PDA

View Full Version : New Award - Biggest Sandbagger at Nationals



pwb
March 26th, 2015, 07:01 PM
With the psych sheets out for Nationals, I think we should start debating who deserves the biggest sandbagger of the meet award?

I won't name the names of any doctors or last year's national champion, but I've got some nominees in the 500 free:bolt:

The Fortress
March 26th, 2015, 07:09 PM
I won't name the names of any doctors or last year's national champion, but I've got some nominees in the 500 free:bolt:

What are Unruh, Carroll and Dickson thinking?!

The national record holder (in the event) is sandbagging in my age group in 100 fly ... :)

Kurt Dickson
March 26th, 2015, 07:22 PM
hurtful...I give you last years shaved and tapered time:


Kurt F Dickson
46
ARIZ
Arizona
5:03.77
(http://www.usms.org/comp/meets/swim.php?s=2392563)




With the caliber of swimmers that will be present, however, I will take any award (esp sandbagger) given to me.:)

pwb
March 26th, 2015, 07:48 PM
Yeah, but, Kurt, I am actually giving you props because I know how much better you are than that ... and that that time was done at the end of a 3 day weekend that also included an OW race that morning. You should be in the middle of the pool giving Stewart and Steve a run for the money ...

StewartACarroll
March 26th, 2015, 08:25 PM
hurtful...I give you last years shaved and tapered time:


Kurt F Dickson
46
ARIZ
Arizona
5:03.77
(http://www.usms.org/comp/meets/swim.php?s=2392563)



With the caliber of swimmers that will be present, however, I will take any award (esp sandbagger) given to me.:)

Kurt, you can always enter the blue bell challenge like the rest of us. I suspect the incentive alone will make Mr Unruh go a little quicker than his entry time. I believe Steve did his entry time with one arm and his legs tied together at the end of a 6k practice.

Kurt Dickson
March 26th, 2015, 08:41 PM
I do like Bluebell. I recall my parents and I splitting a gallon in the car after we dropped my bro off at UT circa 1984...don't think we finished it before the Texas heat turned it into soup.

sunruh
March 27th, 2015, 10:19 AM
PWB,
i'm just following my elders wisdom:

M 50-54
1 Erwin, Jeff T 50 SAWS 5:01.79

pwb
March 27th, 2015, 10:35 AM
PWB,
i'm just following my elders wisdom:

M 50-54
1 Erwin, Jeff T 50 SAWS 5:01.79Ahh yes, the yoda of sandbagging ...

sunruh
March 27th, 2015, 10:58 AM
What are Unruh, Carroll and Dickson thinking?!

pretty sure my thoughts are not allowed on here :D :D :D :D :D

orca1946
March 27th, 2015, 11:20 AM
Can the officials look at the "sandbagger" time & adjust??

pwb
March 27th, 2015, 01:04 PM
pretty sure my thoughts are not allowed on here :D :D :D :D :DPG thoughts acceptable

sunruh
March 27th, 2015, 01:20 PM
PG thoughts acceptable

i think that was my point!

orca1946
March 29th, 2015, 01:35 PM
How far off seed times from posted swim times are we calling "sand bagging' ??? 5% - 10% 25 % ??

knelson
April 1st, 2015, 10:39 AM
How far off seed times from posted swim times are we calling "sand bagging' ??? 5% - 10% 25 % ??

I'd say more like 3%. 5% for someone who can swim the 500 free in 5:00 is 15 seconds. That's huge.

gull
April 1st, 2015, 02:02 PM
"Sandbag" as defined by Mirriam-Webster:

"to hide the truth about oneself so as to gain an advantage over another"

Angela M Dowgiert
April 3rd, 2015, 04:50 AM
Iniko Norada is seeded in the W100 Back with a 1:08 and went a 53 in February.

pwb
April 3rd, 2015, 09:13 AM
Iniko Norada is seeded in the W100 Back with a 1:08 and went a 53 in February.Oh yeah. She pulls that stunt at EVERY local Masters meet and I have no clue why.

Angela M Dowgiert
April 3rd, 2015, 09:35 AM
I was wondering what the deal was, its my first year of Masters and to my recollection when I swam as a kid, it was pretty poor sportsmanship to seed like that.

kristilynn
April 3rd, 2015, 09:36 AM
There's an Olympic gold medalist in the 1000 who entered with a time slower than mine...

Angela M Dowgiert
April 3rd, 2015, 09:39 AM
That's messed up, unless you're faster than they are now ;) Do these people have inferiority complexes or something? Does it make them feel better when the beat their heat by lengths?

The Fortress
April 3rd, 2015, 09:47 AM
Oh yeah. She pulls that stunt at EVERY local Masters meet and I have no clue why.

I saw she was seeded at 28.1 for 50 free and 31.1 for 50 fly. That's just ridiculous ... She's the national record holder in 50 fly and 100 back.

Angela M Dowgiert
April 3rd, 2015, 10:04 AM
You should be banned for pulling stunts like that

knelson
April 3rd, 2015, 10:26 AM
Pretty ridiculous. Not sure about banning, but isn't there some provision to "adjust" these bogus times?

ElaineK
April 3rd, 2015, 10:35 AM
Pretty ridiculous. Not sure about banning, but isn't there some provision to "adjust" these bogus times?

It will definitely be ridiculous if she swims her usual race times and slaughters her seed times. Since she has a history of sandbagging, that would definitely be the case.

There is another possibility, though. What is she has had an injury or illness and is currently only able to race the seed time she posted? That would be the only way she would get off the hook (and legitimately off this thread).

The only reason I bring that up is because of my current situation. Coming off hip surgery, my kick is so pathetic that I have actually fallen off the motivational charts in some of my events where I used to be able to practice "race" A-AA times! :afraid:

smontanaro
April 3rd, 2015, 10:48 AM
Pretty ridiculous. Not sure about banning, but isn't there some provision to "adjust" these bogus times?

With electronic signups, you'd think such adjustments would be easy. Match up their seed time with their most recent time in that event during the current year. Take the faster time as their seed time. If they haven't competed in that event during the current season, check the previous year, etc, tacking on an extra adder (maybe 3% per year?) to older race times. If the swimmer has a problem with that, there's no requirement that they enter that race...

Angela M Dowgiert
April 3rd, 2015, 10:58 AM
I did briefly entertain the idea of injury until I read its a habitual thing. I had my times adjusted according after I had a meet two weeks ago. I have also recently had surgery but things are starting to come back and I'm having fun again, no need to be afraid!!

SwimKat
April 3rd, 2015, 11:02 AM
Maybe those are SCM times.

Rob Copeland
April 3rd, 2015, 11:02 AM
Pretty ridiculous. Not sure about banning, but isn't there some provision to "adjust" these bogus times?
104.5.5.A(11) If a swimmer enters an event with a time significantly slower or faster than that swimmer’s recorded time in the past two years, the meet director may, after a discussion with the swimmer, change the seeded time to a realistic time.

Note: There is also 102.13.14, but this is generally applied to swimmers who are significantly slower than their seed times.
102.13.14 A swimmer who misrepresents a seed time, causing a significant delay of the meet, may be disqualified at the discretion of the referee. The disqualified swimmer shall be removed from the lane as soon as practical.

Kurt Dickson
April 3rd, 2015, 07:21 PM
Don't think Noriko will be delaying the meet as she is smoking fast. As a (very) part-time sandbagger I can say without equivocation, there is nobody in her (sandbagging) league. Wonder if anybody will be changing her time, like they did mine?

Angela M Dowgiert
April 3rd, 2015, 09:32 PM
I just don't understand the need for sandbagging. I guess if your confidence is that low....

Sportygeek
April 3rd, 2015, 10:20 PM
I sandbagged (and reverse sandbagged) my last meet. It was *not* Nationals. It was an interstate meet of uncertain size, and I was racing consecutive events. I felt bad about it, but in exactly the same circumstances I'd probably do the same thing again.

Kurt Dickson
April 3rd, 2015, 10:55 PM
Sandbagging is done for a variety of purposes: confidence, get a better lane, get more rest for another event, catching a plane, etc. Since we're not kiddies anymore, I often put a little age buffer. Some find it inherently evil. I don't care as much. Noriko is a curious case as she usually ends up in lane 8, thrashing all of us. Since I don't speak Japanese, I may never know why.

kristilynn
April 3rd, 2015, 11:42 PM
Jeff,

Are you paying attention to this? I think that you're getting picked on :-). Should I also tell them that you tend to make much slower people (such as me!) go in front of you in practice?


PWB,
i'm just following my elders wisdom:

M 50-54
1 Erwin, Jeff T 50 SAWS 5:01.79

Michael Heather
April 6th, 2015, 01:46 AM
Oh yeah. She pulls that stunt at EVERY local Masters meet and I have no clue why.

I'll tell you why. Some people like to swim their events alone. In nationals, sandbagging is the only way to approximate that.

The thing I have no clue about is why people take such great offense at others' entry times.

sickfish
April 6th, 2015, 05:51 AM
The thing I have no clue about is why people take such great offense at others' entry times.

Because they don't want fast people, especially "elites", in their heat.

<sarcasm>and those fast sandbaggers shouldn't be allowed to set records, either, because something something reasons!</sarcasm>

jroddin
April 6th, 2015, 09:19 AM
There's an Olympic gold medalist in the 1000 who entered with a time slower than mine...

That's because everybody is slower than you! :D

kristilynn
April 6th, 2015, 09:28 AM
That's because everybody is slower than you! :D

Ha! If only that were true. Good news is that she entered with such a slow time that at least I won't be in her heat. Maybe I can avoid being lapped that way.

knelson
April 27th, 2015, 11:28 AM
I saw she was seeded at 28.1 for 50 free and 31.1 for 50 fly. That's just ridiculous ... She's the national record holder in 50 fly and 100 back.

It would appear that some of her entry times were adjusted. I was just looking at the 50 fly results (she set a new NR with a 25.05) and her seed time was 24.92.

sunruh
April 27th, 2015, 03:55 PM
What are Unruh, Carroll and Dickson thinking?!

i already knew the block in lane 5 ODD side was crooked, so i didnt want to start on that one.

ya spend 60million plus and cant get the blocks straight!!!

ElaineK
April 27th, 2015, 10:17 PM
i already knew the block in lane 5 ODD side was crooked, so i didnt want to start on that one.

ya spend 60million plus and cant get the blocks straight!!!


:hijack:Question for sunruh: Are you going through Blue Bell (mocha fudge) ice cream withdrawals after it got pulled from the stores?:whiteflag: I'm guessing your freezer was well stocked before that happened... :anim_coffee:

sunruh
April 28th, 2015, 09:00 AM
Y E S!!!
i did happen to have a Rocky Mountain Road in the back freezer, but i've been limping along on HEB Creamy Creations Toasted Almond Fudge. while good, it's a very distant 2nd place.
however in the non-chocolate category, HEB CreamyCreations Poteet Strawberry is out of this world good. no other strawberry is close!
their issue is completely baffling since its 4 plants in 4 states (and it cant be liquid milk or wet eggs thats causing it)

ElaineK
April 28th, 2015, 12:33 PM
Y E S!!!
i did happen to have a Rocky Mountain Road in the back freezer, but i've been limping along on HEB Creamy Creations Toasted Almond Fudge. while good, it's a very distant 2nd place.
however in the non-chocolate category, HEB CreamyCreations Poteet Strawberry is out of this world good. no other strawberry is close!
their issue is completely baffling since its 4 plants in 4 states (and it cant be liquid milk or wet eggs thats causing it)

My best wishes to you, sunruh. :bighug: May Blue Bell get its ice cream back in store freezers pronto! :waiting:

flystorms
April 28th, 2015, 01:53 PM
Ohh... maybe it's time to switch! If you have a Kroger nearby, try some of their house ice creams. They're fabulous! My favorite is the triple peanut butter - peanut butter ice cream with peanut butter swirled in and chunks of peanut butter. I add more peanut butter or Hershey's dark syrup to it to make it that much better. Yum!

sunruh
April 28th, 2015, 02:29 PM
kroger? get real!!!
no and thank you
next you will say winn dixie or foodlion or albersons or some other thats been run out of town or never attempted because of heb's goodness.

Michael Heather
April 29th, 2015, 11:20 PM
kroger? get real!!!
no and thank you
next you will say winn dixie or foodlion or albersons or some other thats been run out of town or never attempted because of heb's goodness.

What does that even have to do with sandbagging?

orca1946
April 30th, 2015, 11:46 AM
Back to the thread -I went 1 sec slower in my 200 back BUT went 6 sec faster in the 200 fly. Does this count as sandbagging?

fatboy
April 30th, 2015, 01:08 PM
1 sec in the 200 is not a big enough difference to be sandbagging. 6 secs faster in the 200 fly is called "training hard and hitting your taper"!

ElaineK
April 30th, 2015, 06:02 PM
What does that even have to do with sandbagging?

Sorry. I hijacked the thread back on post #40. :blush:

200free
April 30th, 2015, 09:49 PM
Unruh, I had some Tillamook ice cream out in Oregon this summer. BEST ICE CREAM EVER!!!!! I don't know what your Blue Bell tastes like but I dare you to tell me it's better than Tillamook. (best cheese ever too, tasted both right at the factory).

ElaineK
April 30th, 2015, 10:30 PM
Unruh, I had some Tillamook ice cream out in Oregon this summer. BEST ICE CREAM EVER!!!!! I don't know what your Blue Bell tastes like but I dare you to tell me it's better than Tillamook. (best cheese ever too, tasted both right at the factory).

:hijack: :lolup: Michael Heather, if you can't beat 'em, join 'em. What's your favorite ice cream? :D

200free, I've had Blue Bell (when I lived in San Antonio, and they also have it here at the local Kroger) and Tillamook ice cream. Both are good; however, nothing I have ever had beats New Zealand ice cream. :drool: :banana:

Having said that, I am looking forward to touring the Ben & Jerry's factory in Vermont next month! :wiggle:

knelson
May 1st, 2015, 12:35 AM
Tillamook is my go-to ice cream. I really try to avoid buying ice cream because once I start eating it I want it every night.

I'm guessing every part of the country has a good regional brand. Life is too short to eat that Breyers crap!

Sportygeek
May 5th, 2015, 02:42 PM
Some "biggest sandbagger" nominations from our Australian nationals (SCM). This list is not all-inclusive:

200 free:
Nominated time: 2:30
Swum time: 1:59

200 back:
Nominated time: 4:20
Swum time: 3:30ish

200 breast:
Nominated time: 7:00
Swum time: 4:30ish

50 fly:
Nominated time: 50 seconds
Swum time: 43.something
(This swimmer is from my city and in my age group. She's slightly faster than me. Why did she seed 5 seconds slower than me?!?!)

So much sandbagging that swimmers who swam their seed time, but no faster, often came last in their heat!