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hmlee
August 1st, 2005, 07:42 PM
Since I am sort of forced to swim alone rather than on a master's team this summer I often end up swimming after/before/next to someone who has horrible technique. I'm not nitpicking here, but I'm talking about dragging legs, barely getting arms out of the water, and nearly stopping to breathe on freestyle, or arms that kind of lazily flop down during the backstroke.

The question is, if you see someone doing something like that do you offer help with their stroke / or pointers?

Currently, I don't. But I'm somewhat torn. I don't want to sound arrogant and like I know everything, or to hurt someone's feelings, but I can't help thinking how much less energy these people would expend, and how much more success they would have swimming if they swam correctly. So, what do you do?

F'ueco
August 1st, 2005, 08:05 PM
Sometimes I end up talking briefly with the people in and around my lane. If they seem friendly, I might offer a pointer on 'how you can swim faster' (since that makes them know that you think they CAN go faster).

I've had people do the same for me, so it's the least I can do.

Allen Stark
August 1st, 2005, 08:27 PM
If they have awful technique I generally say nothing,unless they have been coming awhile and I am starting to know them. If they are pretty good and have visible stroke flaw I generally will say something. I start by saying something like"you have a better stroke than most of the people I see here,but would you mind if I made a suggestion?" They always say they'd love any help and always seem grateful.

battle
August 1st, 2005, 09:33 PM
I have given a few pointers over the years but find that it is best to let them ask for advice first.

Rob Copeland
August 1st, 2005, 10:15 PM
As a rule I don’t give unsolicited advice to strangers, unless they ask. I will make comments to the people I swim with regularly or I’ll point something out to our coach and see if she wants to pass it along to another swimmer.

“but I can't help thinking how much less energy these people would expend, and how much more success they would have swimming if they swam correctly.” Who’s to say that the goal of the other swimmer is to burn maximum calories per length, instead of going faster? If this is the case then, the inefficient stroke will be just as effective as an Ian Crocker-esque butterfly.

hmlee
August 1st, 2005, 11:02 PM
That's a good point rob, but I guess what I'm thinking of are people who's stroke technique are causing them to go slower AND spend more energy (therefore they arn't able to swim as long as someone who's swimming more efficiently) than they could be if they were to pick up their legs or stop moving in a certain way.

Rich Abrahams
August 1st, 2005, 11:23 PM
Not more than a week ago, some guy during my noon lap swim workout stopped me and told me I rolled way too much and should keep my body very flat and only turn my head to breath. I thanked him for his insights.

Michael Heather
August 2nd, 2005, 01:27 AM
I am guilty of giving unsolicited advice in the past, but no more. I have found that if the swimmer is a regular competitor, they are generally thankful for any help offered. I know I am.

The others who are not competitors are rarely interested in what you have to say, and some are offended by your remarks, no matter how accurate or insightful. I once tried to give a little stroke technique to a teammate in the next lane (I had swum with her for 5 years), and got a very chilly response. 2 years later, she had to have sugery on the shoulder that I was pointing out.

Most people are in the pool to put in a certain number of laps and get on with their day. The added discomfort of changing their stroke for the better is not always welcome, even if you explain that they will become comfortable in the new stroke in a short time.

Bottom line as I have sorted out, keep your mouth shut unless asked for help. I add the imaginary scenario that I am in the same age group (and sex, if necessary), and decide that it is not necessary to help the competition.

PeirsolFan
August 2nd, 2005, 02:32 AM
People who slap their hands and arms down in the water during free. People attempting back with no concept of catch and pull. People attempting back moving so hesitantly - in fear of running into something.

But no one asks so... I try to avoid lanes alongside the water surface slappers and look away from backstrokers with flailing arms. I'm there to do my own thing.

Management informed me at one pool that lifeguards are encouraged to offer pointers to poor swimmers but I've never seen any of them do anything but roll their eyes.

valhallan
August 2nd, 2005, 08:16 AM
.... rolled way too much and should keep my body very flat and only turn my head to breath. I thanked him for his insights.
Maybe you should have asked him to time you for a couple of laps. ;)

Like most people posted ...I'll offer tips, but only if asked.

aquageek
August 2nd, 2005, 10:54 AM
I am very reluctant to give advice, even to my training partners, unless they ask. I think it is flat rude to offer unsolicited advice. If someone wants your opinion, I suspect they will ask.

craiglll@yahoo.com
August 2nd, 2005, 11:10 AM
I get asked allogf the time. And i also give unsolicited advice. Yesterday, I gave some pointers & soem drills to a guy who didn't learn to swim until he was inhis 30's. His hand placement is terrible. He is a triath. and his swimming has improved remarkably. He told me that swimming wasn't realy his major interest that he thought he did the worst on bike. He is probably right. The longest swim he has ever done in competition is 800 yds. I once told him why bother to swim at all.

Usually, I start both by saying how improved they are. There are only three to five people who swim at my pool who are long-time swimmers. I get all types of questions. I don't always know the answers. One lady asked me if I coudl see something wrong with her stroke so that her elbow wounldn't hurt so much. I almost said "where do I begin." I realized that would destroy her.

scyfreestyler
August 2nd, 2005, 11:42 AM
I never offer advice but I have had advice offered to me by others and it usually sucks. The last time it occured a guy suggested that I not keep my head so low in the water. He said that if I look towards the end of the pool it will cause my body to plane up and out of the water thereby reducing drag. I simply thanked him and went about my regular methods. If I were to offer advice solely about dropped elbows I would have to speak to half of the pool so why even bother?

Guvnah
August 2nd, 2005, 01:28 PM
I don't usually say anything to people about their strokes, but I do offer advice about their flip turns if I see they are trying to learn it.

Just last week there was a guy trying it out. Couldn't get it at all. So when I was done my workout (I never inturrupt my workout!) I asked him if he wanted a pointer. The I gave him some basic pointers, and offered to point him to the FLIP TURNS VIDEO (http://www.goswim.tv/drilloftheweek_comments.php?id=979_0_20_0_C) link. I got his email address and sent him the link.

So far I have done this with three people who all wanted the link.

But one guy did turn me down. I swim with him pretty regularly, and he's rather quick, but slow on the turns. If he could keep up on the turns, I'd have someone who could push me for any distance. (I didn't tell him this, though.) I just asked him if he would like to make his turns faster, but he wasn't interested. He's a triathlete, and a pretty damn good one. Turns don't matter for his purposes, and I fully understood and let it drop.

Besides flip turns, I rarely talk stroke techniques with people. Unless they ask first. But I have made one exception. There is this 17-year-old kid who just took up swimming in the past year. He's captain of his high school cross country and track teams, and he wants to be a triathlete. In a year he has become a formidable swimmer, and I can hardly contain my excitement for his progress. I think we're going to be reading about him in years to come. He's unusually humble for an athlete of his calibre. As he has progressed, I spoke up to him about some things I noticed. He never seemed put off, so I haven't held back. Nowadays there is nothing I can add, so we just talk about what's next on his horizons (upcoming mini-triathlons, his college plans, stuff like that.) Sometimes I wonder if I make a pest of myself, and I just hope I don't.

aquageek
August 2nd, 2005, 01:51 PM
Originally posted by Guvnah
He's a triathlete, and a pretty damn good one. Turns don't matter for his purposes, and I fully understood and let it drop.


I think this is a definite fallacy on his part and on tris/open water swimmers in general. An improper flip turn or even an open turn takes a whole lot more effort than a decent flip turn. If your tri buddy could do a proper turn, he could devote even more of his energy to proper swimming, which in the long run benefits him more. By choosing to do a bad turn, he is wasting effort.

I have found that the more I work on my flip turn, the more I am able to improve my swimming overall. But, I guess that's not part of the tri manual.

IndyGal
August 2nd, 2005, 02:08 PM
Personally, I'd love unsolicited advice from the "power swimmers" at my pool. I'm usually too intimidated to introduce myself and ask for pointers. I don't think you guys know how hard it is for a novice to come in and stake out a lane next to someone who's in the middle of, say, 6 x 150 on 2:30 IMs.

Guvnah
August 2nd, 2005, 03:09 PM
Originally posted by aquageek
I think this is a definite fallacy on his part and on tris/open water swimmers in general. An improper flip turn or even an open turn takes a whole lot more effort than a decent flip turn. If your tri buddy could do a proper turn, he could devote even more of his energy to proper swimming, which in the long run benefits him more. By choosing to do a bad turn, he is wasting effort.

I have found that the more I work on my flip turn, the more I am able to improve my swimming overall. But, I guess that's not part of the tri manual.

Right, but once I offer unsolicited advice and it is turned down, I stop pressing the issue.

laineybug
August 2nd, 2005, 04:04 PM
I don't generally, but when I do I strike up a conversation about swimming and find something positive to say about the stroke. That usually evolves into a discussion about technique. Sometimes you gotta go down the slide to get into the pool.

ande
August 2nd, 2005, 04:11 PM
Ignore them if you can.
If you feel compelled to help them say,

I've been watching you swim and I have a few suggestions that might help you swim better
would you like to hear what they are?

or

I've been watching you swim and I have a few suggestions that might help you swim better
would you like for me to show you and work with you to improve your technique?

If they say YES then proceed.
Personally I like to ask,
if they say yes then I test them with no instruction,
then I show them and work with them to correct their technique then I test them again to see if the change made them faster.

Most often people appreciate the help and attention.

Ande


Originally posted by hmlee
Since I am sort of forced to swim alone rather than on a master's team this summer I often end up swimming after/before/next to someone who has horrible technique. I'm not nitpicking here, but I'm talking about dragging legs, barely getting arms out of the water, and nearly stopping to breathe on freestyle, or arms that kind of lazily flop down during the backstroke.

The question is, if you see someone doing something like that do you offer help with their stroke / or pointers?

Currently, I don't. But I'm somewhat torn. I don't want to sound arrogant and like I know everything, or to hurt someone's feelings, but I can't help thinking how much less energy these people would expend, and how much more success they would have swimming if they swam correctly. So, what do you do?

ande
August 2nd, 2005, 04:12 PM
also if you want help from an elite swimmer
ask them if they'd mind watching your technique and offering any tips that might help you improve

ande

aztimm
August 2nd, 2005, 04:13 PM
Over the years of swimming on my own before I joined masters, it seemed quite common to talk to others in lanes nearby, especially if I saw them on a regular basis. Many of them shared tips for me, and I did for them as well.

One of the best unsolicited advice times for me came from a lifeguard at a college pool I was using for a summer. Basically, the place was dead while I was there, so it was just her watching me. I think she got tired of seeing me struggle, and many times she got in the water to work with me. I learned flip turns that summer, cleaned up my free and breast, got a handle on back...started a little on fly. She even had me practice some land drills for the next time. I bought a swimming book also, and asked her questions about some stroke movements. If it wasn't her, I probably wouldn't have felt strong enough to ever join a masters team.

That said, I'm always hesitant to offer advice. I sure don't want to teach them something wrong... But if I get asked, I do try to help as I can.

ande
August 2nd, 2005, 04:16 PM
You can also offer to hire an elite swimmer or coach
for a private lesson.
broke college students are often happy to help and get paid

ande

scyfreestyler
August 2nd, 2005, 04:32 PM
Originally posted by ande
You can also offer to hire an elite swimmer or coach
for a private lesson.
broke college students are often happy to help and get paid

ande I would love to pay somebody with significant swimming skill to teach me a thing or two. If any of you ever find yourselves in the Monterey/Salinas, California area and want to make a few bucks, look me up!

PeirsolFan
August 2nd, 2005, 06:21 PM
Originally posted by IndyGal
Personally, I'd love unsolicited advice from the "power swimmers" at my pool. I'm usually too intimidated to introduce myself and ask for pointers. I don't think you guys know how hard it is for a novice to come in and stake out a lane next to someone who's in the middle of, say, 6 x 150 on 2:30 IMs.

Make sure you understand the rules and then try a free trial membership at a local health club. You'll get a lot of power swimmers and be forced to learn fast. Nothing to be intimidated about as you probably wont ever see any of those people again.

craiglll@yahoo.com
August 3rd, 2005, 10:23 AM
Originally posted by ande
You can also offer to hire an elite swimmer or coach
for a private lesson.
broke college students are often happy to help and get paid

ande

I'd like to know some broke college student. It seems that when I was at college no one had any money. Now all of my friends kids are rolling in dough.

SwiminONandON
August 3rd, 2005, 11:34 AM
Almost every time I swim on my own (I swim with my team 99% of the time) I get asked to help someone with flip turns. I've also asked a person once if they wanted a few pointers. Most of the people I see swimming would need a major stroke overhall, but when I see someone that is clearly a tri-athlete or wanting to improve I'll ask if they want a pointer.

Once I asked a woman if I could give her a pointer and she said sure but she wasn't going to listen. SO I shrugged and told her anyway. Halfway through my hand entry angle speech she stopped me and said wow you know what you are talking about, thanks! I gave her a few tips and off she went.

For the most part many of the people I see swimming need way more than a pointer, I also know that usually it annoys the crap out of me when someone stops me in the middle of my workout.

Guvnah
August 3rd, 2005, 01:25 PM
For those considering initiating this conversation in the other direction (asking a "power swimmer" for advice, instead of the initial question asked in this thread) I recommend one thing to consider.

Please don't physically stop the "power swimmer" to ask for help. Wait until the "power swimmer" is done with his/her workout. Even if that power swimmer is stopped between reps, s/he may only be planning to stop for 10 seconds, and your interruption will likely take longer that that -- even just to tell you to wait till later. Further, that swimmer is likely in a mental "zone" of concentration that your interruption would shatter.

Usually you can tell when s/he is done. (Or catch him/her before s/he starts.) If he gets out of the pool, that's a good guess. Or maybe she takes off her cap and is chatting with a lane mate. In the shower is also a good guess. Even safer, in the parking lot.

hmlee
August 3rd, 2005, 02:46 PM
I'm a poor college student! Oooh ooh pick me! Hahah...

Guvnah made a good point about when to ask people about stroke technique, but it kind of made me laugh because it made us more "serious" swimmers sound like some form of wild animal. Look out! There goes a power swimmer! Duck for cover!

knelson
August 3rd, 2005, 02:59 PM
Originally posted by ande
You can also offer to hire an elite swimmer or coach
for a private lesson.
broke college students are often happy to help and get paid

ande

That sounds like a potential NCAA violation to me!

craiglll@yahoo.com
August 3rd, 2005, 03:22 PM
Originally posted by knelson
That sounds like a potential NCAA violation to me!

I think you are right. I know a girl who was a cheerleader at SUIE. She got a scholarship for. She was also teaching gymnastics at a gym. She got in a lot of trouble.

Old Flyer
August 3rd, 2005, 03:31 PM
Hey IndyGal,
How do you do 150IMs?


Originally posted by IndyGal
Personally, I'd love unsolicited advice from the "power swimmers" at my pool. I'm usually too intimidated to introduce myself and ask for pointers. I don't think you guys know how hard it is for a novice to come in and stake out a lane next to someone who's in the middle of, say, 6 x 150 on 2:30 IMs.

IndyGal
August 3rd, 2005, 04:08 PM
Originally posted by Guvnah
In the shower is also a good guess. Even safer, in the parking lot.

LOL. Isn't that known as "stalking"?

IndyGal
August 3rd, 2005, 04:09 PM
Originally posted by Old Flyer
Hey IndyGal,
How do you do 150IMs?


Umm, yes, bad example. Clearly I typed that one *before* my morning expresso. :D

FindingMyInnerFish
August 3rd, 2005, 09:25 PM
Asking for advice--I approached a guy today whose flip turns looked lovely, complimented him, and told him I wish I could do mine as well and if he had a second, I'd appreciate any tips. He was very nice and more than happy to oblige.

OTOH, I'm too new to the game to give tips to anyone--not that I haven't seen things that seem in need of tips even to my inexperienced eyes. The water slappers--I'm sometimes tempted to ask, "what did that water ever do to you?" But of course I don't. I instead wonder to myself if I'm doing the same thing w/out realizing it, altho. I do try to remember what my coach drilled into me all spring...fingertips in first. So I could have been the water slapper myself.

As for others giving me unsolicited tips... the ones I most wish would do so are usu. pretty busy w/ their workouts. While I occasionally ask them questions if they look receptive to a quick conversation, I'm careful to give them the space to do their workout.

Once when I accidently inhaled a little water and finished coughing a little (that and an allergy), some lady came by (not a "power swimmer") and called out to me, "you need to breathe better, dear!" Well ... um .... thanks.

Swimmer Bill
August 3rd, 2005, 11:06 PM
Same here.

If someone approaches me and says, "Boy, you're a fast swimmer...how do you swim so fast?" or something to that effect, that may open the door for giving a pointer -- but only if they ask for it. Usually I just say "Thank you, I've been practicing..." I also usually say something about Masters swimming, and how people can improve by participating in Masters. That usually leads to a longer conversation in the hot tub about what Masters is, who can join, etc.

Bill


Originally posted by Rob Copeland
As a rule I don’t give unsolicited advice to strangers, unless they ask. I will make comments to the people I swim with regularly or I’ll point something out to our coach and see if she wants to pass it along to another swimmer.

“but I can't help thinking how much less energy these people would expend, and how much more success they would have swimming if they swam correctly.” Who’s to say that the goal of the other swimmer is to burn maximum calories per length, instead of going faster? If this is the case then, the inefficient stroke will be just as effective as an Ian Crocker-esque butterfly.

craiglll@yahoo.com
August 4th, 2005, 10:56 AM
Yesterday, hte pool was somewhat crowded - 5 people. A man actually said that I was a serious swimmer so he'd get out of my way. there is probably only opne other "serious" swimmer at the pool where I swim. He is a triathelete then there is one guy whois okay. Neither of them are really any good. One I give advice to but he really doesn't understand how to put it into play. I've told him for two or three years to pay attention to how he enters his hands and not to place them into the water. He doesn't really know what that means even though he has now swam for about 5 years and was a college runner, he can't understand how to translate the words into action.

This made me wonder, when do people get tot he point where they understand what a coach is saying? I know that with running, it happened when I was a senoir in high school but with swimming, I don't remember a specific tiem when i realized that I understood what the coach was telling me to do and able toput the words into action. Maybe I still don't?

laineybug
August 4th, 2005, 11:25 AM
That is a very interesting observation. I call it an "Ah Ha!" experience. I've had it a couple of times in things like calculus and factor analysis when I was studying statistics. But, like you, I don't ever remember not being able to understand what someone was trying to tell me in relation to swimming. I would guess it might have something to do with how we learn. Some of us are auditory/verbal learners... tell us and we can translate the words into actions and I don't necessarily mean phyiscal movements. Others like to be shown, still others learn from movement... kinetic. Then you combine that with our cognitive strengths and weaknesses. Some of us are very verbal and not very visual and vice versa. There is a group of kinetics too. The trouble comes in when, for example, a person who is very verbal and prefers to learn through the auditory mode is instructed through the visual channel. Can you imagine how difficult it must be for a person who needs to be taught through movement to learn a verbal skill like reading? There are still others, who, like me, have a mixed strength/learning preference. I am very strong in my nonverbal reasoning, visual/spatial and visual/motor skills. Yet I prefer to be taught through the auditory/verbal channel... lectures please, just let me listen and take notes. Maybe it is the combination of the words and nonverbal abilities that make it possible for me to translate it into movement. Okay, enough of the cognitive psychology.

Conniekat8
August 4th, 2005, 03:58 PM
Originally posted by Rob Copeland
Who’s to say that the goal of the other swimmer is to burn maximum calories per length, instead of going faster? If this is the case then, the inefficient stroke will be just as effective as an Ian Crocker-esque butterfly.

There ya go!
I just knew there was a perfectly good reason for the way I swim !!! :D

Conniekat8
August 4th, 2005, 04:00 PM
Originally posted by Old Flyer
Hey IndyGal,
How do you do 150IMs?

butt free?

Conniekat8
August 4th, 2005, 04:05 PM
Originally posted by craiglll@yahoo.com

This made me wonder, when do people get tot he point where they understand what a coach is saying? ?

Different people visialize things different ways, they learn and process things differently.
A really skilled and educated coach usually has a number of teaching styles that they can use to get 'through' to the swimmer.
With some people you need to overcompensate, wioth others you need to help them visualize by placing their hand for them, one way vs. the other to feel the difference, some people you tell a story, and it gives them that AH-HAH! moment, spme people you need top tape and show them... and there area few that arn't open to making changes, even when they claim they are.

dpflyer
August 5th, 2005, 09:17 AM
I just read all the posts, not having been here for a while.

Giving, receiving advice- I offer advice when I see someone resting. I rarely interrupt someone. Usually when I give advice I introduce myself as a Masters coach. If they don't want advice I let them go. [Once I was a little too persistent and was reported to the Y as being "too aggressive." My supervisor, the Aquatic Director, had to admonish me, but was smirking while she did. She understood my frustration.] So, I'm more careful now. But, generally people accept and execute what I tell them and their swimming improves and they're very happy. I'm kind of in Rich Abrahams camp when someone gives me advice. I try to stay up with current swimming technique so when I give advice it's pretty current.

On teaching new technique- I think showing and doing, maybe repetitively at first with lots of feedback, is the most successful. I use articles, video clips of great swimmers, just started video-taping. I love it when I come upon someone with a science or engineering background, then I can use physics with them! Sometimes communication is easier when you can relate their experience with what you are trying to teach.

I really love helping people improve their swimming.

Dick

iswim41
August 12th, 2005, 03:41 AM
I never give advice unless asked.


I'm often told I have a great stroke (but terrible kick) and one woman who was a paddler, told me, in the locker room, that I shouldn't throw water on the deck during my flip turns. I just kind of looked at her, puzzled, and went back to getting dressed. Meaning, I'd accept advice from somebody who I thought knew what they were talking about.

christineL
November 5th, 2007, 10:30 AM
I will never give advise unless asked. The best thing I can do is to do by examples, like, I'd swim using new techinque and show better results later. That often draw responses from the others.

If I'm in their shoes, I'd ask who I feel is a proven qualified person. Thus, I'd check around to see who I ought o ask.

Swimmer Bill
November 5th, 2007, 10:44 AM
As a rule I don’t give unsolicited advice to strangers, unless they ask.

Same here.

okoban
November 5th, 2007, 03:12 PM
I sometimes request help from the coaches. I do help some people if they seem to take it positively. But normally most of the people do not care about their swiming technique at all. I like talk about swimming technique a lot. I do not know what's wrong with me. :thhbbb:

christineL
November 5th, 2007, 03:43 PM
:party2: I love to read and learn about techinques! I tell myself that those swimmers will do better if they bother to learn on how they can improve. :D

funkyfish
November 5th, 2007, 03:44 PM
I'm in the boat with those who don't unless asked. I've been caught a time or two giving lifting advice to people who were on their way to injuring themselves, but because it wasn't solicited, afterward I felt as if "I talked too much."

Swimming-wise, I feel I'm of average speed, but upon looking at recent video of myself, I see where I'm in no position to offer advice. Maybe when I swim a :54 in the 100m free. Till then, it's "swim and be quiet" for me.
:banana:

2fish&1whale
November 5th, 2007, 05:02 PM
i have often bitten my tounge, instead of saying something when i see someone fighting their way across the pool..i always tell myself that i'm no one to talk since i have no clue if my stroke is correct or not...on the other hand if it isn't -----:help: it would be nice if someone pointed this out to me before i continue to make a fool out of myself!!!!!!

Got Boost
November 5th, 2007, 11:15 PM
I too am in the no advice unless asked camp. I guess I do not want to come off as a know it all or something along those lines. If you ask then I am full of good ideas:drink:

Giot Boost

christineL
November 6th, 2007, 10:52 AM
2fish&1whale,

Just continue to take stroke lessons. That is something many people don't understand about swimming. There is always something new to learn. I'll be taking mine soon. :D :cheerleader::groovy:

okoban
November 7th, 2007, 03:33 PM
Christine, :applaud:

christineL
November 7th, 2007, 08:17 PM
Oko, you have the guts to put your video online! :notworthy: I will not until I feel like I'm doing a bit better. ;) The critique were very useful that I thought about it during my workout yesterday morning.

Blackbeard's Peg
November 8th, 2007, 02:18 PM
I get asked plenty of times to look at strangers' strokes. Usually, I can suggest something simple for them to work on. There have been occasions in the past where I had noticed something in someone while I've been swimming, and they'll stop to ask me about something at some point and I can point it out to them.
If there's something for a teammate, I'll try to mention it to the coach to mention to them. Unless its the blue muppet. I tell her straight up "fix your left arm" for backstroke 8 days a week.

swimmieAvsFan
November 8th, 2007, 02:21 PM
If there's something for a teammate, I'll try to mention it to the coach to mention to them. Unless its the blue muppet. I tell her straight up "fix your left arm" for backstroke 8 days a week.

and twice on sundays.
:laugh2:

but seriously, i only correct strangers if asked.
teammates, i give unsolicited advice often. guess that's just the coach in me coming out. :)

FlyQueen
November 9th, 2007, 12:53 AM
I've gotten a lot more outspoken in giving in advice in the last year I've been coaching. I have one swimmer however who basically refuses to listen to anything any coach says so in return I have stopped saying anything. A few weeks ago I asked if he wanted help to make his stroke better he said no ... and that was that.

I cannot swim on my own without someone saying something to me. Today I got asked if I was a professional swimmer. I laughed and said no. Then he asked if I was trying to be. Again laughter and no. Apparently with my hat thingy I look like one. Usually though it's you are really strong, you are really fast, or where did you swim in college.

I don't give advice to strangers ever. I tried to help a former teammate the other day (during what was already going to be a brief workout). I gave him one tip and he actually asked if I'd watch him swim a half lap. 50 yards later I told him some more and I basically ended up giving a non-team member a 20 minute private lesson for free. Oh well ...

ddl
September 28th, 2008, 12:47 AM
I wish I had seen this thread earlier. I'm surprised so many people think it's not a good idea to give unsolicited advice that will benefit someone, but a recent experience, not swimming related, did confirm to me that you folks are right, not just in swimming. Your well-intentioned help can not only be ill-interpreted but even cause much worse consequences . :bitching:

But anyway, I myself would be most grateful if some good swimmers at the pool would tell me what problems they have observed of my swimming. Interestingly I've hardly seen anyone correcting strangers' swim problems.

geochuck
September 28th, 2008, 08:03 AM
Yes I do.

I missed this when it was first posted. I was in Mezico for the winter and had hard time getting on the net.

The second time it came up I was in Mexico for the winter and again trouble with the internet.

pwolf66
September 28th, 2008, 08:32 AM
I tend to want to give advice but when I do approach someone I always ask 'do you mind a little assistance?' depending on the reaction I either point out a couple of things or I just walk away.

Edit: Advice is rarely offered and is offered only to those who are struggling with just the fundamentals. If they are an experienced swimmer, I just mind my own business. Unless they're a friend, in which case I give them a double barrel full <g>

CreamPuff
September 28th, 2008, 08:44 AM
No b/c I don't like it when others try and correct me (other than my coach). This goes double when said person is slower than I am.

2fish&1whale
September 28th, 2008, 10:04 AM
Yes I do.

I missed this when it was first posted. I was in Mezico for the winter and had hard time getting on the net.

The second time it came up I was in Mexico for the winter and again trouble with the internet.


My advice to you ;)----don't go to Mexico if you don't want to miss posts!

mjgold
September 28th, 2008, 10:51 AM
I only give advice to people on my team at practice, and only if they either ask for it or I see them struggling with some basic things. There was a woman who couldn't figure out why she was getting so winded, so I watched her swim and noticed a few things. I pointed them out, and she came up to me after practice and thanked me.

iswim41
September 28th, 2008, 11:38 AM
Same here. I've done it and had both reactions. I've been on the receiving end, too, once, when someone who was a horrible swimmer tried to advise me on my flip turns (I was throwing too much water onto the deck, in her opinion), and I just thanked her and moved on, but I didn't ask for her advice and wasn't happy she offered.

When I ask for help, I listen, because I'm asking someone I think can help me. So, I figure if someone wants advice, they'll ask. I also think that as long as they're in the water swimming, it's a good thing. Once they get to a point where they're open to advice they'll either get lessons or start asking.

ddl
September 28th, 2008, 12:54 PM
My advice to you ;)----don't go to Mexico if you don't want to miss posts!

He only went to Mexico the second time. The first time he went to "Mezico" :D

I would be happy if geochuck were around where I swim :)

geochuck
September 28th, 2008, 12:59 PM
He only went to Mexico the second time. The first time he went to "Mezico" :D

I would be happy if geochuck were around where I swim :)

It was very hard to get on the internet after a few of Margaritas and after two I always spell Mexico as Mezico.

Mary1912
September 28th, 2008, 12:59 PM
I'd never give advice unless asked. I would not be offended personally by unsolicted advice but many people are so I just keep my mouth shut.

craiglll@yahoo.com
September 28th, 2008, 01:03 PM
i hate it when some one asks my advice and then tell me I'm wrong. Or won't do what I tell them to do because they don't see how it will help. I told a guy to do some catch up strokes because he wasn't swimming in the front quadrant. His hands were traveling too far past his hips. he said what i told him to do was wrong. he had never taken lessons and had taught himself to swim when he was in his mid 20s. He still weaves his way down a pool.