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Varna01
March 5th, 2015, 05:06 AM
I have searched throughout the forum and found little information about nutrition and supplements subjects suitable for swimmers. Generally I am against any supplement to improve overall capabilities of a swimmer. However its not always easy to maintain proper nutrition levels due other daily activities, especially with juniors when they are at school and have too many whims at the same time. So I am starting this thread with hope that any of you could share their favourite and sometimes perhaps "weird" recipes for meals that they believe provide proper nutrition with heavy and/or moderate workload swimmers. Meals-to-go recipes and budget for that relevant recipe are very welcomed. And if you are also able to provide data on what and how many elements such as proteins/carbs/iron/calcium etc shall be consumed by that recipe, I will be speachless :)! (last one is of course is just a too big wish).

Thanks!

DeniseMW
March 5th, 2015, 09:31 AM
I don't know what everyone else uses, but I swear by E3Live http://www.e3live.com/, which is what I use in place of vitamins. When I stick to it, I don't get sick, and I have noticeably more energy. Otherwise, you'll get a variety of answers (no fat, no carbs, no gluten, fat, carbs, gluten), so it's probably a trial and error thing until you find what works for you.

marcoab3
March 5th, 2015, 09:46 AM
I don't know what everyone else uses, but I swear by E3Live http://www.e3live.com/, which is what I use in place of vitamins. When I stick to it, I don't get sick, and I have noticeably more energy. Otherwise, you'll get a variety of answers (no fat, no carbs, no gluten, fat, carbs, gluten), so it's probably a trial and error thing until you find what works for you.

How long does a bottle of that E3 stuff last you?

chowmi
March 5th, 2015, 10:00 AM
I used to rarely cook. Proper nutrition was an archilles heel for me. We ate out all the time. But we are on the eve of completing our kitchen remodel, and suddenly I have cooked every meal since 02/20/15 except two (husband's taco night and leftover night). I do think it has made a pronounced effect on the overall improvement in nutritional value (anything would, over fast food and quasi-fast food!) and eventually the budget as well.

Rather than give specific meal plans, I have a "solution" to the dilemma of youngsters in the house - or essentially how to accommodate YOUR eating with competing family needs. Here is the rule we set up:

NO ONE COMPLAINS TO THE COOK! A meal for the FAMILY means you may not like everything that is put on the table. As the main cook, I try to vary the meal each day so you may really like some things one day, and not like things on other days. If you don't cook, you don't get to complain. (This was in response to Day 2, 02/21 when the girls said they don't want steak, husband said he didn't want fish or chicken. I blew up and yelled NO ONE COMPLAINS! WE EAT EVERYTHING! YOU ONLY COMPLAIN IF IT'S SPOILED! Everyone got the point and have been all compliments since then.) This point was immediately accepted since we already employ it on FAMILY vacations. No one complains they have to sightsee instead of going to the beach. We will hit some of the things you want to do, but someone else wants to go look at pictures of naked women in a museum. Stop complaining.

I use allreceipes.com. You can get the nutritional value with the recipe! My husband thinks if I made something up, it won't taste good. So I don't argue with him about it, and print out the recipe and put it prominently where he can see that I am following an independent 3rd party so therefore it must taste good. I try to plan out 1/2 the week at a time, and that helps in varying the diet plus hitting common sense nutrition requirements. I don't believe above this that I need a Michael Phelpsian diet to perform well as a masters athlete.

Varna01
March 5th, 2015, 10:04 AM
I don't know what everyone else uses, but I swear by E3Live http://www.e3live.com/, which is what I use in place of vitamins. When I stick to it, I don't get sick, and I have noticeably more energy. Otherwise, you'll get a variety of answers (no fat, no carbs, no gluten, fat, carbs, gluten), so it's probably a trial and error thing until you find what works for you.

Thank you for your post. I appreciate your answer, but as I've mentioned in my initial post I don't believe in supplements and generally I am against them. I don't mean your approach is wrong or you're doing something wrong, however I do believe that manufacturers of such supplements are either overpraise their products' qualities or they might use components (sometimes without clearly specifying it) that are prohibited or going to be prohibited in competitive sports.
For an example I saw thread throughout this forum dated 2002 where participants were discussing about use of the creatine to improve their performance, which was not prohibited (or may still not be, I am not quite sure) at that time. But when I googled about Creatine, I saw a research by Institute of Biochemistry at German Sports University in Koeln about Creatine's effect on one's performance, which at the end states that this substance gives certain advantage to its user.
Here is the link: http://www.doping-info.de/rubriken/00_home/00_cre01.PDF
Based on above mentioned and According to Rules of Ethics of IOC: use of an expedient, which is potentially harmful to the health of an athlete (creatine is harmful) and/or capable of enhancing performance is considered as doping.

Therefore as of this writing we cannot be 100% confident that even considered as harmless Multi-vitamines or other supplements that are advertised on the market do not contain potentially dangerous substance either for health or prohibition. So I genuinly believe that sticking on traditional food is the best choice, until FINA comes up publishing a list of supplements' manufacturers and provide certain guarantees, which I am sure 100% will never ever happen.

So all in all lets get to post meal recipes suitable for active swimmers.

__steve__
March 5th, 2015, 11:00 AM
It's very simple. Avoid any type of sugar and include raw vegetables with at least two of the meals (lettuce doesn't count as it provides little nutrition). If you can't maintain your weight, add more calories. if you need to lose weight, either burn more or eat less. If you are loosing muscle strength, either consume more protein or burn less fuel

sunruh
March 5th, 2015, 12:52 PM
http://cdn.bluebell.com/what_were_crankin_out/our_ice_cream.html

knelson
March 5th, 2015, 12:57 PM
It's very simple. Avoid any type of sugar

That would mean no fruit.

__steve__
March 5th, 2015, 01:43 PM
That would mean no fruit.
Yep, no fruit unless fermented

scyfreestyler
March 5th, 2015, 05:22 PM
Yep, no fruit unless fermented

So, no fruit but alcohol is ok? lol

__steve__
March 5th, 2015, 08:55 PM
So, no fruit but alcohol is ok? lol
if it's dry

Jazz Hands
March 5th, 2015, 11:08 PM
"Proper nutrition" is the nexus of superstitions, anxieties, and fads. Like, what are you even talking about, being "against any supplement?" You know that supplements still exist if you're against them, right? You know supplements are usually just some nutrients isolated from food, right?

Just eat food like a normal person. You'll be fine.

Jazz Hands
March 5th, 2015, 11:17 PM
Avoid any type of sugar and include raw vegetables

Raw vegetables contain sugar...

Varna01
March 6th, 2015, 08:49 AM
"Proper nutrition" is the nexus of superstitions, anxieties, and fads. Like, what are you even talking about, being "against any supplement?" You know that supplements still exist if you're against them, right? You know supplements are usually just some nutrients isolated from food, right?

Just eat food like a normal person. You'll be fine.

I don't want argue and turn this thread in to dispute. I've mentioned already that I don't consider those who take supplements are doing something wrong, but just that we can't be sure whether given supplement is good or bad. This is bln. $ industry and often producers do unthinkable things while chasing the profit. Take a look at below two links to understand what I meant:
http://informed-sport.com/sites/default/files/Anti-Doping-Backgrounder.pdf
http://www.forbes.com/sites/emilywillingham/2013/11/07/study-herbal-supplements-full-of-contaminants-substitutes-and-fillers/

Since this is General swimming related discussion forum my intention was to exchange ideas and learn new tricks and recipes for proper nutrition. For an example there are different types of carbs - low and high on sugar, simple carbs and complex carbs. And not all of them can be mixed to make still tasty meal. Or if oatmeal is good - you can't eat everyday oatmeal, so perhaps one may want to try something similar which would be healthy and tasty.
Here is my recipe contribution for good meal:

- Millet porridge
Ingredients:
1 cup millet grains
3 cups water
50 g of butter
some sugar for taste
salt

1. Millet cereals should be cleaned with boiled water. Pour 1 cup of cereal in a saucepan and pour 1 cup of water. Bring to a boil. Pour cereal along with the water into a strainer and wash well under running water.
2. Now return it into a saucepan, add salt, sugar and pour 2 cups of water (ratio 1:2). It is this ratio that will give you the desired result. If water is less, the porridge will be too dry, if more - it becomes viscous. Put it on medium heat and do not cover the lid.
2. In about 10 minutes after boiling, when the water at the same level as the millet, add some butter (1-2 tablespoon size) by spreading on the surface. Without butter you can't achieve crumbly consistency.
3. Close the pan with a lid and turn off the plate. The porridge need stay for half an hour and do not open the lid, cause it must absorb the remaining water and swell.
After that the porridge can be eaten as a separate dish or as a side dish.

100 gr. of above meal provide you (close to oatmeal):
Fat 3.2 g
Sodium 238.7 mg
Carbohydrate 71.8 g
Dietary Fiber 6.7 g
Sugars 12 g
Protein 12.8 g

knelson
March 6th, 2015, 10:16 AM
Just eat food like a normal person. You'll be fine.

Hear, hear!

__steve__
March 6th, 2015, 11:20 AM
The sugar I was referring to was refined, like carbonated drinks with 40 grams per 12 oz, equivalent to eating 30 carrots worth of sugar.

I was quite fat several times before in my life and I didn't wear it well. Eventually discovered correcting my BMI just required a variety of healthy meals and exercise.

sunruh
March 6th, 2015, 12:53 PM
Just eat food like a normal person. You'll be fine.

what if i eat like an abnormal person?

Abby
Abby Normal

james lucas
March 6th, 2015, 03:24 PM
Just eat food like a normal person.

If you "eat food like a normal person," does that mean you reject out of hand Michelle Obama's diet ideas, as do a lot of apparently normal people including a lot of kids who eat in school cafeterias - or does it mean that your eating habits, like Michelle's, include a regular cleanse, which the White House says "involves eating as many fruits and vegetables as possible and cutting out fats, oil, dairy, meat, caffeine, sugar and starch for a short period of time"?

Sid
March 6th, 2015, 03:38 PM
People who eat a healthy variety of food require no cleansing.

People who don't eat healthy should change their habits, rather than undergo a cleanse.

Jazz Hands
March 6th, 2015, 06:11 PM
If you "eat food like a normal person," does that mean you reject out of hand Michelle Obama's diet ideas, as do a lot of apparently normal people including a lot of kids who eat in school cafeterias - or does it mean that your eating habits, like Michelle's, include a regular cleanse, which the White House says "involves eating as many fruits and vegetables as possible and cutting out fats, oil, dairy, meat, caffeine, sugar and starch for a short period of time"?

I didn't know the first lady was an expert on nutrition.

Chris Stevenson
March 7th, 2015, 06:25 PM
Just eat food like a normal person. You'll be fine.


If you "eat food like a normal person," does that mean you reject out of hand Michelle Obama's diet ideas, as do a lot of apparently normal people including a lot of kids who eat in school cafeterias

We don't need to be bring the First Lady into this discussion because it might become politicized.

I definitely do NOT equate the two phrases "eat food like a normal person" and "kids who eat in school cafeterias!"

Bobinator
March 8th, 2015, 01:19 PM
Try to eat a wide variety of unprocessed foods. Most foods in a box or bag come from a factory and are sustained till purchase with chemical crap. I buy 6 or 7 types of fresh vegetables, plus 3 or 4 types of fresh fruit every Sunday and spend some time that day washing and chopping the vege's and placing them in ziploc bags for the weeks use. I work about 10 hours a day monday-friday. I take the fruits, vege's, and a kale/spinach blend to work and that's what I eat while I'm there. Normally I'll throw a boiled egg or water-packed tuna on top for some protein. Nuts, greek yogurt, or hummus make a good snack before leaving school for swim workout too. I know it can be challenging to find quality, fresh fruits and vegetables year around, but I figure this is still better that what comes out of the typical cafeteria, factory, or resturant in most places.

DeniseMW
March 9th, 2015, 08:27 AM
marcoab3, a bottle of E3Live lasts about a week because I fill up a jigger and swig it down in the morning. They tell you to start with 1TBS daily. It is a bit on the expensive side, but I find my order lasts a while, and it's worth it to me because it's the only thing I've tried that keeps my stamina and energy up and the winter chills at bay.

DeniseMW
March 9th, 2015, 08:32 AM
Varna01, E3Live is not a supplement, it's a food. It's lake algae from the Pacific Northwest that has a lot of concentrated nutrients, which I use in place of regular vitamins, and it's kind of like drinking pulverized seaweed, which I guess you could also do LOL. I'm not selling it or telling anyone else to use it, just that it works for me and I feel better when I use it.

james lucas
March 9th, 2015, 06:14 PM
We don't need to be bring the First Lady into this discussionbecause it might become politicized.

Good call. Getting back to the original request ...

"...recipes for meals that they believe provide proper nutrition with heavy and/or moderate workload swimmers."
I’ve had similar questions as I get back in the water and try to balance over-training and over-eating.

This link was helpful:http://www.livestrong.com/article/190016-meal-plans-for-swimmers/ (http://www.livestrong.com/article/190016-meal-plans-for-swimmers/)

It says swimmers need 0.55 to 0.8g per lb. of body weight of protein, according to the American Dietetic Association – so, a 150-lb. swimmer needs 82 to 120g of protein a day. For carbohydrates, the American Dietetic Association recommends 2.3 to 3.6g per lb. of body weight a day - thus, a 150-lb. swimmer would need 345 to 540g.

A Google search for “swimming recipes” turns up some ideas, including: http://www.usaswimming.org/ViewNewsArticle.aspx?TabId=0&itemid=6141&mid=8712 (http://www.usaswimming.org/ViewNewsArticle.aspx?TabId=0&itemid=6141&mid=8712)
This essay has ideas on how to get carbs and protein into the diet: http://www.sasoswimming.org/Swim%20Nutrition.pdf
Here’s another:http://www.usaswimming.org/DesktopDefault.aspx?TabId=1546&Alias=Rainbow&Lang=en (http://www.usaswimming.org/DesktopDefault.aspx?TabId=1546&Alias=Rainbow&Lang=en)

Finally, here’s a word on over-training and nutrition, which has my attention just now: http://www.pponline.co.uk/encyc/recovery-how-the-right-nutrition-can-help-prevent-overtraining-41278# (http://www.pponline.co.uk/encyc/recovery-how-the-right-nutrition-can-help-prevent-overtraining-41278#)

sunruh
March 10th, 2015, 01:30 PM
james,
you will NEVER find a "guide" on nutrition that actually works for better than average athletes. no matter what the sport and especially swimming. i had 30g of protien by the time i finished breakfast this morning. yes im 25lbs more than what you show but at 1/4th by 8am on protein and 130+g of carbs. breakfast during the week is not a big meal for me either.

there are 2 major factors:
1) distance in workout
2) effort for that distance - factual determination of this value in calories is currently not possible

i have yet to find a "nutritionist" that is a good enough athlete to comprehend what average athletes truly need never mind the upper end group.
when i see/read stories about phelps/lochte eating 10-12-14,000 calories a day i reply with "is that all?"

Varna01
March 12th, 2015, 03:30 AM
james,
you will NEVER find a "guide" on nutrition that actually works for better than average athletes. no matter what the sport and especially swimming.

there are 2 major factors:
1) distance in workout
2) effort for that distance - factual determination of this value in calories is currently not possible

i have yet to find a "nutritionist" that is a good enough athlete to comprehend what average athletes truly need never mind the upper end group.

Unfortunately I have to agree with you on above mentioned. Indeed distance and efforts to take that distance, as well as other additional hard/moderate excercises during dry-land trainings are difficult to transform into calories intake. I am also reading a lot about the latest trend to intake more fat instead of carbs to increase energy levels and overall strength (http://www.marksdailyapple.com/a-metabolic-paradigm-shift-fat-carbs-human-body-metabolism/#axzz3U9c7HwuC) - a new paradigm in humans methabolism, so the nutrition subject is quite a mess. That's why instead of listening of various nutritionist opinions, I do believe it is better to learn from daily life of actual athletes (competitive swimmers) and from their 1st hand experience.

sunruh
March 12th, 2015, 02:14 PM
at the upper end of the ladder, elite competitive swimmers eat. and eat a lot. abnormal amounts of food. and thats the women. the men...bring on the brontosaurus burgers by the tray, go to an all-you-can-eat buffet and get asked to leave, level of eating.
i call it the "seefood diet".
i see food, i eat it

the 40/30/30 (carbs/protien/fat) ratio isnt that far off of what it can take to succeed.

nowadays with the great advances in pre/during/post workout drinks/bars allows some the of jaw soreness to go down from the chowing of calories. and they are a true advantage to any level of athlete. not only do they help your body get what it needs but when it needs it.

(let's not mention beer and male college swimmers. 6pks and cases dont describe the realm of quantity. use kegs and yes plural.)

be smart, be informed but most of all listen to what your body needs. if you find yourself standing in front of the pantry with a spoon in the peanutbutter jar and eyes on the honey....dont feel alone. just try not to finish a full jar (of each) in 1 try. (yes it can happen)

Sojerz
March 12th, 2015, 06:06 PM
Try to eat a wide variety of unprocessed foods. Most foods in a box or bag come from a factory and are sustained till purchase with chemical crap...... I know it can be challenging to find quality, fresh fruits and vegetables year around, but I figure this is still better that what comes out of the typical cafeteria, factory, or resturant in most places.

I agree with Bobinator - to the extent possible cut out processed foods. Additionally, one training guide I read (triathlon) indicated that to maximize muscle building after middle age, shift your body to an alkaline state by consuming alkaline foods. Google alkaline and acidic foods to see which foods are alkaline and which ones are acidic. Most veggies (especially spinach) are alkaline and most meat and cheese is acidic, but there are exceptions and other food types too (fruit, nuts, grains etc.). You don't have to eat exclusively alkaline foods and can offset acidic food consumption by eating alkaline foods. You can check your body's alkalinity by testing your urine pH every so often with litmus paper (although I've never done it).

StewartACarroll
March 14th, 2015, 04:22 PM
http://cdn.bluebell.com/what_were_crankin_out/our_ice_cream.html

I told you all that blue bell ice cream was not healthy for you Mr Unruh.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2994025/FDA-warns-illness-linked-select-Blue-Bell-confections.html

sunruh
March 20th, 2015, 03:49 PM
considering that my mother had her triple bypass heart surgery in that hospital, it hit a little close to home.

but the reality is it had nothing to do with the ice cream and everything with the shake makers. which is more scary?

ElaineK
March 20th, 2015, 09:25 PM
I told you all that blue bell ice cream was not healthy for you Mr Unruh.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2994025/FDA-warns-illness-linked-select-Blue-Bell-confections.html


considering that my mother had her triple bypass heart surgery in that hospital, it hit a little close to home.

but the reality is it had nothing to do with the ice cream and everything with the shake makers. which is more scary?

Sunruh, were you powered by Blue Bell when you raced your way into the 2014 FINA Top Ten rankings? :D Congratulations to both you and StewartACarroll for your Top Ten achievements! :applaud:

ALM
March 20th, 2015, 10:28 PM
Sunruh, were you powered by Blue Bell when you raced your way into the 2014 FINA Top Ten rankings? :D Congratulations to both you and StewartACarroll for your Top Ten achievements! :applaud:

:hijack:
And congratulations to the USMS webmaster, Jim Matysek, for his first-ever appearance in the 2014 FINA SCM Top10 rankings (200 Breaststroke)! :kiss1:

StewartACarroll
March 21st, 2015, 06:50 PM
considering that my mother had her triple bypass heart surgery in that hospital, it hit a little close to home.

but the reality is it had nothing to do with the ice cream and everything with the shake makers. which is more scary?

Sorry mi amigo.

StewartACarroll
March 21st, 2015, 07:15 PM
Sunruh, were you powered by Blue Bell when you raced your way into the 2014 FINA Top Ten rankings? :D Congratulations to both you and StewartACarroll for your Top Ten achievements! :applaud:

Thanks Elaine.

sunruh
March 22nd, 2015, 01:41 PM
Sunruh, were you powered by Blue Bell when you raced your way into the 2014 FINA Top Ten rankings? :D Congratulations to both you and StewartACarroll for your Top Ten achievements! :applaud:

oh heck yeah!!!
mocha almond fudge

ElaineK
March 22nd, 2015, 07:25 PM
:hijack:
And congratulations to the USMS webmaster, Jim Matysek, for his first-ever appearance in the 2014 FINA SCM Top10 rankings (200 Breaststroke)! :kiss1:

Congratulations, Jim! :applaud:


oh heck yeah!!!
mocha almond fudge

The best part of that flavor, for sure! :bliss:

sunruh
March 23rd, 2015, 02:50 PM
ok here is a little training secret.
so i'll whisper it so nobody else can hear....

it is "best" to maintain a 1/2gal per 1 week ratio

now if mocha almond fudge cannot be found, rocky mountain road can be substituted.

p.s. it is quite obvious i was missing my bluebell in montreal. darn 0.10!!!