of the water is... invigorating and reminds me of the good old swim team days.

I also find many people don't understand the concept of circle swimming and lane splitting. I've seen far too many accidents at this one pool.

Back in HS- one day there was this huge water aerobics fiesta. They took out one lane line to make one large whirl pool of noodles. The pool had a separate diving well, so the lap pool was about 5ft deep. The whirl pool was so strong that apparently the swimmers in the adjacent lane (freshman/sophomores) were having problems with their flip turns because of the suction caused by the whirlpool.

***What are your thoughts on the foot touching?

Calvin S
February 16th, 2012, 10:42 AM
***What are your thoughts on the foot touching?


Well in club workouts, I use the foot touch ONCE if I am preparing to pass someone and we are within 5-7 yards of the turn. Sometimes people don't realize you are bearing down on them, and I want the person to know that they should not "cross over" the lane while flipping, that I am going to move up along side them and flip and push off. Now the touch itself is no more than a tap or two on the bottom of the foot. This no foot massage, and I am not doing it to be annoying. Like I said, for me its just a heads up.

The Fortress
February 16th, 2012, 10:50 AM
My my my... The perception of noodlers here is quite funny. There's probably a water aerobics site somewhere that complains about all those stupid lap swimmers. The fact is, they pay as much as we do to be there.

They do pay as much. But if you figure you are paying for half a lane (no one circle swims at my pool), noodlers are often getting more than their fair share. Noodlers either get their own lanes or force real swimmers to modify their workouts because they are often either flailing about with arms and legs akimbo or are, sorry to say it, overly large.

Chris Stevenson
February 16th, 2012, 10:55 AM
Sometimes foot touching is necessary for a heads-up, but just be aware that for some people the practice is like when someone on a highway tailgates and starts flashing his high-beams. I *rarely* do it anymore, and when I do I use a very light touch and only when I worry the person will run into me otherwise.

When there is a large speed differential, I can't imagine when foot touching would be needed.

EJB190
February 17th, 2012, 09:11 AM
Ugh I had this tormenting dream last night about this.

I went to a new pool to try and swim. Everyone was waiting outside the pool for it to open. When it did, there were no open lanes. I asked a girl if I could split a lane, and she reluctantly said yes. I realized the water in this lane was too shallow and my hands would touch the bottom. So I got out and tried to find a deeper lane. I saw a free lane, but then magically 3 people popped into it. Then a free lane finally opened again, but a kid threw up in the water so everyone had to get out. Then they reopened, and I still couldn't get a lane. These themes kept happening over and over again. When I did find a circle swim lane, I was always too slow.

I guess that's what I get reading this thread before going to sleep and reading about inferiority complexes for psychology.

Rob Copeland
February 17th, 2012, 09:35 AM
***What are your thoughts on the foot touching?
Foot touching to indicate you are passing the person in front of you - ACCEPTABLE

Repeated foot touching because you leave 2 seconds behind me, want to draft and are unwilling to lead the lane UNACCEPTABLE

Larry Craig wide stance foot touching -

EJB190
February 17th, 2012, 10:12 AM
Foot touching to indicate you are passing the person in front of you - ACCEPTABLE

Repeated foot touching because you leave 2 seconds behind me, want to draft and are unwilling to lead the lane – UNACCEPTABLE

Larry Craig wide stance foot touching - …

I agree with this. I feel like some people that swim, particularly older people, don't understand this concept. Maybe it's just the snooty New Englanders. They look at me as if I completely violated them.

I guess if I make them feel uncomfortable enough they'll leave and then they won't be in my way at all.

I hate having a 3 lane pool.

rxleakem
February 17th, 2012, 04:51 PM
Maybe it's just the snooty New Englanders.
Ouch! At first, I thought :nono: then :shakeshead: but now I'm just left to :cry:

Anyways, as far as the original post, the person getting into the lane should yield to the swimmer already there, just like the cars from the on-ramp ought to.

As far as foot touching, I might suggest that most lap swimmers probably get upset because they are forced out of their zone, and many may just not be used to this practice ("What, is the pool on fire?"). I grew up with it as a swimmer in age groups, so the fitness swimmer that never experienced it might just be unaware, and that we are trying to prevent accidents.

If I have to tap a toe or tickle a foot, I make sure to say "Thanks" when I see them later in the workout. Maybe flatlander's are just not as gentle when tapping? :thhbbb: :bolt:

Fresnoid
February 17th, 2012, 05:03 PM
Wow,this thread makes me really grateful there are 20+ organized masters workouts/week I can choose from within 10 minutes of my house.

ElaineK
February 17th, 2012, 07:45 PM
Ouch! At first, I thought :nono: then :shakeshead: but now I'm just left to :cry:

Anyways, as far as the original post, the person getting into the lane should yield to the swimmer already there, just like the cars from the on-ramp ought to.

As far as foot touching, I might suggest that most lap swimmers probably get upset because they are forced out of their zone, and many may just not be used to this practice ("What, is the pool on fire?"). I grew up with it as a swimmer in age groups, so the fitness swimmer that never experienced it might just be unaware, and that we are trying to prevent accidents.

If I have to tap a toe or tickle a foot, I make sure to say "Thanks" when I see them later in the workout. Maybe flatlander's are just not as gentle when tapping? :thhbbb: :bolt:

Great use of Smilies! :applaud:

This thread makes me thankful for one good thing about the 84 degree noodler pool in my community's recreation center: I get to swim in my own lane! :bliss: As much as I would love to see more swimmers move into our community and join USMS, I am very thankful I have never had to share a lane. I also get my own lane in the coached program I go to at another pool, because there are so few people in the program and plenty of space available. :ohyeah:

rxleakem
February 17th, 2012, 10:15 PM
Great use of Smilies! :applaud:

Thanks E - I am learning from you and the boys in the Northwest where the fun is! :carolers:

Our pool is warm too, and the funny thing is that some of the same folks using it were putting in their 50 lap swims when I was lifeguarding and swimming there 20 years ago! :cheerleader:

EJB190
February 17th, 2012, 10:29 PM
Ouch! At first, I thought :nono: then :shakeshead: but now I'm just left to :cry:

I'm from Connecticut, which comes from the native american word for "land of people with sticks up their ***", so don't take offense to the New Englander comment. Besides, I find people northern New England (VT, NH) to be much nicer than MA and CT.

The point is, if you've never swam with a team before. You may not understand that playing footsies isn't unintentional, rude, or creepy. That's where the problem exists I believe.

gigi
February 17th, 2012, 10:38 PM
Besides, I find people northern New England (VT, NH) to be much nicer than MA and CT.



Haha! HOooooo - that's a good one!

jaadams1
February 17th, 2012, 10:39 PM
Thanks E - I am learning from you and the boys in the Northwest where the fun is! :carolers:

:cheerleader:

:duel:James and Kirk - 400 IM
:duel:James and That Guy - 100 Fly
:duel:That Guy vs. the world - 50 Fly (somehow he's the #1 seed)
:duel:James and Kirk - 100 Free
:duel:That Guy and Kirk - 200 IM

We've got a few duels going on this weekend. It should be a lot of smiles all around! :bliss:
And after: :chug:

That Guy
February 17th, 2012, 11:04 PM
:duel:James and Kirk - 400 IM
:duel:James and That Guy - 100 Fly
:duel:That Guy vs. the world - 50 Fly (somehow he's the #1 seed)
:duel:James and Kirk - 100 Free
:duel:That Guy and Kirk - 200 IM

We've got a few duels going on this weekend. It should be a lot of smiles all around! :bliss:
And after: :chug:

There's also Kirk's 200 free, my 200 breast, and my 500 free to sort out. I was surprised at my seeding in the 50 fly. There are a couple college-age guys in the meet and normally the 50 fly is like catnip for that demographic, but they didn't enter the event. :dunno:

jaadams1
February 18th, 2012, 12:49 AM
There's also Kirk's 200 free, my 200 breast, and my 500 free to sort out. I was surprised at my seeding in the 50 fly. There are a couple college-age guys in the meet and normally the 50 fly is like catnip for that demographic, but they didn't enter the event. :dunno:

I'm also interested to see what the 21 year old with the 2:15.00 time in the 200 Fly does. He's the wildcard that I've got to keep an eye on (honestly, I hope I don't see him till after the finish). :)

briefencounter
February 19th, 2012, 02:56 PM
In UK we have none of this nonsense at the pools. Swimming in lanes is designated by signs. There are fast medium and slow lanes and direction of swim is to be clockwise or anticlockwise as shown.

EJB190
February 19th, 2012, 07:19 PM
Haha! HOooooo - that's a good one!

Ahhh, yah from Wustah?

ElaineK
February 19th, 2012, 08:49 PM
:duel:James and Kirk - 400 IM
:duel:James and That Guy - 100 Fly
:duel:That Guy vs. the world - 50 Fly (somehow he's the #1 seed)
:duel:James and Kirk - 100 Free
:duel:That Guy and Kirk - 200 IM

We've got a few duels going on this weekend. It should be a lot of smiles all around! :bliss:
And after: :chug:

Good luck, James, That Guy, and Kirk! May the best :duel:win! :cheerleader:

P.S. Have a :chug: for me!

That Guy
February 20th, 2012, 12:27 AM
Good luck, James, That Guy, and Kirk! May the best :duel:win! :cheerleader:

P.S. Have a :chug: for me!
I think I won all my gridges today, unless there were secret reverse gridges in effect. (Can never rule that out!) We forgot the :chug:... after the meet we scattered like cockroaches when someone turns on a light