PDA

View Full Version : Triathletes Advocating Flipturns? Have they gone mad?



Damage Inc
August 29th, 2005, 07:11 PM
Home: Slowtwitch Forums: Triathlon Forum:
Swimming advice - flip turns or not


Slowtwitch Forums Triathlon Forum Classifieds Tibbs' Lavender Room




jsm

Aug 29, 2005, 12:53 PM

Post #1 of 18 (494 views)
Copy Shortcut
Swimming advice - flip turns or not Can't Post

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

We got a new master swimming coach which insist on having everybody doing flip turns during the entire workout. Never really focused on flip turning in the pool since it does not really matter in the ocean/river. I am not against it, but I am three weeks from my first ironman and now having to focus on flip turns instead of working on strokes and yardage (get too tired to stroke correctly after an 1h of flip turns) does not seam to be the best approach. The new coach does not agree since it helps my lungs. I think it is something you focus on the off season, not in the middle of the season when we are competing.

Any great advice from swimming coaches or others?

Thanks!





mperlberg

Aug 29, 2005, 12:55 PM

Post #2 of 18 (482 views)
Copy Shortcut
Re: Swimming advice - flip turns or not [jsm] [In reply to] Can't Post

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

do them.





hasbeenswimmer

Aug 29, 2005, 12:58 PM

Post #3 of 18 (473 views)
Copy Shortcut
Re: Swimming advice - flip turns or not [jsm] [In reply to] Can't Post

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Yes and No....

But for right now tell the guy to go screw himself and do it your way until your IM......

Now after you IM stop being a sissy wall hanger and learn flip turns. You'll be able to fit in more yardage in less time and you will stop hanging on the walls for rest.

Does that help?

Tim
----------------------------------------------------------





neotri

Aug 29, 2005, 12:59 PM

Post #4 of 18 (463 views)
Copy Shortcut
Re: Swimming advice - flip turns or not [jsm] [In reply to] Can't Post

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Do the flip-turns!!! They are not a big deal. If you want to swim with the Master's group you have to follow the rules. Doing flip-turns makes circle swimming with multiple swimmers in the lane a lot smoother. If you don't want to do the turns then swim on your own.





Reddy

Aug 29, 2005, 1:01 PM




29, 2005, 1:02 PM

Post #6 of 18 (425 views)
Copy Shortcut
Re: Swimming advice - flip turns or not [jsm] [In reply to] Can't Post

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Do you stop your bike, unclip, get off and walk your bike anytime you make a sharp turn? Learn to do flip turns. If you are swimming in a Masters workout, who ever is in your lane will appreciate it.

Mark




Aug 29, 2005, 1:10 PM

Post #8 of 18 (390 views)
Copy Shortcut
Re: Swimming advice - flip turns or not [jsm] [In reply to] Can't Post

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Your swimming will benefit from flip turns because you will be able to go faster and then be able to swim with faster people and get faster yet. Besides, it's the right way to do things.

BUT . . . . . . don't change anything major three weeks before a big race. Tell your coach that you would really like to start doing them, but you have to get the IM done first. If your coach can't understand that, then I would really consider looking into another masters swim program (although sometimes we are all stuck with limited options). Or looking into firing the coach because he obviously can't think if he believes that you should change something this significant so close to a big race.





neotri

Aug 29, 2005, 1:37 PM

Post #9 of 18 (310 views)
Copy Shortcut
Re: Swimming advice - flip turns or not [jsm] [In reply to] Can't Post

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Aug 29, 2005, 1:47 PM

Post #10 of 18 (272 views)
Copy Shortcut
Re: Swimming advice - flip turns or not [jsm] [In reply to] Can't Post

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

3 wks out from IM? Fuh-get-about-it. Focus on bilateral breathing and your last bit of fitness and then come home to an off-season of flip-turn fun. I was clocking a 1:01/100 with an open turn and comfortably doing 100s on the 1:25 with an open turn in my preparation for my first IM. I've since worked with competitive swimming friends to develop my flip turns.





tigerchik

Aug 29, 2005, 1:49 PM

Post #11 of 18 (263 views)
Copy Shortcut
Re: Swimming advice - flip turns or not [jsm] [In reply to] Can't Post

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

an hour of flip turns?

I didn't think they were that hard...





swimbutdotris

Aug 29, 2005, 2:06 PM

Post #12 of 18 (219 views)
Copy Shortcut
Re: Swimming advice - flip turns or not [tigerchik] [In reply to] Can't Post

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

flip turns will help you in the pool setting to be sure, but they also have the benefit (once you get the hang of them) of maintaining your swimming speed rhythm between laps and in open water. An open turn can really throw off your rhythm and timing (two of the most important aspects of distance swimming). Do as many as you feel comfortable with now, but after the IM, make a point to do them all of the time. Your lungs will get stronger as well (added bonus).


--------------------------------------------------------


I do not understand why flip turns are so important? If someone else is swimming in my lane as long as I am out of the way by the time they get there isn't that what matters? When you do a flip turn doesn't that mess up your rhytm just as much? All of my questions are coming from someone who can not master the flip turn but still I do not understand the benefit.





kittycat

Aug 29, 2005, 2:20 PM

Post #14 of 18 (174 views)
Copy Shortcut
Re: Swimming advice - flip turns or not [swimbutdotris] [In reply to] Can't Post

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

i disagree with saying that flip turns are ineffective to rythm, because done properly, (like in breast or fly) they are highly effective and fast. i like them, and do them alot because i don't like flipping upside down over and over and over again. something about that makes me feel slightly sick. so i mix it up, and do flip turns on short sets and open turns on long sets. personal preferance i guess...

i start a master's swimming program this week...i'm sure no one will give a crap either way.


(This post was edited by kittycat on Aug 29, 2005, 2:24 PM)





makattack

Aug 29, 2005, 3:02 PM

Post #15 of 18 (110 views)
Copy Shortcut
Re: Are flip turns that beneficial? [MTMTRI] [In reply to] Can't Post

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Flip turns work on the core muscles. As a non-swimmer, since I got in the habit of doing them (thanks for my masters coach), I've found that I haven't had to do crunches in many years. I used to do 50-100 crunches as part of strength training, and now don't even bother.

Flip turns are more effective for maintaining rythm vs. open turns because in doing an effective flip turn, you are still trying to be as smooth in the water as possible. Good tuck, streamlined & powerful launch. To those who ask "how many walls do you flip-turn on in a lake or ocean?" -- well, the same question applies to open-turns: "how many walls can you grab, pull your head and arm out of the water, breath, then push off with?"

The only reason I can think of where lane mates might appreciate flip-turns over open-turns is because most flip turns are less wave-inducing than open turns (since most swimmers I see doing open turns tend to be too close to the surface & not streamlined). I guess this might be one "pro" reason for open turns -- it better simulates choppy water!


(This post was edited by makattack on Aug 29, 2005, 3:03 PM)





brider

Aug 29, 2005, 3:18 PM

Post #16 of 18 (73 views)
Copy Shortcut
Re: Swimming advice - flip turns or not [jsm] [In reply to] Can't Post

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

When in Rome...

Do the flips.

Peter Cruise
August 30th, 2005, 12:32 AM
Barry- we can all sleep a little easier tonight.