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larrycz
October 17th, 2017, 03:33 PM
I'm 35 years old 175cm 64kg male self taught swimmer starting from zero 5 years ago. I swam laps for a while, but soon developed interest and passion in swimming fast over short distances and relentless daily practice.

I have times in all strokes, but use freestyle as main benchmark. First time I tried to swim short course 100m freestyle I timed around 1:40. Over time this improved to 1:35, 1:27, 1:17 and reached a plateau there.

So I went through a year or so of the Starting Strength program, deadlifted 100kg in sets of 5 and squatted 80kg. I began to feel like my body line, explosiveness, starts and push offs improved. Freestyle time didn't improve dramatically, only down to 1:15.

At that point I felt I knew plenty about training of energy systems from Olbrecht, so I decided to only focus on improving my pure speed. I take 17 seconds for a push 25 in 18 strokes at 90-100 spm.

I followed Boomer's Freestyle Reimagined and took my stroke apart 4 weeks ago. A stroke change is clearly going to take 4 months or years to happen, not 4 weeks, but I am beginning to lose the enjoyment. I am hugely motivated to see myself break the 15sec 25m and ultimately the freestyle minute, and have no idea whether it is possible with no youth swimming background.

I posted on the UK Swimming Forum, but had no reply and thought I would post here too in search for tips or similar experiences. Would appreciate any comments!

I've seen an adult successfully join an age group program, and haven't tried that myself. I swam with a masters club for 2 years, which was a lot of fun, but these seem to be geared towards fitness and training rather than focused development of speed. Moreover, I am not quite so fast and fit to join some of the higher profile clubs. I've been to see a number of coaches/swimmers for advice, including Swim Smooth, who all had valuable input, but nothing seemed to really point me towards some a big area of improvement. I feel like I might be missing an obvious one. There are definitely areas like "feel for water" and "stroke efficicency" that remain mystical to me despite having read volumes.

Gdavis
October 18th, 2017, 10:29 AM
Hi Larry
A few thoughts/suggestions:
1. Difficult to make specific suggestions without seeing you swim. That's why working with a good coach (who trains swimmers for speed and competition) is important. Go join one of those "higher profile clubs" - your goals and attitude should fit right in and you will probably learn a lot, from coaching and from team mates.
2. As an "adult onset" swimmer, you are of course at a big disadvantage compared to age groupers. On the other hand, you may be less "set in your ways", and thus quite able to steadily improve. I have a friend who is an adult onset swimmer. I saw him (from an age early 40s start) over 5-7 years of patient work become a world class ultra endurance swimmer, much of his training working alone. His technique is excellent. And don't think he isn't fast - he does zero sprint training but he'll comfortably cruise/repeat 100m in workout (from the wall) at 1:20.
3. Swimming fast essentially boils down to maximizing propulsion and minimizing resistance. Both are very much based on technique. Swimming technique tends to develop slowly (as you observe) but cumulative gains can be huge with patient practice of good technique. Slow down on reaching your goals, focus on the process and enjoy the journey. As an aside, the great sprint champion Alex Popov was known for do a lot of slow swimming with good technique. Of course you have to practice swimming fast as well, but don't underestimate the importance of practice at slower speeds/intensities. Read stuff like this https://www.yourswimlog.com/swim-like-alex-popov/
4. Have you looked at Ande's excellent thread "swimming faster, faster"? You'll find no end of good tips and advice. A coach will help you prioritize those that could help you the most. http://forums.usms.org/showthread.php?4229-Ande-s-Swimming-Tips-Swimming-Faster-Faster&highlight=swimming+faster+faster
5. As a sprinter, don't underestimate the importance of kicking. Can you kick 50 free in under 40 seconds? Improving your kicking could help both your streamline body position and your propulsion. Almost all of the good sprinters I have known have been very good/fast kickers
6. Have you been to any clinics or camps?
If not, try to find a one or two that are focused on speed rather than distance/endurance/tri. For example, I went to one run by the famous Karlyn Pipes. It was simple, focused, actionable advice on how to swim faster.
7. "Feel for the water" is somewhat mystical. But there are ways to gain more of it. As an example, do you do sculling drills? Are you a good sculler?
8. Plateaus happen, plateaus suck, get over it and get back to having fun with the process.
There are a million ideas and nuggets of advice on these forums from some really great/fast swimmers on how to improve. Dip in from time to time for a little inspiration and training ideas to have fun with. I hope some of this is helpful :)

ssumargo
October 18th, 2017, 02:03 PM
I am in no position to give advice on how to get faster. I too am trying to do just that. My PB is 1:16 and it is still the case for the last 6 months. When I first met my masters coach, he asked me what my goals were. I told him, it's purely for fitness only. I wasn't really interested in being faster. But I got more interested in getting faster and better after my first swim meet. I told him that my goals have changed and since then, he would give sets that help improve my speed and also he would tell me whats wrong with my technique.

I'm not sure if your masters club has a coach, but if they do, perhaps you should tell them your goals.

Btw, my coach did warn me that I was going to see major improvements and then plateau. So I am taking this 6 months as a plateau and eventually (hopefully soon), I will break out of it and have a new PB. Your subject though, made me stop and think. Looking at my masters club, the fastest lane definitely breaks the minute. But they were all previous competitive swimmers or swam in high school/college.

JPEnge
October 19th, 2017, 09:25 AM
18 strokes for a 25m free tells me you are probably not as efficient per stroke as you could be, especially with your body size - that or you aren't doing much off of the walls. Both of which will make it difficult to carry speed through an entire 100m. Your lifting numbers suggest that your strength is adequate for your size for a swimmer, so you should be able to get more efficient with probably only a few tweaks. I know that speaks to the "mystical to me" areas you're talking about, but I can only be abstract without anything concrete to work with. Any chance you could video your freestyle?

cinc3100
October 20th, 2017, 11:37 AM
I'm 35 years old 175cm 64kg male self taught swimmer starting from zero 5 years ago. I swam laps for a while, but soon developed interest and passion in swimming fast over short distances and relentless daily practice.

I have times in all strokes, but use freestyle as main benchmark. First time I tried to swim short course 100m freestyle I timed around 1:40. Over time this improved to 1:35, 1:27, 1:17 and reached a plateau there.

So I went through a year or so of the Starting Strength program, deadlifted 100kg in sets of 5 and squatted 80kg. I began to feel like my body line, explosiveness, starts and push offs improved. Freestyle time didn't improve dramatically, only down to 1:15.

At that point I felt I knew plenty about training of energy systems from Olbrecht, so I decided to only focus on improving my pure speed. I take 17 seconds for a push 25 in 18 strokes at 90-100 spm.

I followed Boomer's Freestyle Reimagined and took my stroke apart 4 weeks ago. A stroke change is clearly going to take 4 months or years to happen, not 4 weeks, but I am beginning to lose the enjoyment. I am hugely motivated to see myself break the 15sec 25m and ultimately the freestyle minute, and have no idea whether it is possible with no youth swimming background.

I posted on the UK Swimming Forum, but had no reply and thought I would post here too in search for tips or similar experiences. Would appreciate any comments!

I've seen an adult successfully join an age group program, and haven't tried that myself. I swam with a masters club for 2 years, which was a lot of fun, but these seem to be geared towards fitness and training rather than focused development of speed. Moreover, I am not quite so fast and fit to join some of the higher profile clubs. I've been to see a number of coaches/swimmers for advice, including Swim Smooth, who all had valuable input, but nothing seemed to really point me towards some a big area of improvement. I feel like I might be missing an obvious one. There are definitely areas like "feel for water" and "stroke efficicency" that remain mystical to me despite having read volumes.
This is not a bad time for someone that didn't swim as a kid. Also, a lot of times you can be 5 to 7 seconds faster in a masters swim race. So, your 100 meter freestyle may be really around 1:07 to 1:10. Workouts are hard to judge times since you are repeating intervals that make you slower unless you are doing a 3 to 5 minute rest for a time trial which are your age might be closer to your speed at 1:16. I swam a 5:58 500 yard freestyle in high school at 18 years of which means in practice in yards I probably could do a lot of 1:10s to 1:15. My best meter 100 meter freestyle as 1.11 as a kid and yards 1:03.8, to show your progress might not be as bad as you think.

Swimspire
October 25th, 2017, 12:18 PM
If you're looking to get the edge on a sprint race such as the 100m freestyle, you may want to also focus on your start and your turns, as well as a dolphin kick off the start and the walls (if you have a fast dolphin kick to begin with).

Technique makes a huge difference, but only if you practice it consistently. If you're looking for a clinic, you'll want to find one that not only points out areas to improve, but also tells you HOW you can improve on a daily basis, and providing you with drills and tips that you can incorporate into your workouts. (Incidentally, if you happen to be in Florida in November, we are hosting a freestyle stroke clinic at Anastasia Fitness in Saint Augustine!)

I agree that 18 strokes per 25m sounds like quite a lot. You could certainly benefit from the expert eye of a coach here, someone who can take a look at your stroke and tell you what areas you need to improve and how to improve them. If you're so inclined, you can also try posting a video of your stroke here and the forumites can offer feedback.

larrycz
October 26th, 2017, 04:46 PM
Thank you all for your replies

I haven't a recent video, but will definitely post here if I get one

I know my flutter kick is weak. As Gdavis pointed out, I can probably gain a lot on my 50 and 100 times, particularly free and back, with better kick.

Thanks also for the tip on slow swimming. I've always tried to avoid easy continuous swimming as a means of improving technique. This is an attempt to avoid "ending up like the general public", who never seem to improve their swimming. I would swim slow for aerobic training, but not for technique. I'd do drills at easy, but no full stroke swimming. What I'm now coming to realise is that technique can improve in slow as well as fast swimming. What really counts is deliberate and concentrated practice. The general public come for a leisurely swim, and think about work, family or upcoming breakfast while they swim. The serious swimmer is learning, the recreational swimmer is relaxing. Both might be executing the exact same motions, in theory.

Since my original post I read Phil Whitten's Complete Book of Swimming, which made me feel much more positive about "adult onset" masters swimmers. I hadn't realised that most (or all?) masters meets have no qualifying standards, which is reassuring. From there I followed a reference to John Jerome's Staying With It. This is a brilliant book for any masters swimmer, with nuggets such as:


"Before you get the rhythm right, you will feel that there is power available out there somewhere, within your reach, but you can never seem to get your hands and feet on it for two strokes in succession. When you do get it right, every part of it drives the next part on. When you’re really cooking it’s as if the quality of the water changes. It gets solider, so you find the same firm resistance, the same possibility, everywhere you reach—because now you suddenly know just where to reach to find the power."


John picked up swimming at the age of 47 with only very little youth swimming background, and within a couple of years broke a national YMCA record in his group

I seem to be past the worst part of my crisis now. Swimming regularly again, I've asked a local coach nearby for a one-to-one session every two weeks and will enter a small meet early next year. To prove to myself I should stick to it, I dove in this morning for a 50m breast time trial and took two seconds off my personal best. It was pleasure to see despite the fact it had been a pathetic PB to begin with.

cinc3100
October 27th, 2017, 04:59 PM
Thank you all for your replies

I haven't a recent video, but will definitely post here if I get one

I know my flutter kick is weak. As Gdavis pointed out, I can probably gain a lot on my 50 and 100 times, particularly free and back, with better kick.

Thanks also for the tip on slow swimming. I've always tried to avoid easy continuous swimming as a means of improving technique. This is an attempt to avoid "ending up like the general public", who never seem to improve their swimming. I would swim slow for aerobic training, but not for technique. I'd do drills at easy, but no full stroke swimming. What I'm now coming to realise is that technique can improve in slow as well as fast swimming. What really counts is deliberate and concentrated practice. The general public come for a leisurely swim, and think about work, family or upcoming breakfast while they swim. The serious swimmer is learning, the recreational swimmer is relaxing. Both might be executing the exact same motions, in theory.

Since my original post I read Phil Whitten's Complete Book of Swimming, which made me feel much more positive about "adult onset" masters swimmers. I hadn't realised that most (or all?) masters meets have no qualifying standards, which is reassuring. From there I followed a reference to John Jerome's Staying With It. This is a brilliant book for any masters swimmer, with nuggets such as:



John picked up swimming at the age of 47 with only very little youth swimming background, and within a couple of years broke a national YMCA record in his group

I seem to be past the worst part of my crisis now. Swimming regularly again, I've asked a local coach nearby for a one-to-one session every two weeks and will enter a small meet early next year. To prove to myself I should stick to it, I dove in this morning for a 50m breast time trial and took two seconds off my personal best. It was pleasure to see despite the fact it had been a pathetic PB to begin with.
John may be a more natural freestyler. I knew two girls in high school that could beat me in a 50 yard freestyle without a competitive swimming background except the girls team but I could beat them in a 500 yard swim because of lots of workout,

larrycz
November 18th, 2017, 09:08 AM
Reading Mastery by John Leonard, I've made myself at peace with the idea of lifetime improvement. My master plan is to break a long course minute by the time I am 49. Therefore rule the 50-59 group at county level and beyond here in the UK.

With 14 years to go, a drop of 1-2 seconds a year initially will get me there, with 0.5-1 second a year later on. In all my naivety, I went on and made a fancy graph showing my historical PBs, trajectory towards a sub minute time, and practice volume by month. The dashed red line is how much practice would need to ramp up relative to historical in order to reach 10,000 hours by the end of that period. This is the most realistic attitude on swimming I've ever allowed myself, but might just be what I need to stick to swimming for a long time.

I feel I could do with a training buddy. None of my friends, family and work colleagues is a swimming enthusiast of similar caliber (borderline obsessive), unfortunately. I thought, therefore, I would post here to see if anyone fancies a virtual buddy. The whole purpose is to hold each other accountable, share the experience, and perhaps exchange ideas. The closer your goals are to my "project 1", the better, but I suppose it can work in any kind of swim training programme, whether it's sprint, distance, open water, club or no club. I'm just looking for somebody to join me on the path to adult onset swimming "mastery".

11379

Karl_S
November 19th, 2017, 11:15 PM
Reading Mastery by John Leonard, I've made myself at peace with the idea of lifetime improvement. My master plan is to break a long course minute by the time I am 49. Therefore rule the 50-59 group at county level and beyond here in the UK.

With 14 years to go,...
If you actually commit to this, you should keep a video journal. Whether you get there, or not, it is likely to make a wonderful documentary/story... I'm sure there will be some big emotional ups and downs, startling unexpected roadblocks and profounds insights along the way.

__steve__
November 20th, 2017, 11:17 AM
1st challenge - < 0:15 25fr SCM
2nd - < 0:30 50fr SCM
3rd - < 0:30 50fr LCM
4th - < 0:45 75fr SCM
5th - < 1:00 100fr LCM prior to 50 yrs

Quite possible for you. I started from zero at 41 but only accomplished the 3rd and havent even tried the 100m fr (only went 28.3 for 50). You would have to train properly and avoid injury, whatever that takes. Form and technique would be the very first priority and would continue throughout

Karl_S
November 20th, 2017, 01:01 PM
1st challenge - < 0:15 25fr SCM
2nd - < 0:30 50fr SCM
3rd - < 0:30 50fr LCM
4th - < 0:45 75fr SCM
5th - < 1:00 100fr LCM

This seems so obvious, yet the vast majority of coaches that I have ever known seem to completely ignore (or only give lip service to) the importance of sprint speed. If you can't break :15 for a 25, you certainly can't break 1:00 for a 100, yet they never assign tasks designed to build raw speed. Read Coach Tom Topolski's post, "Do your swimmers know their spot?"

larrycz
November 20th, 2017, 03:27 PM
This seems so obvious, yet the vast majority of coaches that I have ever known seem to completely ignore (or only give lip service to) the importance of sprint speed. If you can't break :15 for a 25, you certainly can't break 1:00 for a 100, yet they never assign tasks designed to build raw speed. Read Coach Tom Topolski's post, "Do your swimmers know their spot?"

This is such a fundamental point. I'm convinced I wouldn't be able to sustain stomach-churning anaerobic sets long term on my own in public swimming pools without knowing I can ever achieve the necessary speed. So I want to see a sub 15 push 25m. It would probably serve my thread better to title it "break 15 second 25 SCM", because I seem stuck trying to get below 16-17.

I have doubts about this concept, though. Can you really "hack" swimming development this way? Can you mostly work on pure speed and become a sprinter capable of then sharpening the energy systems to the point your new speed can be taken through an entire 100? Or have you missed something in the process by not doing tons of slower swimming like everyone else? Is this really a shortcut coaches don't normally take, but could?

larrycz
November 20th, 2017, 03:37 PM
1st challenge - < 0:15 25fr SCM
2nd - < 0:30 50fr SCM
3rd - < 0:30 50fr LCM
4th - < 0:45 75fr SCM
5th - < 1:00 100fr LCM prior to 50 yrs

Quite possible for you. I started from zero at 41 but only accomplished the 3rd and havent even tried the 100m fr (only went 28.3 for 50). You would have to train properly and avoid injury, whatever that takes. Form and technique would be the very first priority and would continue throughout

Wow, I have so many questions I don't know where to begin:



is each challenge push, no dive?
where did you start at challenge 1, and how long did it take you to progress?
was it a linear progression, or dips and plateaus?
how many strokes?
how does a sub 15 feel now compared to what you remember it feeling when it was much slower?
do you focus on taking mighty long strokes or stroking fast, or delicate balance of both?
did you get below 15 with long underwaters, or mostly surface swimming?
did you find that pure strength made a difference?
what has your approach to kick been, how much kick time in training?
is there one thing you could single out that made the most difference?
anything that you found plain wrong and had to be changed?


I know many of these are individual and what worked for you might be wrong for me, but I'm interested to hear about your whole experience

Karl_S
November 20th, 2017, 04:52 PM
... Can you mostly work on pure speed and become a sprinter capable of then sharpening the energy systems to the point your new speed can be taken through an entire 100? Or have you missed something in the process by not doing tons of slower swimming like everyone else? Is this really a shortcut coaches don't normally take, but could?
As far as I know there is absolutely NO shortcut. Aerobic conditioning is a HUGE aspect of swimming fast. My point is that it can't be done to the exclusion of everything else with the expectation that one will get faster over all distances. Just me ranting I guess. now back to your regularly scheduled thread...

cinc3100
November 20th, 2017, 08:27 PM
As far as I know there is absolutely NO shortcut. Aerobic conditioning is a HUGE aspect of swimming fast. My point is that it can't be done to the exclusion of everything else with the expectation that one will get faster over all distances. Just me ranting I guess. now back to your regularly scheduled thread...


It depends upon the age and the swimmer. I certainly can't do the yardage I did as a kid. On other hand, I know of someone in their 90's that does more yardage than me. I recommend mixing some sprints and moderate and slow swimming and doing other strokes as well, slow to fast. It helps to reduce injury if you do different strokes than free.

Swimspire
November 21st, 2017, 10:46 AM
This is a great video detailing the legendary Alex Popov (and his coach Gennadi Touretski)'s approach to success in the sprints:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ZxmnCcoqBY

__steve__
November 21st, 2017, 11:01 AM
Wow, I have so many questions I don't know where to begin:



is each challenge push, no dive?
where did you start at challenge 1, and how long did it take you to progress?
was it a linear progression, or dips and plateaus?
how many strokes?
how does a sub 15 feel now compared to what you remember it feeling when it was much slower?
do you focus on taking mighty long strokes or stroking fast, or delicate balance of both?
did you get below 15 with long underwaters, or mostly surface swimming?
did you find that pure strength made a difference?
what has your approach to kick been, how much kick time in training?
is there one thing you could single out that made the most difference?
anything that you found plain wrong and had to be changed?


I know many of these are individual and what worked for you might be wrong for me, but I'm interested to hear about your whole experience
PM sent

I am just average for my age group, so my advise can be interpreted as such. Anyhow, the 100 LCM free is a totally different beast than shorter distances in terms of metabolic demands, training required, and preparation. The only similarities would be the need for streamline, turns, starts, shaving, and suit.

For the 100LCM You would have to implement a training regime structured for all the energy systems demanded.

For example a structured regime would be: swim 6 days a week having a exclusive day of rest, work pure speed on 2 of the days, suffer lactate production on 1 day, spend 1 day doing easy swimming keeping your heart rate below 120, and 2 days working on aerobic threshold. Drills, starts, turns, drylands, and kicking should be included throughout. For just a 25 m you can get away with eliminating the aerobic days

Sojerz
November 21st, 2017, 12:08 PM
1st challenge - < 0:15 25fr SCM
2nd - < 0:30 50fr SCM
3rd - < 0:30 50fr LCM
4th - < 0:45 75fr SCM
5th - < 1:00 100fr LCM prior to 50 yrs

I think Steve's challenge is a legit way of looking at the steps needed to go under the very lofty goal of 1:00 SCM or LCM. However, by the time you get to the 5th challenge, your other times need to be well below the earlier challenge points. They will need to be like a :13 low for 25scm and at least :28 low for 50 scm/lcm.

Additionally, as you reach your mid-50s it becomes harder and harder to build and retain muscle and it will take more time and opportunity to train in order to get there. That said, there are still swimmers hitting very fast times up into there 70s, but they all probably started out swimming at a young age, were very fast, and kept it up over time.

Windrath
November 24th, 2017, 11:10 AM
Larry,

Unless I missed it, you have not mentioned what your training program is like – frequency and volume/practice. If you are NOT practicing 3-5x per week and swimming at least 2,000 yds/meters each time, you are probably not putting enough time in.

Having said that, no amount of swimming with inefficient technique is going to make you faster. You have reached a threshold that only technical improvements can change. Swimmers with inefficient technique are like “dragsters on ice.” Adding more horsepower only spins the wheels faster – there is no increase in speed.

There is a theory in speed boat design that applies to swimmers: “The longer the boat, the faster the boat.” In swimming, this translates to techniques that reduce drag. If you look forward when you swim, your legs will drop and you increase drag. If your arms are mostly straight when you pull, you increase drag. If you have poor ankle flexibility, you increase drag. More drag = slower swimming.

Try these two tests: a) using a kick board and flutter kicking, how many kicks does it take you to go from one end of the pool to the next and how fast? and b) how far can you glide when pushing off the wall? Glide as far as you can – on or under water – holding your breath the entire time.

The “a” test is a measure of foot size and ankle flexibility. Poor ankle flexibility adversely affects everything in swimming. The “b” test is indicative of how streamline you can make your body which also affects everything in swimming. Better streamline = less drag = more speed.

These are just the beginning steps of determining what is holding you back. Looking forward to the results :)

Paul

larrycz
November 24th, 2017, 04:53 PM
Once again, thank you all for your comments. In particular, thanks to __steve__ for his detailed private response.


Unless I missed it, you have not mentioned what your training program is like – frequency and volume/practice. The graphic gives an idea of my training volume in the blue bars for each month. It's actually hours of practice, not meters of distance. The tallest bar is a 24-hour month.

I'll try the kicking and glide tests soon, thanks for the tip. From doing similar tests in the past I'd estimate 22 seconds for the kick and 7m for the glide.

Windrath
November 24th, 2017, 09:40 PM
Hi Larry -

Thanks for the info. The amount of training time seems ok - would be good to know what your volume is as well. Swimming 24 hours/month is good if you are averaging 2000-2500 yds/mtrs per hour, but not so good if you are only doing 1,000 yds/mtrs/hour.

Likewise, the kicking speed seems pretty good as well.

However, a glide of 7 mtrs suggests there is room for considerable improvement in your streamline position. I am about the same height and weight as you and could glide almost 20 yards when I was your age. I am down to 15 yards or so now - leg strength has dropped over the past 28 years. At that time, I was swimming 57 for 100 meters taking 15 strokes/length.

Great streamlining is important because the push-off is the second fastest you will go in a race. You will be faster only during the start. Holding that speed as long as possible is key and it will take you under the wave that follows you into the wall. You can practice the feel for streamlining by hanging from a pull-up bar with your hands overlapped, arms squeezing your ears, legs together, toes pointed, knees locked, and squeezing your belly button towards your spine. When you push off the wall, the top of your head should point towards the end of the pool. if you can see the other end of the pool, your head position is less than optimal.

You should attempt to streamline 7-9 yards off every turn you do. Speaking of which, are you doing open turns or flip turns? Bad flip turns can add 2 seconds/turn to your time.

Another skill to master is floating face down in the streamline position. This will give you immediate feedback about your balance in the water. If you can stay horizontal in a streamline position (holding your breath) with your heels at the surface of the water, you have good balance and muscle control. If you cannot do this, ask a synchronized swimmer to help. The better your balance, the faster you will go.

More to come with your reply.

Paul

__steve__
November 25th, 2017, 03:29 PM
Once again, thank you all for your comments. In particular, thanks to __steve__ for his detailed private response.You are welcome. Glad to help some. I’ve received so much collective assistance and help from this forum that resulted withincredible improvements in my race times. Posting videos for review and reading training accounts of others are also key. I still have significant improvements to make, it’s ongoing for all swimmers, but that’s what makes it worth while.

The kick time trials and glide tests are crucial for sprinters, good tip

OliverK
December 9th, 2017, 04:17 PM
Hello larrycz,
there is a similar thread
http://theswimforum.palstani.com/t30-challenge-50-100-m
about the more basic challenge, for *late starters*, to swim 50m in 30s (and, easier, swimming 100m in 1:10).

I don't know whether you have already started master's races. I think at some point this serves as a good focus point / motivation.
I am also in the UK. One could meet at some events there, and discuss stuff (master's swimming seems, at least in the UK, an excessively anonymous undertaking, which perhaps comes from its being derived from club-swimming, where only the club exists -- no individuals).

rtodd
December 17th, 2017, 10:16 PM
If you have been really serious for 5 years now, it could be tough. Over the course of the next 5 years or so, maybe you can get there. You are young, so you can get much better before age starts to slow you down. I started at 40 with zero youth swimming and got down to a 57 SCY in about 4 years or so and a 1:05 ish 100 SCM. I think I could have done it if I really wanted. I’m 53 now and my feel for the water has gotten so much better. Maybe I could get close now, but I don’t have the time.
A hint to do this is to get proficient in all the strokes. It will help your freestyle.

__steve__
December 18th, 2017, 01:13 PM
A hint to do this is to get proficient in all the strokes. It will help your freestyle.Good hint

larrycz
February 16th, 2018, 02:00 AM
Windradth, you asked about distance per practice. I would average 1,500-2,000m per hour depending on stroke.


However, a glide of 7 mtrs suggests there is room for considerable improvement in your streamline position. I am about the same height and weight as you and could glide almost 20 yards when I was your age. I am down to 15 yards or so now - leg strength has dropped over the past 28 years.
Paul

15 yards to glide off a push is a surreal distance to me. Definitely an area I should look into. Maybe a high resolution video of me streamlining will tell me a lot. Thank you for the hint.