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jsmwbnc
January 29th, 2007, 08:59 PM
Heres the scoop. I've been swimming for about 3 years now. My best times (scy) are as follows:
500 free 5:13.something
200 free 157.something else
100 free 52.8
50 free 24.38
100 fly 59.7
I swim between 20,000 and 30,000 yards/week now. I'm 20 years old, (male). My question is, do you think that with the right training and work ethic I could make a cut for the Olympic Trials in 2012? I would expect to train between 2 and 3 hours/day. I know it may sound a little crazy given my times now but I believe that with 6 years to do it, I can. My goal would be to qualify for the 100,200, or 500 free.

blainesapprentice
January 29th, 2007, 09:35 PM
Just to put things into perspective...not that I am any judge as to how fast someone can progress or how far someone can progress--but if you embark on this trip...I'll root you on, and maybe even set some more lofty goals for myself as well!

Qualifying times for the Olympic trials are in long course meter::

400freestyle: 3:59.99 -->your time 5:13.00 converts to a 4:43.26
200freestyle: 1:52.89 -->your time 1:57.50 converts to a 2:15.84
100freestyle: 51.59 -->your time 52.8 converts to a 1:01.18
50freestyle:23.49 -->your time 24.38 converts to a 28.35
100butterfly: 55.59 -->your time 59.7 converts to a 1:08.78

Oh...one last thing...these times are for the 2008 Olympics...I would venture to guess that the times for the 2012 Olympics may be slightly faster.

Warren
January 29th, 2007, 10:13 PM
take it one step at a time.

First get a masters top 10 time
win an event at masters nationals
qulify for a big national meet
do very well at a national meet
qulify for olympic trails

SwimStud
January 29th, 2007, 10:13 PM
I know it may sound a little crazy given my times now but I believe that with 6 years to do it, I can. My goal would be to qualify for the 100,200, or 500 free.

You will never know success or failure if you don't try. Go for it while you have the youth and freedom of time.

jsmwbnc
January 29th, 2007, 10:30 PM
take it one step at a time.

First get a masters top 10 time
win an event at masters nationals
qulify for a big national meet
do very well at a national meet
qulify for olympic trails

all of these are goals that i will have but the main goal will be trials 2012

jsmwbnc
January 29th, 2007, 10:45 PM
Just to put things into perspective...not that I am any judge as to how fast someone can progress or how far someone can progress--but if you embark on this trip...I'll root you on, and maybe even set some more lofty goals for myself as well!

Qualifying times for the Olympic trials are in long course meter::

400freestyle: 3:59.99 -->your time 5:13.00 converts to a 4:43.26
200freestyle: 1:52.89 -->your time 1:57.50 converts to a 2:15.84
100freestyle: 51.59 -->your time 52.8 converts to a 1:01.18
50freestyle:23.49 -->your time 24.38 converts to a 28.35
100butterfly: 55.59 -->your time 59.7 converts to a 1:08.78

Oh...one last thing...these times are for the 2008 Olympics...I would venture to guess that the times for the 2012 Olympics may be slightly faster.

Here is a little math I did
Considering that these conversions are correct, here is the amount of time I would need to improve over the next 6 years (if the qualifying time do not change, which I'm sure they will :blah:)

400/500, I would need to improve a total of 43.27 seconds, which comes out to about 5.41 seconds per 50

200, 22.95 seconds total improvement, 5.74 sec. faster per 50

100 (free), 9.59 seconds total improvement, 4.8 seconds faster per 50

50, 4.86 seconds total improvement

According to this, as of right now I am closest to my goal in the 100 free. It needs the least improvement per 50 (4.8 seconds) to get the qualifying time. Would you all agree with me on this or is it wrong because it's easier to improve in a longer event than it is a short one??

knelson
January 29th, 2007, 11:30 PM
My question is, do you think that with the right training and work ethic I could make a cut for the Olympic Trials in 2012?

Not a chance.

But I'd love you to prove me wrong.

swimr4life
January 29th, 2007, 11:44 PM
Never say never. You would have to work extremely hard to improve that much in that small an amount of time. You will need an excellent coach that knows how to maximize your workout time if you are only working out 2-3 hours a day. I believe most Olympic level swimmers workout 4-5 hours a day plus dryland exercises and weights. You will have to be very consistent, dedicated and determined to reach your goal.... early to bed, eat right, train right and TRAIN HARD for the next 7 years to reach that level of swimming. Are you willing to do all that? If so, I say go for it! It is better to try and fail than to never try and always wonder, "What if...?"! GO FOR IT!:applaud:

swimchickee
January 29th, 2007, 11:52 PM
anything's possible!

scyfreestyler
January 30th, 2007, 12:02 AM
Possible, but not probable. However, I suggest that you make an effort. Put together a plan for the next 6 months and see what kind of progress you can make towards your goal. Take it one step at a time. Keep us posted.

Speedo Racer
January 30th, 2007, 01:31 AM
According to this, as of right now I am closest to my goal in the 100 free. It needs the least improvement per 50 (4.8 seconds) to get the qualifying time. Would you all agree with me on this or is it wrong because it's easier to improve in a longer event than it is a short one??


Shaving 10 seconds in 100 is quite a jump. Your current speed is pretty remarkable considering you've been swimming for 3 years. 52 is a good time, but I can assure you that each .5 second drop from this point on will become exponentially harder. I certainly would not discourage you from trying, pretty much anyting is possible if you believe without a doubt it is possible, you have to know in your heart it is possible. Just keep in mind that thousands and thousands of swimmers who have been bred to win and competing since they were in grade school will not make it to the Olympic trials. It would be a pretty big jump for someone who started @ age 17. Not impossible, but not probable. Especially if you are talking US Olympic trials.

FindingMyInnerFish
January 30th, 2007, 07:33 AM
No technical advice (not qualified to offer that), but just this: if it's something you really, really want to do, go for it. I had a much more modest goal as a runner when I first began running: to qualify for Boston in my age group. It took me until my fourth marathon to do it (I'm not gifted with natural speed, but I'm very, very stubborn.) ;) In the process, I became a much better runner than had I set no such goal. If you do it, recognize and be proud of the milestones along the way. The journey teaches a lot! You'll have days when you're discouraged, days when you're on top of the world. You'll have days when you want to kick all kickboards into the city dump. And days when you can't wait for the next workout. All good. All part of the process! Win or lose, may the time yield rich memories!

I wish you success in your goal!

thewookiee
January 30th, 2007, 08:05 AM
If it's your dream...then go for it! You never know what will happen in 1 year, let alone 6 years.

Good luck!

aquageek
January 30th, 2007, 08:18 AM
Trials is an incredibly lofty goal. I suggest you set some intermediate goals for yourself over the next few years, much as Warren suggested.

globuggie
January 30th, 2007, 08:23 AM
Just wanted to point out, not only does your speed depend on your training, it also depends on your stroke technique, mental strength, personality, genetics, etc. If any one of these things is lacking, you won't make it to Trials. Give it your best shot, and even if you don't make the cut, know that you did your absolute best.

LindsayNB
January 30th, 2007, 08:55 AM
What training environment are you thinking of pursuing this in? I suspect that will be a big factor in your chances of success.

tjburk
January 30th, 2007, 09:12 AM
A lot of good advice in here.......I think Beth hit one of the most important points.....Find a "GOOD" Coach!!! This can make a huge difference. Always pay attention to the road you just left behind, it directly influences the road you take ahead. It's all about the Journey!!!!!!


Good Luck!!!!!

Keep us posted!!!!

jsmwbnc
January 30th, 2007, 09:26 AM
Thanks for all the advice. I believe I'm going to do something along the lines of what scyfreestyler suggested. Just see how much I could improve in 6 months or a year and then reconsider the goal. I plan to go as far as I can without a coach. I have been able to coach myself to the times posted and I am still improving. When the time comes that I have hit a plateau (sp?) I will then find a coach.

aquageek
January 30th, 2007, 09:30 AM
Thanks for all the advice. I believe I'm going to do something along the lines of what scyfreestyler suggested. Just see how much I could improve in 6 months or a year and then reconsider the goal. I plan to go as far as I can without a coach. I have been able to coach myself to the times posted and I am still improving. When the time comes that I have hit a plateau (sp?) I will then find a coach.

I'll be totally blunt with you, you need a coach now. If you go as long as you can without a coach (and given your goal) you are wasting your own time. I note you are in Wilmington. If you are a student at UNCW, go walk on the swim team or practice with them off season.

tjburk
January 30th, 2007, 09:32 AM
I personally would recommend finding a coach now.....even if it is just to have them look at your stroke and maybe give you a few pointers in the right direction. A new set of eyes can see things you never will unless you're video taping and analyzing yourself?

Rob Copeland
January 30th, 2007, 09:43 AM
It is possible but it takes great coaching and a lot of personal desire and talent.

By way of example, 5 year ago my son (age 15) after swimming for 2 years was swimming the 500 in 5:20, the 200 in 1:58 and the 100 in 56. Today (age 20) he is 4:29, 1:37 and 45 (hoping to be 4:25, 1:35 and 44 next month with a shave and taper). He is close to trial cuts in the each of these and plans to get the cuts this summer. So 6 years to go from 5:20 or 5:13 to a trial cut is not impossible.

Work with your coach, share your goals, and as Tracy said enjoy the journey.

knelson
January 30th, 2007, 12:00 PM
It is possible but it takes great coaching and a lot of personal desire and talent.

I think this is key, too. Honestly, making Trials requires a lot of talent. I worked my butt off in the pool all the way through college and never got anywhere close to Trials cuts.

scyfreestyler
January 30th, 2007, 12:06 PM
I think this is key, too. Honestly, making Trials requires a lot of talent. I worked my butt off in the pool all the way through college and never got anywhere close to Trials cuts.


I don't doubt you one bit Kirk...I know how hard it is to get improvement in the water. However, maybe this kid has some talent? Who knows.

knelson
January 30th, 2007, 12:11 PM
I agree, Matt. There are cases where swimmers who have only been swimming for a few years have made Trials. The fact that hundreds of swimmer do make Trials cuts proves it can be done. My only point is it's about a lot more than just hard work.

USMSarah
January 30th, 2007, 12:21 PM
If your main goal is trials in '12 - you MUST get a coach!!! This is something that you cannot do alone. A good coach is a great support in your training (in and out of the pool) - this is huge.

Anything is possible... start with small goals and see where you go!

jsmwbnc
January 30th, 2007, 01:12 PM
I don't go to UNCW right now, I'm going to Cape Fear. It is a community college, so no swim team. However I have lots of friends that swim for UNCW and am pretty good friends with the coach (Todd Desorbo). There is another guy, Dave Sokolofsky, who swam for UNCW but is now graduated. He coaches the age group team at the YMCA, where I swim. I plan on working with Todd and Dave and during the off season swimming with the UNCW team. The only reason I would rather do it alone is because I know what I need to do. Swimming with a group of people is great for working out harder but I feel like the workouts are more generalized instead of tailored to my needs. Again, I really appreciate all of the encouraging replies. Even the not so encouraging ones because that makes me want to do it even more. Rob, congrats on your sons incredible times. Where does he swim for?

The Fortress
January 30th, 2007, 01:22 PM
I'll be totally blunt with you, you need a coach now. If you go as long as you can without a coach (and given your goal) you are wasting your own time.

I gotta say I agree with Geek, tburk and others. You MUST have a coach.

Does anyone know of people swimming at the trials levels who aren't well coached and taking advantage of every possible training edge?

What's the old saying? A doctor who is his own patient is a fool ... Go for it, but don't go solo.

aquageek
January 30th, 2007, 01:47 PM
The only reason I would rather do it alone is because I know what I need to do. Swimming with a group of people is great for working out harder but I feel like the workouts are more generalized instead of tailored to my needs.

I really believe a coach with experience might be better suited to help you get to your goals as opposed to doing it yourself. Being only 20, you will find a seasoned coach is going to have training options and you haven't even considered. Trying to do it totally on your own is a recipe for failure.

I think Fortress' last comment was meant for Gull, in my opinion.

swimr4life
January 30th, 2007, 02:09 PM
Heres the scoop. I've been swimming for about 3 years now. My best times (scy) are as follows:
500 free 5:13.something
200 free 157.something else
100 free 52.8
50 free 24.38
100 fly 59.7
I swim between 20,000 and 30,000 yards/week now. I'm 20 years old, (male). My question is, do you think that with the right training and work ethic I could make a cut for the Olympic Trials in 2012? I would expect to train between 2 and 3 hours/day. I know it may sound a little crazy given my times now but I believe that with 6 years to do it, I can. My goal would be to qualify for the 100,200, or 500 free.

I think you have got to get a coach who will customize your workouts to help you reach your goals! A good coach will have experience on how to train you to improve faster. You may need to decide on one to two events to specialize in. Training for the 100 free differs tremendously on how you would train for the 500! In my opinion you need to really concentrate your efforts on either sprinting or distance training to get the maximum results. Good luck!

swimr4life
January 30th, 2007, 02:17 PM
It is possible but it takes great coaching and a lot of personal desire and talent.

By way of example, 5 year ago my son (age 15) after swimming for 2 years was swimming the 500 in 5:20, the 200 in 1:58 and the 100 in 56. Today (age 20) he is 4:29, 1:37 and 45 (hoping to be 4:25, 1:35 and 44 next month with a shave and taper). He is close to trial cuts in the each of these and plans to get the cuts this summer. So 6 years to go from 5:20 or 5:13 to a trial cut is not impossible.

Work with your coach, share your goals, and as Tracy said enjoy the journey.

Rob,
That is incredible! I've enjoyed watching his times. Your son must work extremely hard to improve that much in that small an amount of time. Good luck to him and his goal of reaching Olympic Trials. I think he'll do it!

tjburk
January 30th, 2007, 03:13 PM
I believe his son swims for Georgia Tech......Rob?

Rob Copeland
January 30th, 2007, 03:48 PM
Rob, congrats on your sons incredible times. Where does he swim for?

Yes, Noah swims for Georgia Tech. They just wrapped up the dual season and are getting set for ACC's Feb 21-24 at Chapel Hill, N.C. I'm not sure how far UNCW is from Chapel Hill, but it may be worth the trip to see some fast swims.

Beth, thanks for your kind comments. I am very proud of his accomplishments in the pool, in the classroom and in life.

Muppet
January 30th, 2007, 04:03 PM
Yes, Noah swims for Georgia Tech. They just wrapped up the dual season and are getting set for ACC's Feb 21-24 at Chapel Hill, N.C. I'm not sure how far UNCW is from Chapel Hill, but it may be worth the trip to see some fast swims.

Beth, thanks for your kind comments. I am very proud of his accomplishments in the pool, in the classroom and in life.

Yup, the young Copeland is quite an impressive swimmer. I had the chance to watch his 4:29 last year and meet his proud father last year when ACCs were at UMD.

swim4me
January 30th, 2007, 06:35 PM
Heres the scoop. I've been swimming for about 3 years now. My best times (scy) are as follows:
500 free 5:13.something
200 free 157.something else
100 free 52.8
50 free 24.38
100 fly 59.7
I swim between 20,000 and 30,000 yards/week now. I'm 20 years old, (male). My question is, do you think that with the right training and work ethic I could make a cut for the Olympic Trials in 2012? I would expect to train between 2 and 3 hours/day. I know it may sound a little crazy given my times now but I believe that with 6 years to do it, I can. My goal would be to qualify for the 100,200, or 500 free.

Take the advice of the many coaches and others on this thread as far as getting a coach and training. Then GO FOR IT!!!! If you don't, you will always wonder if you could have done it.:agree: :agree:

rtodd
January 30th, 2007, 09:58 PM
I'm talking out my a#$ right now but these are my thoughts. Please, anyone feel free to contradict me.

I would say absolutely persue it, because I don't know you and maybe you dont know you either. You may be great.

Obviously you will need a coach. A real good one. The sooner the better. Your progression will be closely monitored and recorded. You must get the right workouts, technical feedback and know your time progression.

Because you are young and life has not distracted you yet, and if you are serious, I would make a determined effort to get your times down as close to a qualifying standard ASAP. I would say that this hard push would expose your ability to contend at the elite level. With good records of your workouts, time trials etc. Elite coaches should be able to give you the good or bad news. Hopefully you can work under them and be swimming with fast swimmers.

Don't "wonder" for the next 5 years and put your life on standby only to find out you can't do it 5 years from now. Try and have a good idea in 2-3 years from now. Once you know you have the ability, you can relax a bit because you will now have the self confidence and work towards peaking for 2012.

You will need to be able to train without injury, or at least be able to deal with injuries (likely) correctly. This involves a good team of sports physicians intimate with swimming.

Think long and hard about what the sacrifices will be. I don't think working a regular job would really make sense. Certainly not as you get closer to trials. No "job" would be better.

Who is your support group? Will they put up with the training? You will be cranky.

Just some thoughts.

knelson
January 30th, 2007, 11:48 PM
Yup, the young Copeland is quite an impressive swimmer.

The old man ain't too shabby, either! ;)

Peter Cruise
January 31st, 2007, 12:09 AM
Okay, here's the scoop: set your goals higher. I agree with all the common sense that you've rec'd so far, but I say, dream even bigger. You are 20? The world is your oyster, make of your swimming career a pearl. Trial cuts? Ultimate goal is that gold medal; all the intermediate stages no less valid, satisfying to achieve- but to fuel the long hours and deprivations that surely must be endured, why not go for the gusto? Give it everything you've got and you won't be asking, years later, "Could I have?".

Speedo Racer
January 31st, 2007, 01:36 AM
The only reason I would rather do it alone is because I know what I need to do. Swimming with a group of people is great for working out harder but I feel like the workouts are more generalized instead of tailored to my needs. Again, I really appreciate all of the encouraging replies. Even the not so encouraging ones because that makes me want to do it even more. Rob, congrats on your sons incredible times. Where does he swim for?

OK, I was being nice last time, but this comment tells me you need a little slap in the face of reality. You will not be successful alone. Period. Even if you pack up today, move to Berkeley and pay Mike Bottom to coach you, the odds are pretty slim you will make US Olympic trials in swimming, arguably the most competitive event there is in this country. The times you posted are decent, but you have a long long loooong way to go and I can guarantee you that you do not know what you need if you think you will be successful without a coach.

jsmwbnc
January 31st, 2007, 08:57 AM
OK, I was being nice last time, but this comment tells me you need a little slap in the face of reality. You will not be successful alone. Period. Even if you pack up today, move to Berkeley and pay Mike Bottom to coach you, the odds are pretty slim you will make US Olympic trials in swimming, arguably the most competitive event there is in this country. The times you posted are decent, but you have a long long loooong way to go and I can guarantee you that you do not know what you need if you think you will be successful without a coach.

Why would you take the time and and "be nice" like you said you were doing when you really didn't think I had a chance at it. I don't want to hear, "yeah you can do it", when you really don't think I can. I would rather hear how little of a chance I have and how hard it's going to be. That will make it much more rewardable if I do make it, rather than being told I can do it and then end up not being able to. You don't have to try to "be nice" I'm a big boy now and I won't get my feelings hurt on an internet forum.

Warren
January 31st, 2007, 09:42 AM
heres what I think you should do, train moderatly not hard for about two years and try to learn every thing about swimming that you can. If your times steadily improve and you see a posible opportunity to make an olympic trail time start training your ass off.

Its definatly a posibility right now but in two years you will know for sure if you have a ligitament shot at making an olympic trail cut.

swimr4life
January 31st, 2007, 10:30 AM
Why would you take the time and and "be nice" like you said you were doing when you really didn't think I had a chance at it. I don't want to hear, "yeah you can do it", when you really don't think I can. I would rather hear how little of a chance I have and how hard it's going to be. That will make it much more rewardable if I do make it, rather than being told I can do it and then end up not being able to. You don't have to try to "be nice" I'm a big boy now and I won't get my feelings hurt on an internet forum.

jsmwbnc,
Speedo racer was trying to help you and is right. You will not make it without a coach. Its the truth! You need the feedback on technique, planned workouts/seasons, encouragement and guidance that only a coach can provide. If you are not willing to be coached....frankly I agree...you will not make it.

Jeff Commings
January 31st, 2007, 10:40 AM
There are hundreds of people out there who have already made the goal of going to the 2012 Olympic Trials. Some of them might swim the same times as you, are the same age as you and believe in their quest as much as you do.

If I were your coach I would tell you to forget the quest for 2012. The coach would have to be a miracle worker in the truest sense to get you to drop even three seconds in your 100 free. But, many coaches might want to take it on, but you don't know unless you ask.

If I were your coach, I would tell you to train for a meet this summer, then readjust goals. You can't think four years ahead because goals like this require intermediate ones.

If you make it, I will personally come to the meet and be your loudest and most excited cheerleader. Because that would be a fantastic story, better than Dara Torres or Pablo Morales.

lefty
January 31st, 2007, 10:51 AM
IIf this is something that you really want to accomplish, I am all for it. But I don't think you will be successful unless you are certain that, when you accomplish the goal, you will be comfortable knowing that the only one you proved anything to was yourself (and maybe a few anonymous people on a meaningless forum). I am friends with 3 swimmers who had trial cuts, and I wouldn't define any of them by that accomplishment. Hopefully you understand what I am getting at.

jsmwbnc
January 31st, 2007, 11:28 AM
I met a coach this weekend at a meet in Charlotte who said he would be interested in coaching me because he thought I had some talent that needed to be put to use. The only problem is that he lives 2 hrs. away. I am going to take this on in a more structured manner than I had orignally planned. I will set small goals along the way. Even if I never make it to trials I'm sure I will get faster and maybe even win some big masters meets. When I have an oppurtunity I want to pursue it as far as possible. Like many of you said I don't wanna ever have to wonder if I could have made it. I have also been thinking about the great deal of time and discipline this will take, and how it will be hard to have a noraml life and normal job. This weekend I am going to discuss with that coach about it and see what we come up with. The bottom line is, I want to get as fast as I can ever possibly go and I want to know when it's over that there is nothing I could have done to get even one hundreth of a second faster (under the circumstances of having to have a normal job and life lol). I'm not doing this to prove anything to anyone except for myself.

gull
January 31st, 2007, 12:02 PM
If this is your goal, find a good program, move there, and train with them. That's the only way. Period.

scyfreestyler
January 31st, 2007, 12:03 PM
There are hundreds of people out there who have already made the goal of going to the 2012 Olympic Trials. Some of them might swim the same times as you, are the same age as you and believe in their quest as much as you do.

If I were your coach I would tell you to forget the quest for 2012. The coach would have to be a miracle worker in the truest sense to get you to drop even three seconds in your 100 free. But, many coaches might want to take it on, but you don't know unless you ask.

If I were your coach, I would tell you to train for a meet this summer, then readjust goals. You can't think four years ahead because goals like this require intermediate ones.

If you make it, I will personally come to the meet and be your loudest and most excited cheerleader. Because that would be a fantastic story, better than Dara Torres or Pablo Morales.

Awesome post Jeff.

scyfreestyler
January 31st, 2007, 12:05 PM
If this is your goal, find a good program, move there, and train with them. That's the only way. Period.


Hmm? I know of a certain USMS member moving to Austin this summer...could he have bigger plans that he is not sharing?

gull
January 31st, 2007, 12:09 PM
Hmm? I know of a certain USMS member moving to Austin this summer...could he have bigger plans that he is not sharing?


Funny. Actually I have a great coach and a great training partner. Which is why my times have improved.

swimmieAvsFan
January 31st, 2007, 12:16 PM
If this is your goal, find a good program, move there, and train with them. That's the only way. Period.

i'll second gull's suggestion. i basically did the same thing last year ('06) for Masters Worlds- i felt i needed more consistent LCM training and a coach who actually knew something about backstroke. (and, it helps my old lease was up and i hated the job i was in, but i'll be telling any future employers that i moved for an upgrade in training if they ask about the 2 month gap in my resume. :laugh2: )

but seriously, if this is something you're committed to, then you will have to make some sacrifices, like moving to train with a specific team/coach. trust me when i say that it may seem like a royal pain now, but if you achieve your goal, in the long run it will be worth it. i know it was for me- i finished top 5 for both my 100 and 200 back at worlds...

scyfreestyler
January 31st, 2007, 12:18 PM
i'll second gull's suggestion. i basically did the same thing last year ('06) for Masters Worlds- i felt i needed more consistent LCM training and a coach who actually knew something about backstroke. (and, it helps my old lease was up and i hated the job i was in, but i'll be telling any future employers that i moved for an upgrade in training if they ask about the 2 month gap in my resume. :laugh2: )

but seriously, if this is something you're committed to, then you will have to make some sacrifices, like moving to train with a specific team/coach. trust me when i say that it may seem like a royal pain now, but if you achieve your goal, in the long run it will be worth it. i know it was for me- i finished top 5 for both my 100 and 200 back at worlds...

Now that is dedication, moving to train for a USMS meet. :bow:

swimmieAvsFan
January 31st, 2007, 12:24 PM
Now that is dedication, moving to train for a USMS meet. :bow:

hehehe. actually, i was planning on moving no matter what, since my lease was up and i wanted out of PA. but the timing of the move was due to worlds. which, IMHO, isn't just "a USMS meet", but a chance to represent the USA... :woot:
and i wanted to do that to the best of my ability, so i moved before worlds, rather then extending my lease till after...

SwimStud
January 31st, 2007, 12:25 PM
Now that is dedication, moving to train for a USMS meet. :bow:

What? and waking up at 6am on a sunday and driving 35 minutes to the meet isn't?
I had to forgo all usual Saturday evening activities!! Movie, Beer, SNL, etc...you shouldn't disparage...

LOL


I don't think he ever said he didn't want a coach. Just that he didn't want a "group" coach.

knelson
January 31st, 2007, 12:53 PM
Finding a good coach and team ASAP is good advice. I think your first order of business if to become as technically proficient in the water as possible. Without this you have no chance of reaching your goal. Really focus on this over the next year and see where you are. Then, maybe the really serious training can begin. I doubt there are many OT qualifiers who are in the water less than 15 hours per week.

Warren
January 31st, 2007, 01:06 PM
jsmwbnc has a better chance of making trials than someone the same age who has trained their entire life and goes a 46 in the 100 free. The difference is the person who has trained their whole life has little to no potential to get better. Jsm is fresh and has alot of potenial but undetermined just how mush he has, so go for it. I like your attitude to see how fast you can posibly go.

"aim to be the greatest, if you come up short you will still only be great"
-I forgot who said this

Muppet
January 31st, 2007, 01:28 PM
i'll second gull's suggestion. i basically did the same thing last year ('06) for Masters Worlds- i felt i needed more consistent LCM training and a coach who actually knew something about backstroke. (and, it helps my old lease was up and i hated the job i was in, but i'll be telling any future employers that i moved for an upgrade in training if they ask about the 2 month gap in my resume. :laugh2: )

but seriously, if this is something you're committed to, then you will have to make some sacrifices, like moving to train with a specific team/coach. trust me when i say that it may seem like a royal pain now, but if you achieve your goal, in the long run it will be worth it. i know it was for me- i finished top 5 for both my 100 and 200 back at worlds...

PatrickRoy's#1Fan is leaving out another reason why she moved... and is also very humble in forgetting to mention that one of those top 5s was a Bronze Medal. :applaud:
And when she gets a full summer of LCM, watch out people!!!

The Fortress
January 31st, 2007, 02:55 PM
PatrickRoy's#1Fan is leaving out another reason why she moved... and is also very humble in forgetting to mention that one of those top 5s was a Bronze Medal. :applaud:
And when she gets a full summer of LCM, watch out people!!!

I think she also forgot the freestyle medal(s)? So did you. :applaud:

I think she should quit her chemist job and go for the trials!

Muppet: Did you just post with no :dedhorse: :banana: ?

blainesapprentice
January 31st, 2007, 02:56 PM
while I understand that you think that you train just fine on your own...and sometimes, when my team and coach is really getting on my nerves I feel the same way, its not ideal

But...the bottomline is...when I was in 11th grade I was hating my USS coach and teammates, and as a result I was the #1 slacker you have ever met. I made some sacrafices, and shelled out $680 for the season and transferred teams. I had to drive 45minutes each way 6 days a week...but I got to swim with some fantastic swimmers, and I was no longer the fastest on the team...I think training with these swimmers who have outshown my in the pool time and time again, is what has led to my successes and my time drops over the past few years. That in practice competition with your teammates is great for your training.

I understand working with a coach might not be at the top of your list, but what if you found a coach you could meet with on maybe a bi-weekly basis-Maybe like Friday and Tuesday, and they can really be more of a stroke analyzer...they can also give you workouts for the entire week...so that you are getting there input, but also not having to work with one on a day to day basis for now.

I agree with the comment that was made, that you should take the next year or so to really learn about swimming and proper technique and see what you are doing right, wrong, or somewhere inbetween. It's only going to help you in the long run and prevent injury with any luck. If you chose to do this, it would work great if you saw a coach 1 or 2x a week!

jsmwbnc
January 31st, 2007, 03:39 PM
There are so many fantastic ideas here. Again, I really appreciate all of the feedback. If I moved to Charlotte I may be able to train under a great coach, Dave Marsh. The only thing that is really keeping me in Wilmington is Surfing and Ocean Rescue in the summer. I'm go to school at a community college so switching schools wouldn't be a problem. So far this winter the surf hasn't been great and the beach lifeguarding is only in the summer and early fall so I may consider it. However, I would still come back to Wilmington for lifeguarding in the summers. During the summer I would be able to train with UNCW since it would be their offseason. If I were to decide to train in Charlotte I would probably just move back with my parents, they live in Salisbury, N.C. It is about a 45 minute drive to the pool I would train at so it would be pointless to try and live in Charlotte when it's that close. If I did end up moving it wouldn't be until fall 2007 because I have to finish out this semester at school and then summer is right after that. I'm not going to jump to any decisions because I haven't thought long and hard enough about it yet.

aquageek
January 31st, 2007, 04:09 PM
Marsh is running the Olympic COE at the MAC and will be based mostly out of the N. Charlotte pool. The MAC, where my kid swims, has not published anything about his training times/teams/etc nor what qualifies a swimmer for his training.

jsmwbnc
January 31st, 2007, 04:17 PM
may be able

knelson
January 31st, 2007, 04:20 PM
that's why there is a might before the would.

"Might would?" Is this some kind of North Carolina speak the rest of us don't understand? Geek, please confirm! :)

jsmwbnc
January 31st, 2007, 04:23 PM
"Might would?" Is this some kind of North Carolina speak the rest of us don't understand? Geek, please confirm! :)

haha i guess it is, i will change it for the sake of the english language

aquageek
January 31st, 2007, 04:29 PM
"Might would?" Is this some kind of North Carolina speak the rest of us don't understand? Geek, please confirm! :)

Might would = possibly consider but requiring more than just a snap decision

For instance, "I might would race gull again if hot coffee were still the bet."

gull
January 31st, 2007, 04:32 PM
"I reckon I might could eat some of them fried taters, hmmm."

knelson
January 31st, 2007, 04:48 PM
Might would = possibly consider but requiring more than just a snap decision

So the "would" is more or less superfluous.

gull
January 31st, 2007, 04:51 PM
So the "would" is more or less superfluous.

You're not from around these parts, are you?

Redbird Alum
January 31st, 2007, 05:08 PM
If I moved to Charlotte I may be able to train under a great coach, Dave Marsh. The only thing that is really keeping me in Wilmington is Surfing and Ocean Rescue in the summer. ... I'm not going to jump to any decisions because I haven't thought long and hard enough about it yet.

I have daughters your age and I'll share the same advice I give them...

If you really want this, now is the time to do it, because later you will kick yourself for not having tried. BUT, understand that you will have to sacrifice other things you may want that stand in the way or, or draw your attention from your goal.

That said, with the time you have, you need to decide if things like surfing and lifeguarding now are more important than trying to make yourself as fast as possible for the OT's. Consistancy, in focus, effort, coaching, and lifestyle will get you there. Any wishy-washiness will make it near impossible.

All the best, I would love to say, "we were on the same forum once" after you get to go to the big dance!

knelson
January 31st, 2007, 05:21 PM
That said, with the time you have, you need to decide if things like surfing and lifeguarding now are more important than trying to make yourself as fast as possible for the OT's. Consistancy, in focus, effort, coaching, and lifestyle will get you there. Any wishy-washiness will make it near impossible.

Good point. This reminds me of something on the DVD "Unfiltered" about Michael Phelps and Ian Crocker. I believe it was Michael's coach Bob Bowman who mentioned that when it was clear Michael could be a world class swimmer he started working out seven days a week. He literally never took a day off: Christmas, vacations, whatever. And you can bet he was doing doubles on most of those days. Their theory was just about every other swimmer "only" swims six days a week so that was just 52 more days a year where Michael was doing something to get ahead. Now, that's commitment!

Warren
January 31st, 2007, 05:25 PM
also most of the LCM meets are in the summer

scyfreestyler
January 31st, 2007, 05:29 PM
Good point. This reminds me of something on the DVD "Unfiltered" about Michael Phelps and Ian Crocker. I believe it was Michael's coach Bob Bowman who mentioned that when it was clear Michael could be a world class swimmer he started working out seven days a week. He literally never took a day off: Christmas, vacations, whatever. And you can bet he was doing doubles on most of those days. Their theory was just about every other swimmer "only" swims six days a week so that was just 52 more days a year where Michael was doing something to get ahead. Now, that's commitment!

Not that most of the notable swim coaches are not very serious about what they do, but Bowman seems to have a passion about this like none other. Watching Kaitlin, Erik, and Michael (let alone Vanderkaay's, Keller, Tarwater, etc.) it is plain to see that his methods are worthy of note.

swimr4life
January 31st, 2007, 05:39 PM
Not that most of the notable swim coaches are not very serious about what they do, but Bowman seems to have a passion about this like none other. Watching Kaitlin, Erik, and Michael (let alone Vanderkaay's, Keller, Tarwater, etc.) it is plain to see that his methods are worthy of note.

Amen to that. Not only do the swimmers have to be dedicated, the coaches do too! They sacrifice a lot of time and energy.....they miss those holidays and time off too.:bow:

poolraat
January 31st, 2007, 06:04 PM
I think it's fantastic that you have such goals. If you are committed and have the desire, you can do it. But you also need a good coach and to be swimming with other top caliber swimmers. I’ll give you an example. One of the boys who was on our club team has similar goals as yours. Three years ago during, his senior year in high school, he decided that he wanted to swim in college and make the Trials cuts in 2008. With the help of his coach, he managed to talk his way onto a university program as a walk on. He has been very successful and will most likely make those cuts this summer. Here is an example of the improvement in his times:

2004 2006
100 free 49.94(scy) 45.23(scy)
200 free 1:51.91(scy) 1:37.51(scy)
200 IM 2:05.75(scy) 1:48.61(scy)

I don’t think this kind of improvement would have happened without the coaching and the program he’s swimming with. Something for you to consider if you’re serious. I wish you the best in your endeavor.

Rob Copeland
February 1st, 2007, 10:57 AM
And a couple more thoughts…

There will be around 350 men who qualify for the 2008 US Olympic trials. Most, if not all, are training with good to great coaches 20-30 hours per week. And, there are thousands more who are training just as hard without making the cuts. You need to be willing to commit to 8 to 10 or more workouts per week to have any real chance to qualify.

And to look at it another way, there are more men playing Major League Baseball then there will be qualifiers for the 2008 US swimming trials. So think about all the high school, college and minor league players that you would need to surpass, if your goal had been to play in the bigs in 6 years. Possible, yes, but it will require a tremendous effort and determination and hard work on your part. You have a very similar path with your swimming goal. Today there are over 2,000 swimmers with faster 100 times who will need to surpassed.

And the 2012 time standards and competition will most assuredly be tougher then 2008.