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View Full Version : Burger King sued over Trans Fats



SwimStud
May 16th, 2007, 02:20 PM
http://money.cnn.com/2007/05/16/news/companies/burgerking_fats.reut/index.htm?postversion=2007051613

scyfreestyler
May 16th, 2007, 02:33 PM
How absurd. This nutrition advocacy group could do the citizens of the US much more benefit by educating them as opposed to suing a fast food chain (A lawsuit that is likely to fail IMHO). I have also heard on a few occassions that the oils that are replacing the trans fats are not really any healthier for us...Dr. Dean has commented about this for sure.

I hope the judge tells the advocacy group counsel to get the hell out of his/her courtroom. I would.

swimr4life
May 16th, 2007, 02:39 PM
How absurd. This nutrition advocacy group could do the citizens of the US much more benefit by educating them as opposed to suing a fast food chain (A lawsuit that is likely to fail IMHO). I have also heard on a few occassions that the oils that are replacing the trans fats are not really any healthier for us...Dr. Dean has commented about this for sure.

I hope the judge tells the advocacy group counsel to get the hell out of his/her courtroom. I would.

Yep....they need to start countersuing for frivolous lawsuits. IMHO I believe the person filing a silly lawsuit that is thrown out of court should have to pay the legal fees of the person they are suing!!

scyfreestyler
May 16th, 2007, 02:45 PM
Yep....they need to start countersuing for frivolous lawsuits. IMHO I believe the person filing a silly lawsuit that is thrown out of court should have to pay the legal fees of the person they are suing!!

I'm all for that. If they can't pay the fine then they can do some jail time. Spend a few months in the county jail just for good measure.

aquageek
May 16th, 2007, 02:45 PM
The best part was this quote - "Consumers have no way to guard against the risk of consumer trans fats."

Um, they could always choose to eat at healthy restaurants or choose to eat healthy foods.

SwimStud
May 16th, 2007, 02:49 PM
The best part was this quote - "Consumers have no way to guard against the risk of consumer trans fats."

Um, they could always choose to eat at healthy restaurants or choose to eat healthy foods.

and accept responsibility for one's actions? Please...we can't have have that...it runs against the very fabric of today's society...

tjburk
May 16th, 2007, 02:54 PM
Now, I must explain my rule about "Common Sense"......

There is no such thing as "Common Sense"!!!!! As the name "Common" implies, it means.....well......common.....thus everybody should have it!!!!:lmao: And we all know what the truth of that is!!!!!!

So, in closing, it should heretofore be referred to as "Uncommon Sense"

Questions? Comments? Snide Remarks?:duel: :thhbbb: :doh:

SwimStud
May 16th, 2007, 02:57 PM
Snide Remarks?:duel: :thhbbb: :doh:

Tracy, go eat a whopper!


LOL :banana: :lmao:

tjburk
May 16th, 2007, 03:13 PM
Pardon Moi Sir.....I prefer a Double Double with Cheese Please!!!!:duel:

scyfreestyler
May 16th, 2007, 03:23 PM
Pardon Moi Sir.....I prefer a Double Double with Cheese Please!!!!:duel:
Animal style.

SwimStud
May 16th, 2007, 03:36 PM
Pardon Moi Sir.....I prefer a Double Double with Cheese Please!!!!:duel:

Washed down with a diet coke presumably?

tjburk
May 16th, 2007, 03:48 PM
Sacrilege....nothing but the most sugar for me! Give me a regular Coke! French Fries smothered in Ketchup....and a Large Chocolate Malt to finish it off!!!!!

And I wonder why I can't keep my weight down!!!! Must need to sue somebody becasue I can't push my fat $%& away from the table!

geochuck
May 16th, 2007, 04:00 PM
Just wondering if I make my own hamburgs from ground beef will they have transfats.

I like french fries. I try to limit amount.

Forget the cheese and ketchup.

Just lettuce, tomatoes, onions, mustard and a slice of dill pickle.

A meal made in heaven.

scyfreestyler
May 16th, 2007, 04:02 PM
Just a...cheeseburger in paradise.

tjburk
May 16th, 2007, 04:05 PM
"I like mine with lettuce and tomata,
Heinz 57 and french freid potatas"

Karen Duggan
May 16th, 2007, 04:25 PM
Is there an In N Out in Georgia?!?

art_z
May 16th, 2007, 04:26 PM
Just wondering if I make my own hamburgs from ground beef will they have transfats.
.

Trans fats are made when oil is partially hydrogenated to make it more stable with heat and last longer. I think the majority of transfats come from french fries, maybe mayo. Beef by itself if just grilled should not have any transfats. It will have plenty of other fat, included saturated fat, but not trans fats.

tjburk
May 16th, 2007, 04:27 PM
Ooooooohhhhhhhh Karen....don't I wish!!!!!!! I have to save that luxury for when I go visit my home state of California!!!!! They do have them in Arizona and Nevada now too.

tjburk
May 16th, 2007, 04:28 PM
Trans fats are made when oil is partially hydrogenated to make it more stable with heat and last longer. I think the majority of transfats come from french fries, maybe mayo. Beef by itself if just grilled should not have any transfats. It will have plenty of other fat, included saturated fat, but not trans fats.

Beef aka steak also has a lot of cholesterol!!!:sad: :sad: :sad:

fanstone
May 16th, 2007, 04:32 PM
But Tracy, you have Cracker Barrel! Methinks Karen never ate at one...billy fanstone

geochuck
May 16th, 2007, 04:42 PM
Just went to the doc today to get a report on my blood, kidneys etc. all is well, no problems. I think we can eat anything we want as long as we do not over do any.

We need fats yes even saturated fats. Sometimes our problems are hereditary. Never had a cholesterol problem and I eat about a dozen eggs a week, and lots of beef. I also love butter (never margerine). He said a very slight amount of protein, nothing to worry about but it did not show up in the urine tests.

When ever I travel my breakfast is at MacDonalds a sausage biscuit, some times with egg. Never have that slimmy cheese.

lefty
May 16th, 2007, 05:37 PM
Burger King knowingly is offering a product that has devastating health consequences because it is cheaper. The fact that you don't have to eat there is irrelevant. It is right as a society to expect that the products we buy are reasonably safe.

Keep this in mind: it is not the hamburger to which they are objecting. It is the usage of an unsafe frying oil when a *safer* alternative is readily available.

scyfreestyler
May 16th, 2007, 05:49 PM
Burger King knowingly is offering a product that has devastating health consequences because it is cheaper. The fact that you don't have to eat there is irrelevant. It is right as a society to expect that the products we buy are reasonably safe.

Keep this in mind: it is not the hamburger to which they are objecting. It is the usage of an unsafe frying oil when a *safer* alternative is readily available.

The fact still remains, they are being sued for something that is not illegal. And to be fair, the products they sell are reasonably safe...if you are reasonable about their consumption.


As for George and his checkup, that is great news. However, I don't think that moderation is all there is to the puzzle. Some people are more prone to high LDL/low HDL than others. There is no single method to being healthy that will work for everybody.

lefty
May 16th, 2007, 06:04 PM
The fact still remains, they are being sued for something that is not illegal. And to be fair, the products they sell are reasonably safe...if you are reasonable about their consumption.


It is irrelevant if they are legal/illegal. This is a civil suit, not a criminal. The product is being made in a less safe manner because it is cheaper. There is a long precedence for this: if you cut corners on cost to the detriment of the consumer, expect to be sued, especially if it is the detriment of health.

geochuck
May 16th, 2007, 06:08 PM
scyfreestyler

True everyone is not the same, I can eat almost anything and it makes no difference. I limit my intake of fries to 12 generally but on occassion many more especially when I have Halibut and fries. We fry in canola oil.

My longtime sugar was 6.1 which is well controlled.

If we want Burger King to change boycott.

It is like gas prices are too high we are starting boycotts here in Vancouver. The first one is don't buy your gas from Shell for a week.

aquageek
May 16th, 2007, 06:15 PM
It is irrelevant if they are legal/illegal.

Apparently, it is also irrelevant that we are free to make our own dining choices and know that fast food, for the most part, isn't the smartest health decision.

We've been down this path before. There is one camp that thinks we should allow the gov't to legislate what we eat and another camp that thinks we can make our own decisions.

CreamPuff
May 16th, 2007, 06:33 PM
:dedhorse: :dedhorse: :dedhorse:

I really wish the government would get more involved in my life.
I really trust them in terms of their financial, medical, and nutritional wisdom.:bow:
Heck, their track record speaks for itself!

Perhaps they can tell me what to eat and what not to eat and when and where.
Who knew Burger King had fatty foods?! :cry:

I hope my body type goes from what it is now to say, what Bill and Hillary Clinton's body type is!! Shoot, I need to take their lead and go to McDonalds for the first time in years. What does Bill order - the Big Mac and Fries along with his triple bypass?!
Government. . . excellent role models that they are!!

art_z
May 16th, 2007, 09:53 PM
real men eat at White Castle ... :joker:

swimr4life
May 17th, 2007, 01:14 AM
MMMM! Cracker Barrel is yummy!

On the meat subject....I have to share a bumper sticker my husband saw the other day. It said, "If God didn't want us to eat animals, why did he make them out of meat?" :joker: :lolup: :rofl: :rofl:

swimr4life
May 17th, 2007, 01:18 AM
:dedhorse: :dedhorse: :dedhorse:

I really wish the government would get more involved in my life.
I really trust them in terms of their financial, medical, and nutritional wisdom.:bow:
Heck, their track record speaks for itself!

Perhaps they can tell me what to eat and what not to eat and when and where.
Who knew Burger King had fatty foods?! :cry:

I hope my body type goes from what it is now to say, what Bill and Hillary Clinton's body type is!! Shoot, I need to take their lead and go to McDonalds for the first time in years. What does Bill order - the Big Mac and Fries along with his triple bypass?!
Government. . . excellent role models that they are!!

Oh the irony!:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

dorothyrde
May 17th, 2007, 07:34 AM
The fact still remains, they are being sued for something that is not illegal. And to be fair, the products they sell are reasonably safe...if you are reasonable about their consumption.




Actually, I thought even small amounts of trans-fats are dangerous. Of course different people have different problems with it. I still think a law suit is not the answer. Other fast food places are advertising that they have gotten rid of trans fats, so one would hope that would prompt all to jump on the band wagon. Personally I don't even know what is on their menu because I never go there, bleh.

SwimStud
May 17th, 2007, 08:48 AM
...when I have Halibut and fries.....


George I insist you call it fish n chips or I'll be forced to wrtie to HRH to protest.

aquageek
May 17th, 2007, 08:50 AM
So, anyway, Cracker Barrel is the worst restaurant ever built, conceived or created. I avoid it like the plague. Have you ever noticed the rocking chairs outside are double wides to accomodate the patrons? The food couldn't be any greasier or nastier. If we are going to start suing restaurants, we should start with that place.

tjburk
May 17th, 2007, 08:55 AM
Geek, you must not be a TRUE Southerner!!!!!!:thhbbb: A TRUE Southerner would never Bash the Mecca of the south.......I suppose you don't like Waffle House either:shakeshead:

Are you a Northerner in disguise????????:duel:

SwimStud
May 17th, 2007, 08:55 AM
Everything in moderation...








...Except swimming!

aquageek
May 17th, 2007, 09:12 AM
Geek, you must not be a TRUE Southerner!!!!!!:thhbbb: A TRUE Southerner would never Bash the Mecca of the south.......I suppose you don't like Waffle House either:shakeshead:

Are you a Northerner in disguise????????:duel:

Waffle House is the yellow beacon of greatness, especially after midnight. I just can't stand the CB.

aquaFeisty
May 17th, 2007, 09:14 AM
So, anyway, Cracker Barrel is the worst restaurant ever built, conceived or created. I avoid it like the plague. Have you ever noticed the rocking chairs outside are double wides to accomodate the patrons? The food couldn't be any greasier or nastier. If we are going to start suing restaurants, we should start with that place.

Haha! Oh, yeah, Cracker Barrel is pretty bad! The last time I was in one was maybe 3 or 4 years ago. Had lunch with vendors there (their choice of establishment). You know how lots of Cracker Barrels have a big fire place in the center to add to the homey feel? Well, on this one the draft totally wasn't working, so in addition to the greasy food and cigarette smoke, I smelled like a chimney for the rest of the day!

aquaFeisty
May 17th, 2007, 09:18 AM
Actually, I thought even small amounts of trans-fats are dangerous. Of course different people have different problems with it. I still think a law suit is not the answer. Other fast food places are advertising that they have gotten rid of trans fats, so one would hope that would prompt all to jump on the band wagon. Personally I don't even know what is on their menu because I never go there, bleh.

Dorothy, I've heard the same thing about trans fats. They are bad, period, even in moderation. Kind of like rat poison is bad, period, even in moderation. Read the labels on packaged foods... Anything less than 0.5 g trans fat per serving and the food companies can legally put 0g trans fats on the label. So what some manufacturers have done is adjust the serving size such that they can now say 0g trans fats. While I admire this creative use of math, I was ticked when I saw that it had been applied to my daughter's graham crackers!

(which, btw, are NOT consumed in moderation)

FindingMyInnerFish
May 17th, 2007, 09:18 AM
Well, I'm not against lawsuits per se or some reasonable gov't regulation of what goes into food, including pet food. (I just feel very fortunate that I hadn't been feeding my cat any of the foods on the recall list.)

But I'm not so sure that in this case a lawsuit would have as powerful an effect as simply a boycott. People need to get the facts, know what they're getting in the food being served at the fast food establishments. If the company is not forthcoming with this information, we then need to take our business elsewhere. A lawsuit will likely be a one-time settlement and done, whereas "voting with one's feet" will force the company to offer healthier ingredients if it wants to stay in business.

Just my $.02

Peter Cruise
May 17th, 2007, 09:34 AM
Kind of ironic that it may end up being harder to buy trans-fat food than a handgun...

tjburk
May 17th, 2007, 10:05 AM
Peter remember...there isn't a gun out there that intentionally killed some one without someone pulling the trigger!

The Fortress
May 17th, 2007, 10:08 AM
Kind of ironic that it may end up being harder to buy trans-fat food than a handgun...

Exactly. Let's regulate something deadly that could hurt people that are not voluntarily ingesting it.

I like the Waffle House, but it's too smokey. I would prefer not to breathe in second hand smoke as well.

scyfreestyler
May 17th, 2007, 11:28 AM
I just find it interesting that we can still sell cigarettes which cause over 400 thousand deaths every year but people raise hell about trans fats that are thought to cause about 30 thousand deaths every year. There is no shortage of information regarding trans fats and I can't think of a single person I know who feels that fast food is the least bit healthy. People make these decisions about thier health every day, some make the wise choice and others make the not so wise choice. This is America and we should be free to choose our own lifestyle. Just the same, in America a company should be free to sell its product without concern of lawsuits provided it is adhering to the regulations set forth by the government. The lawsuit in question borders on the stupidity of those who sue tobacco companies once they get empyhsema, oral cancer, lung cancer, etc. It was no secret that the cigarettes were bad for them and they have nobody to blame for their early demise other than themselves.

bud
May 17th, 2007, 01:14 PM
I just find it interesting...{snip}... they have nobody to blame for their early demise other than themselves.
Excellent point.




I really wish the government would get more involved in my life.
I really trust them in terms of their financial, medical, and nutritional wisdom.... {snip}
:lmao: ("Oh you're a riot Alice... You're a regular riot!!!")


- - -

As for "Burger King sued over Trans Fats"...
What can you do? The population of morons on the planet, particularly in the USA, seems to be growing exponentially every day. For another example see the following little nugget from the 14-May-07 Fortune magazine:
Parents are Failing the Education Test (http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2007/05/14/100009099/index.htm)
My initial reaction to parents complaining about their kids having to learn algebra was a brief moment of stunned disbelief, quickly followed by a loud outburst of laughter. I love the way Jay Leno says it (particularly when he is doing the news ads)...
“People are MORONS!”
Another favorite that I’m reminded of is:
“I’m mad as hell, and I’m not going to take this anymore.” - Network (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0074958/quotes)
(I had the opportunity to view this again recently. What a chilling concept.)

As always, education is the key. People will continue to do stupid things as long as they are, well, stupid. Of course: “You can lead a horse to water, but you can’t make him drink.” I feel my best line of defense is to lead by example. Too often I feel that I fall way short of the mark, but I do get some comfort from the knowledge that I try.

“I hope I grow up to become the person my dog thinks I am.”
- unknown

"If you can't be a good example, then you'll just have to serve as a horrible warning."
- Catherine Aird (http://en.thinkexist.com/quotes/catherine_aird/)

lefty
May 17th, 2007, 01:20 PM
I just find it interesting that we can still sell cigarettes which cause over 400 thousand deaths every year but people raise hell about trans fats that are thought to cause about 30 thousand deaths every year.

I think this will help you and other people who are trumpeting "personal responsibility" better understand this: cigarette companies were NOT sued because they were selling an unsafe product. They were sued because they manipulating nicotine levels knowing that it made the product more addictive. The fact that everybody knows that cigarettes are bad was not the point; cigarette companies were manipulating the product. Similarly Burger King is not being sued because they sell a product that is bad for you. I agree with anyone who says that is matter of personal responsibility. However, when a corporation decides to manipulate their product, and when this manipulation harms the public they have done something wrong. Mark my words, Burger King loses this case.

SwimStud
May 17th, 2007, 01:23 PM
Bud

We always need to remember that individuals are smart. People collectively are stupid...

We all do stupid things...it's whether we accept the consequences for the action...whether it's mildly amusing or catastrophic...thankfully most of mine have been mildly amusing...

aquageek
May 17th, 2007, 01:41 PM
However, when a corporation decides to manipulate their product, and when this manipulation harms the public they have done something wrong.

Honestly, I laughed out loud so maybe that was your point. Here are some other lawsuits I am considering filing on behalf of stupid people:

Car manufacturers for manipulating their product to allow it to go over 5 mph. If you go over 5 mph and hit something you could get hurt. That's dangerous.

Goggle manufacturers for producing a product that allows me to swim longer and get pruny skin, dried out skin. Nasty skin is dangerous and unattractive. I need to look my best when I meet Fort and she serves me drinks. Stud could blame his backstroke start on goggles, that was dangerous.

Coke for manipulating their product with too much sugar. Sugar makes me fat. Fat is bad and dangerous. I bet BK serves Coke also so they might be in for a double whammy, or a double whopper.

A similar and recent KFC lawsuit was laughed out of court. We can only hope that will happen here as well.

I'm here for the moron minority.

scyfreestyler
May 17th, 2007, 01:44 PM
I think this will help you and other people who are trumpeting "personal responsibility" better understand this: cigarette companies were NOT sued because they were selling an unsafe product. They were sued because they manipulating nicotine levels knowing that it made the product more addictive. The fact that everybody knows that cigarettes are bad was not the point; cigarette companies were manipulating the product. Similarly Burger King is not being sued because they sell a product that is bad for you. I agree with anyone who says that is matter of personal responsibility. However, when a corporation decides to manipulate their product, and when this manipulation harms the public they have done something wrong. Mark my words, Burger King loses this case.

They are not doing anything that the other fast food chains have not done for years and years. It is not as if they have increased the amount of TF's in their products since the issue has been raised in recent years. Actually, according to this( http://www.boston.com/business/articles/2007/01/31/burger_king_tests_oil_without_trans_fats/ ) article it seems that BK is on the road to change already.

I still stand by my opinion that healthy eating habits are not something that can be legislated. Nor should such an attempt be made in the first place. It would not surprise me if you are right and BK does lose, but that just shows how screwed up things have become in this country. What a sorry state of affairs.

scyfreestyler
May 17th, 2007, 01:48 PM
Honestly, I laughed out loud so maybe that was your point. Here are some other lawsuits I am considering filing on behalf of stupid people:

Car manufacturers for manipulating their product to allow it to go over 5 mph. If you go over 5 mph and hit something you could get hurt. That's dangerous.

Goggle manufacturers for producing a product that allows me to swim longer and get pruny skin, dried out skin. Nasty skin is dangerous and unattractive. I need to look my best when I meet Fort and she serves me drinks. Stud could blame his backstroke start on goggles, that was dangerous.

Coke for manipulating their product with too much sugar. Sugar makes me fat. Fat is bad and dangerous. I bet BK serves Coke also so they might be in for a double whammy, or a double whopper.

I'm here for the moron minority.

Amen.

To the best of my knowledge there is no speed limit above 75 in the state of California. Perhaps auto manufacturers should be sued for allowing vehicles to surpass that limit. My 330i was limited to 130 MPH and I had it there a few times on public roads. Shame on BMW for selling cars that have the ability to travel that fast.

aquaFeisty
May 17th, 2007, 02:09 PM
wasn't there a lawsuit that someone actually won against McDonald's that had to do with them filing suit for McD's causing obesity, particularly in kids? Something like there weren't sufficient healthy choices on the menu or something goofy like that? I can't quite recall.

I loved (S)he-man's gov't post!

I'm very anti-trans fat, but duhhhhh, I can read the labels and choose which foods I do and do not want to buy. Geez. And Matt's right... cigarette's are much worse for the population than trans fats (at least per the research so far) and they're still available.

bud
May 17th, 2007, 02:24 PM
Oh Boy! Here we go again!

I foresee another one that is going to be beat to death?

Judges scolding corporations that make consumer products that are strictly our choice to buy and ingest, and that are commonly known to be bad for us, makes about as much sense as motorcycle helmet laws. When it comes down to brass tacks it is all a simple textbook case of: “Stupid is as stupid does.”

I see the need for the laws and verdicts however. The most obvious point being that everyone else has to pick up the healthcare tab one way or another to bail out these individual morons who repeatedly step up to the cash resister and chose to purchase these potentially harmful (even lethal) products. Collectively they are a burden.

I reckon money really is the root of all evil.

“I AM depressed.” – Taggart (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0071230/quotes)

SwimStud
May 17th, 2007, 02:28 PM
Amen.

Fine Matt, have it your way!



BADUUMP! I'm here all week!
:groovy: :D :applaud:

scyfreestyler
May 17th, 2007, 02:43 PM
Fine Matt, have it your way!



BADUUMP! I'm here all week!
:groovy: :D :applaud:

Very funny! :laugh2:

geochuck
May 17th, 2007, 03:23 PM
I went to Costco today, while Chuckie was shopping I had my favorite transfat meal - Poutine, a massive serving of fries and cheese curds topped with gravy. Added some other favorites salt, pepper, viniger and ketchup.

lefty
May 17th, 2007, 04:01 PM
Honestly, I laughed out loud so maybe that was your point. Here are some other lawsuits I am considering filing on behalf of stupid people

Question: Is there a difference between offering a product that is bad for society (like a cigarette) and manipulating that product to make more money (By enhancing the nicotene level)?

Or if you want to frame this regarding auto safety you could answer this question: there is always a risk when you drive a car so thus if a car manufacturer uses a faulty seat-belt because it is cheaper to manufacture have they really changed the risks involved with driving a car?

I am interested in your answers...

SCY: you were joing about driving your Baby-Beemer 130?

The Fortress
May 17th, 2007, 04:16 PM
Goggle manufacturers for producing a product that allows me to swim longer and get pruny skin, dried out skin. Nasty skin is dangerous and unattractive. I need to look my best when I meet Fort and she serves me drinks.

Only after I manipulate the drink and get paid my $2 million.

aquageek
May 17th, 2007, 04:49 PM
Question: Is there a difference between offering a product that is bad for society (like a cigarette) and manipulating that product to make more money (By enhancing the nicotene level)?

All you have to do is tell me one single product out there that isn't manipulated to make it more appealing to the consumer. Just one. Capitalism kinda works that way.

Sue 'em all, I say. Leave no product behind.

If you can't afford a safe big car, are you going to sue GM because you can only afford their econo box after you get run over by my urban assault vehicle and get injured?

scyfreestyler
May 17th, 2007, 04:51 PM
I was not joking about the speeds I have driven at. Truthfully, it was really not that dangerous. The roads were very remote and in relatively good condition and I have attended some BMW driver schools/car control clinics.

Peter Cruise
May 17th, 2007, 05:10 PM
Matt- I used to say, when I was wearing blue, that I'm not as worried about the driver who goes 130 on remote road, good training etc., as when the minivan full of kids and distracted mom veer suddenly over the middle line (oncoming) 'cause junior just got roadsick all over Mom's lap & the fella at 130 just plain hasn't the time to react properly. He has 130 worth of velocity to contribute to the crash, likely deadly whether transferred to the minivan or to a rollover.

The Fortress
May 17th, 2007, 05:21 PM
Matt- I used to say, when I was wearing blue, that I'm not as worried about the driver who goes 130 on remote road, good training etc., as when the minivan full of kids and distracted mom veer suddenly over the middle line (oncoming) 'cause junior just got roadsick all over Mom's lap & the fella at 130 just plain hasn't the time to react properly. He has 130 worth of velocity to contribute to the crash, likely deadly whether transferred to the minivan or to a rollover.

Boy, no soccer mom is going to like you. (I do not drive a mini-van. I like urban assault vehicles.)

Why don't we ban eating TF-laden fast food while driving, ban smoking, ban talking on cell phones altogether (not just require that they be in a handset), ban the radio, ban ipods (except for the barfing kids) and ban all conversation? I'm sure these products have all been manipulated anyway. Then we'll be safer on the road. :rofl:

If not, we can just let the lawyers take over as Geek suggests and forget about the legislatures. Lotta plaintiffs' lawyers getting rich out there at this point.

scyfreestyler
May 17th, 2007, 05:27 PM
Matt- I used to say, when I was wearing blue, that I'm not as worried about the driver who goes 130 on remote road, good training etc., as when the minivan full of kids and distracted mom veer suddenly over the middle line (oncoming) 'cause junior just got roadsick all over Mom's lap & the fella at 130 just plain hasn't the time to react properly. He has 130 worth of velocity to contribute to the crash, likely deadly whether transferred to the minivan or to a rollover.


True enough, I can't argue with that. I have a theory, quite possibly incorrect, that were people to drive much faster they would pay closer attention to what they are doing and less attention to things that are not important to their safety. Whenever I drive at high speeds the radio is off, windows are up, looking far ahead and through the turns. I remember a family trip we took to Europe where we visited some friends at a military installation in Stuttgart, Germany. The husband drove us all around Germany and Austria rarely dropping below 100 MPH in their Volvo stationwagon. What sticks out in my mind are two things. First, I never saw an accident on any highway we traveled upon. There were many on the surface streets of the city but not a one on the highway. Secondly, the conversations were few and far between in that car. Driving was his #1 priority and there would be plenty of time for chit chat and beer when we reached our destination. The Major was a pilot so he was naturally a very safety aware person but it seemed that most drivers on the highways were courteous and did not take driving for granted as we do here. That is my 5 cents.


To keep it on topic, I still feel that BK should slaughter the originators of this lawsuit in the courtroom. :fingerscrossed:

The Fortress
May 17th, 2007, 05:38 PM
To keep it on topic, I still feel that BK should slaughter the originators of this lawsuit in the courtroom. :fingerscrossed:

Won't it just resolve itself the same way the KFC suit did? BK will agree to voluntarily remove TFs (since it's heading in that direction anyway). The advocacy group will withdraw. The case will be dismissed shortly thereafter. I don't see this one as an epic battle. Unless BK digs its feet in for some reason, which would be stupid.

scyfreestyler
May 17th, 2007, 06:01 PM
Won't it just resolve itself the same way the KFC suit did? BK will agree to voluntarily remove TFs (since it's heading in that direction anyway). The advocacy group will withdraw. The case will be dismissed shortly thereafter. I don't see this one as an epic battle. Unless BK digs its feet in for some reason, which would be stupid.

You are correct. I suppose what I am hoping for is that the judge will say that the lawsuit has no basis since BK is already investigating healthier alternatives. Essentially a slap in the face for the advocacy group. You see, I have a real sore spot for these sue happy advocacy groups in general. Certainly there are some arguments that are worthy of a courtroom but so many it seems are not worth the legal paper they are written upon.

The Fortress
May 17th, 2007, 08:00 PM
You are correct. I suppose what I am hoping for is that the judge will say that the lawsuit has no basis since BK is already investigating healthier alternatives. Essentially a slap in the face for the advocacy group. You see, I have a real sore spot for these sue happy advocacy groups in general. Certainly there are some arguments that are worthy of a courtroom but so many it seems are not worth the legal paper they are written upon.

When the judge dismisses the lawsuit, that IS the court saying there is no basis for it, especially if it's out on a (12)(b)(6). The judge could slap them with fees if he/she thought the suit was utterly frivolous. Highly unlikely. Most frivolous suits go unchecked. As for the last sentence, :lmao:

Next, someone will sue Starbucks for the philosophic sesquipadelian sayings on their coffee cups.

lefty
May 17th, 2007, 08:03 PM
I was not joking about the speeds I have driven at. Truthfully, it was really not that dangerous. The roads were very remote and in relatively good condition and I have attended some BMW driver schools/car control clinics.

SCY: this is a debate about public safety and how governance can help protect society. Unfortunately your opinions have absolutely no value in this discussion because ANYONE who drives 130 MPH on public roads has zero concept of their responsibilities to society. I am embarrassed that you would even attempt to justify yourself. BMW driving school? Tell me, who at the school advocates driving 130 on public roads? I don’t think it would be possible to make my point more salient.

Peter Cruise
May 17th, 2007, 08:04 PM
Oh Leslie, I just love it when you cite sections, subsection etc.

Blackbeard's Peg
May 17th, 2007, 08:05 PM
I have also heard on a few occassions that the oils that are replacing the trans fats are not really any healthier for us...Dr. Dean has commented about this for sure.

To comment on this, and touch on the many posts about educating consumers, the ZTF conversion is one of the biggest topics in foodservice right now. Most places have already converted to a ZTF frying oil, and if you look across the country, the prices should be about the same for the different oil.

However, the biggest compliance issues are at the operator level. A ZTF frying oil is only as good as the products put in. Putting in a high trans-fat content product into the fryer, even for a few seconds, will taint your oil, and thus everything else that goes into it.

I would tend to belive that this happens more often than not, thus creating a false sense of healthiness among consumers, but as more and more companies get rid of the transfats in their products, and more and more operators are more careful about their fryers, that should start to change.

Personally, I think this whole thing, while a great thing, is very big brother. :blah:

The Fortress
May 17th, 2007, 08:06 PM
Oh Leslie, I just love it when you cite sections, subsection etc.

Oh Peter, I just love it when you try to distract everyone from a good old-fashioned argument with a witticism, etc.

scyfreestyler
May 17th, 2007, 08:09 PM
SCY: this is a debate about public safety and how governance can help protect society. Unfortunately your opinions have absolutely no value in this discussion because ANYONE who drives 130 MPH on public roads has zero concept of their responsibilities to society. I am embarrassed that you would even attempt to justify yourself. BMW driving school? Tell me, who at the school advocates driving 130 on public roads? I don’t think it would be possible to make my point more salient.


None of them advocate it. I am my own man and don't need permission from a driving instructor to exceed the speed limit.

How do you know that I have zero responsiblity with respect to society? Please don't be embarrased for me, you should be embarassed for making such foolish statements about somebody whom you don't even know. You don't know the first thing about me lefty.

scyfreestyler
May 17th, 2007, 08:26 PM
I wonder if lefty feels the same way about people who drive 130 MPH on Germany's Autobahns? Or is it just the illegal part that makes her mad? I think those who read the newspaper, apply make up, eat their breakfast, change clothes, etc. while driving are far more of a hazard to society than I was on my quiet little section of highway 25.

But I guess everybody can just disregard everything I say from here on out, lefty has spoken.

gull
May 17th, 2007, 08:31 PM
I wonder if lefty feels the same way about people who drive 130 MPH on Germany's Autobahns? Or is it just the illegal part that makes her mad?

Lefty is a "he." Sorry for the interruption.

scyfreestyler
May 17th, 2007, 09:51 PM
Lefty is a "he." Sorry for the interruption.

Thanks for the clarification gull. Not sure how I determined gender in this case but my method obviously has some wrinkles to iron out.

lefty
May 17th, 2007, 10:01 PM
I wonder if lefty feels the same way about people who drive 130 MPH on Germany's Autobahns? Or is it just the illegal part that makes her mad? I think those who read the newspaper, apply make up, eat their breakfast, change clothes, etc. while driving are far more of a hazard to society than I was on my quiet little section of highway 25.

But I guess everybody can just disregard everything I say from here on out, lefty has spoken.

Just want to make sure that I am not misrepresnting you: Your defense for your foolish and dangerous behavior is:
1) BMW driving school
2) They do it in Germany (actually quite rare, but that is beside the point because I am willing to sede the point that there are foolish people there too)
3) It is safer than reading the newspaper.
4) (my personal favorite) You are your own man

6 more of these and I won't have to watch Letterman tonight!

And BTW: you are taking this way to personally. I never said to disregard EVERYTHING you say from here on out. As you aptly pointed out, I don't know you that well. I am sure that you are a fine person and that you and I have a lot in common. That doesn't change the fact that you know nothing (last time I said zero, I think I like that more) about your responsibility for public safety. On that point, I have all the evidense necessary, comically provided by you.

fanstone
May 17th, 2007, 10:18 PM
If Lefty were a she, she would spell her name as Leftie. I am billy, a male, if I were a female I would spell it billie. Last week I broke my speed record on ground by doing 140 mph on my motorcycle. But I usually cruise at around 100 mph, which is a confortable speed. Remember when speed limits in all U.S. were 55? Is that still the speed limit in New York State?

The Fortress
May 17th, 2007, 10:24 PM
If Lefty were a she, she would spell her name as Leftie. I am billy, a male, if I were a female I would spell it billie. Last week I broke my speed record on ground by doing 140 mph on my motorcycle. But I usually cruise at around 100 mph, which is a confortable speed. Remember when speed limits in all U.S. were 55? Is that still the speed limit in New York State?

Comically, Lefty doesn't know how to spell very well. (sede, evidense)

scyfreestyler
May 17th, 2007, 10:25 PM
Just want to make sure that I am not misrepresnting you: Your defense for your foolish and dangerous behavior is:
1) BMW driving school
2) They do it in Germany (actually quite rare, but that is beside the point because I am willing to sede the point that there are foolish people there too)
3) It is safer than reading the newspaper.
4) (my personal favorite) You are your own man

6 more of these and I won't have to watch Letterman tonight!

And BTW: you are taking this way to personally. I never said to disregard EVERYTHING you say from here on out. As you aptly pointed out, I don't know you that well. I am sure that you are a fine person and that you and I have a lot in common. That doesn't change the fact that you know nothing (last time I said zero, I think I like that more) about your responsibility for public safety. On that point, I have all the evidense necessary, comically provided by you.

So you still insist that my 130 MPH escapade means that I know nothing about public safety? :applaud:

You seem to enjoy taking things out of context...I said that reading the newspaper while driving was more dangerous than what I did. Do you disagree? As there were no other cars on this section of road I don't see how I was endangering anybody. If you can figure out who's life I was endangering, aside from my own I suppose, I will buy you a Fastskin II.

I did in fact state that I don't need a driving instructor to tell me that it's okay to drive at high speeds and that I am capable of making my own decisions. Nowhere in this comment did I try to defend my driving by the way..that was one of your attempts to take things out of context once again.



For the record, my JOB has a lot to do with public safety and I do it quite well thank you very much. And, I do take it personally when somebody makes a comment about me that is not factual. As I stated above, my job deals with public safety and I do it quite well and with pride. When somebody like you comes along and thinks that I have no idea about my responsibility for public safety based upon a few high speed runs on a remote section of road, it irks me. You don't know what you are talking about, plain and simple.

I apologize for calling you a girl by the way.

scyfreestyler
May 17th, 2007, 10:26 PM
If Lefty were a she, she would spell her name as Leftie. I am billy, a male, if I were a female I would spell it billie. Last week I broke my speed record on ground by doing 140 mph on my motorcycle. But I usually cruise at around 100 mph, which is a confortable speed. Remember when speed limits in all U.S. were 55? Is that still the speed limit in New York State?

Your comments are meaningless in this thread Billy...you have traveled too fast on a public roadway. :wave:

Kidding of course.

scyfreestyler
May 17th, 2007, 10:29 PM
Almost forgot, I would argue that attending BMW driving schools does prepare somebody for high speed driving. They don't suggest doing so on a public roadway but the purpose of the school is to teach you how to control your car at the limit and beyond the limit should you ever find yourself there.

SwimStud
May 17th, 2007, 10:30 PM
If not, we can just let the lawyers take over as Geek suggests and forget about the legislatures. Lotta plaintiffs' lawyers getting rich out there at this point.

What is this the "Geek n Fort kiss and make-up special?"
Get a room already!

:rofl: :party2:

Peter Cruise
May 17th, 2007, 10:41 PM
Matt- my point, I think you took rightly, was what about the stuff beyond your control at that speed. I will never forget my up close and personal experiences with the aftermath of high-speed crashes and how at that moment it is never about who was responsible, but the sheer, usually avoidable, tragedy of it all. Victim next-of-kin notifications were the hardest thing. I don't do that job anymore, but I swore to myself that I would never subject anyone I cared for to either the physical or emotional aftermath of any silly driving (and I had done some, never fear, so don't take offence at the word 'silly') by me. No criticism beyond the salient point intended here.

fanstone
May 17th, 2007, 11:04 PM
What I find dangerous is going slow, specially on the left side of the road, in case of double lanes. By slow I mean 30 or 20 mph, or maybe a little more, but still, worse than going fast. Aggressive defensive driving is safer than defensive or no attitude driving. Eating grilled cat-fish and vegetables at the Cracker Barrel is okay. Their coffee tastes good, and just like Wall-Mart, you never know the difference between one and the other in different cities. You can be blind, walk in, go to the bathroom, make a phone call, eat, pay your bill in any of the franchises, never missing a step.

The Fortress
May 17th, 2007, 11:12 PM
What is this the "Geek n Fort kiss and make-up special?"
Get a room already!

:rofl: :party2:

I'm not a plaintiffs' lawyer, as I already said. :thhbbb: I just don't want to be told what to eat or who to serve. I can get my own room too. :thhbbb: Can we go back to the "comedy" portion of the thread now? Or else I'll have to go speeding off in Mr. Fort's beemer since he's busy arbitrating a frivolous legal matter ... I can tell you his view, even though he's not here. Anything that teaches you to handle your vehicle, including BMW driving school, is a good thing.

Four questions:

Can one go fast in rush hour traffic?

Why is the server busy at 11:00pm when not that many people are on line?

Billy, are you sure you're a doctor, you wild man? LOL.

Matt, why did you think Lefty was a girl?

SwimStud
May 17th, 2007, 11:13 PM
Why is the server busy at 11:00pm when not that many people are on line?

Jim and Rob and going through the PM's...

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

scyfreestyler
May 17th, 2007, 11:29 PM
Matt- my point, I think you took rightly, was what about the stuff beyond your control at that speed. I will never forget my up close and personal experiences with the aftermath of high-speed crashes and how at that moment it is never about who was responsible, but the sheer, usually avoidable, tragedy of it all. Victim next-of-kin notifications were the hardest thing. I don't do that job anymore, but I swore to myself that I would never subject anyone I cared for to either the physical or emotional aftermath of any silly driving (and I had done some, never fear, so don't take offence at the word 'silly') by me. No criticism beyond the salient point intended here.


I hear you Peter and I respect your comments as well as the way they were presented.

scyfreestyler
May 17th, 2007, 11:35 PM
I'm not a plaintiffs' lawyer, as I already said. :thhbbb: I just don't want to be told what to eat or who to serve. I can get my own room too. :thhbbb: Can we go back to the "comedy" portion of the thread now? Or else I'll have to go speeding off in Mr. Fort's beemer since he's busy arbitrating a frivolous legal matter ... I can tell you his view, even though he's not here. Anything that teaches you to handle your vehicle, including BMW driving school, is a good thing.

Four questions:

Can one go fast in rush hour traffic?

Why is the server busy at 11:00pm when not that many people are on line?

Billy, are you sure you're a doctor? LOL.

Matt, why did you think Lefty was a girl?

Not sure why really.


As for the drving school, it's a great idea and there were many people there without BMW's at these events. One of the greatest exercises in the car control clinic portion was steering with the throttle only. You drive in a large circle and eventually begin to control your steering with the throttle while keeping the steering wheel stationary. It takes a fair amount of SPEED and tire smoke but it's great fun and you really get to know your car. For the record, these clinics are very cheap for BMWCCA members. I think I paid $75.00 and that included lunch.

fanstone
May 17th, 2007, 11:37 PM
Fort: because of the catfish or the motorcycle? Here is one I've done once and never will do again, but yet, it is in my C.V.: I jumped off a plane wearing a parachute (the type that opens on its own), did a bad landing and didn't do a repeat and so now I am scared of that activity. I do my own cooking everyday so usually I eat well and healthy. The Cracker Barrel thing is just a once every two or more year thing, as I don't live there and there aren't any here. No grits here, no sausages (as in breakfast american sausages), no american grind coffee. billy fanstone

The Fortress
May 17th, 2007, 11:47 PM
Fort: because of the catfish or the motorcycle? Here is one I've done once and never will do again, but yet, it is in my C.V.: I jumped off a plane wearing a parachute (the type that opens on its own), did a bad landing and didn't do a repeat and so now I am scared of that activity. I do my own cooking everyday so usually I eat well and healthy. The Cracker Barrel thing is just a once every two or more year thing, as I don't live there and there aren't any here. No grits here, no sausages (as in breakfast american sausages), no american grind coffee. billy fanstone

I think it was all of the above, plus past comments. LOL.

I can truthfully say that I have never been to a Cracker Barrel. I have never eaten grits either. If we all just drive fast (or slow) and go on the Exxon Mobile diet, we won't have to worry about TFs.

scyfreestyler
May 17th, 2007, 11:48 PM
Those foolish Germans...look where all of that high speed driving has gotten them.

Accident rates
Despite the prevailing high speeds, the accident, injury and death rates on the Autobahn are remarkably low. The Autobahn carries about a third of all Germany's traffic, but injury accidents on the Autobahn account for only 6% of such accidents nationwide and less than 12% of all traffic fatalities were the result of Autobahn crashes (2004). In fact, the annual fatality rate (3.2 per billion km in 2004) is consistently lower than that of most other superhighway systems, including the US Interstates (5.0 in 2003).

Source: http://gettingaroundgermany.home.att.net/autobahn.htm

And this source supports the above figures.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autobahn

Beating a dead horse perhaps but lefty did say that high speeds on public roadways were foolish...it seems that these foolish people from Germany get into far fewer accidents that the uptight safety pups in the US of A.

fanstone
May 18th, 2007, 12:31 AM
Places that foreigners or expats go to in the U.S. that might not be interesting for those who live there and could go anytime they wish and take for granted: Wal-Mart, Cracker Barrel, Morrison's, Ponderosa, Circuit City, Best Buy, diverse Outlets, Belz, Fleet Feet, Sports Authority and so forth. The Interstate system is also good, although slow. Dang, I miss getting off the Beltway into I-95 or whatever it is called going south, pure adrenalin.

dorothyrde
May 18th, 2007, 07:21 AM
So, anyway, Cracker Barrel is the worst restaurant ever built, conceived or created. I avoid it like the plague. Have you ever noticed the rocking chairs outside are double wides to accomodate the patrons? The food couldn't be any greasier or nastier. If we are going to start suing restaurants, we should start with that place.

My sister gave me a gift card to this place 3 years ago. It is still in a drawer somewhere. Just not my thing.

Leonard Jansen
May 18th, 2007, 08:26 AM
All you have to do is tell me one single product out there that isn't manipulated to make it more appealing to the consumer. Just one.

Brussel Sprouts.

QED,
LBJ

SwimStud
May 18th, 2007, 08:33 AM
My sister gave me a gift card to this place 3 years ago. It is still in a drawer somewhere. Just not my thing.

Dorothy change your post...what if your sister reads this?..it could spark a Family Feud!
;)

FindingMyInnerFish
May 18th, 2007, 08:47 AM
Brussel Sprouts.

QED,
LBJ

I resemble that... :duel: Brussels sprouts are *very* appealing to *me*! Excellent Inner :fish2: food.

SwimStud
May 18th, 2007, 08:55 AM
I resemble that... :duel: Brussels sprouts are *very* appealing to *me*! Excellent Inner :fish2: food.

Sprouts are awesome with butter, gravy and black pepper...they give you gas though...so they could potentially eliminate the gas causing properties to make them more appealing....

CreamPuff
May 18th, 2007, 09:03 AM
I thought almost all products were manipulated to increase profit.
Marketing 101.

Some (not all) drug companies follow the philosophy of "don't cure the problem" but keep the problem at bay by requiring the consumer to take one pill a day for life. Bigger profits. Or how about drug companies trying to reach a larger market audience by using drugs for purposes other than what they were initially intended for?

Or cells phone companies - phones dying "mysteriously" after a certain time frame requiring the consumer to upgrade and buy a new one.

Or "Biggie" sizing fast food portions or restaurant portions. That strategy is used to increase revenue or $$'s in while attempting to convince the consumer that they are getting a better value and more for their money. Ha!

As for brussel sprouts, I heard there was a soda in the works via Jones soda, a premium hip hop brand soda! When you look up their ideas about the soda, most of the articles cite revenue potential and growth. NO JOKE!
:thhbbb:

CreamPuff
May 18th, 2007, 09:24 AM
However, when a corporation decides to manipulate their product, and when this manipulation harms the public they have done something wrong.

I do agree with this statement. The problem is that this occurs frequently and in many industries. Going after Burger King seems silly and hypocritical as there are many other industries and companies doing much more harm to people's health, safety, and/ or well-being.

Many of these companies are structured in that they must answer to numbers (profit). Unfotunately, customer satisfaction and safety are number 100 on the list of concerns. If numbers are met, employees keep their jobs and may receive bonuses. If not, you lose your job. Some executives live by the "it's better to ask for forgiveness" if and when they get caught. In fact many large companies have huge in-house legal departments that estimate the number and cost of lawsuits that they expect on a yearly basis. Often, the profits from doing something unethical or risky MORE than pay for the cost of a large lawsuit. Crazy! :2cents:

All this being said, I'm still for free enterprise as I feel that inserting yet another corrupt entity (the government) will, at best, not solve anything.

I'm too pessimistic at only 34! :bitching:

tjburk
May 18th, 2007, 09:47 AM
Lefty, let me clarify something for you about Germany.....the speed limit on the Autobahn is actually around 200 MPH in most parts of the country. People regularly travel at well over 100 MPH, including myself while I was there for four years. The rules of the road over there are very strict, including vehicle maintenance laws.

I saw fewer accidents there in four years then I saw in L.A in 6 months...literally!

Over in Germany you will get a ticket for driving in the left lane if the right lane is clear. If I am driving along at 100 MPH and pull into the left lane to pass and get rear ended by someone going faster, I am at fault for not clearing that lane first before entering it. If I have an accident at 100 MPH but my tires are rated for only up to 80 MPH guess who's at fault....me!

I felt safer driving over there because 99.9% of everyone there follows the rules. We have some of the same rules here, but they are never enforced i.e. "Slower Traffic Keep Right" One simple rule like that could cut down on accidents by, I would guess 20-25% across the board. This simple enforcement would keep slower traffic all the way to the right side of the road. Leaving the left lane open and clear all the time.

I have to agree with SCY here in ref to the people that are driving down the road doing everything but paying attention to driving.....they are far more dangerous and cause way more accidents then any other drivers on the road. The "speeders" that cause the majority of the accidents here in the states are the teenagers who don't have a clue what they are doing. Over in Germany, you can't even get a license until you are 18. Then you have to pay for the school yourself. Over there they consider driving a privilege not a right like most here do....they have to earn the right to drive!

Just my:2cents: of course!

The Fortress
May 18th, 2007, 09:58 AM
In fact many large companies have huge in-house legal departments that estimate the number and cost of lawsuits that they expect on a yearly basis. Often, the profits from doing something unethical or risky MORE than pay for the cost of a large lawsuit. Crazy! :2cents:


My fav jerks are the toxic waster dumpers. They dump toxic waste, knowing that they are in violation of EPA regs (among other things) and that the EPA (and others) will sue them. While battilng away or shortly thereafter, they then engage in protracted litigation with their insurance companies, whom they expect to cover all the damages from from their dumping, which cannot be proved to be intentional. Litigation goes on for years over whether the dumping is covered or not by the policy. Insurance company is then forced to settle, sending more $$ back to the bad dumper.

Tracy:

I agree that the age for driver's licenses should be raised. Not a popular view with teenagers. But I'm not sure I know of a single teenager who hasn't at least been in a fender bender. Where I live the traffic is dense and dangerous. There is already consideration of raising the driving age to 17. Despite the fact that this will prolong my life as a chauffeur, I would prefer it.

Is anyone wondering what Matt's public safety job is?

3strokes
May 18th, 2007, 09:59 AM
I thought almost all products were manipulated to increase profit.
Marketing 101.

Or cells phone companies - phones dying "mysteriously" after a certain time frame requiring the consumer to upgrade and buy a new one.

:thhbbb:

All electronics are "programmed" to die within 12 to 72 hours(max) after the warranty expires, whatever warranty the customer buys (one, two or three). I believe the formula is:
[date-of-death] = [date-of-purchase] + ([length-of-warranty] * 365] + 2)
(or + 3 if [date-of-death] = "Sat" or "Sun")

Never fails.

3strokes
May 18th, 2007, 10:02 AM
I went to Costco today, while Chuckie was shopping I had my favorite transfat meal - Poutine, a massive serving of fries and cheese curds topped with gravy. Added some other favorites salt, pepper, viniger and ketchup.

George
That stuff is deadly, unless you dilute it with a few pints............ (Do not dilute before swallowing or eating. "Wash it down with".......... is what I meant to say, as you undoubtedly surmised.)

tjburk
May 18th, 2007, 10:02 AM
Fort, they are slowly raising the age here in GA. Remembering some of the stupid stuff I did growing up in California when I was learning to drive....I fully support it. Like you said, not very popular with my teenagers, but much safer for the rest of the people on the road.

The Fortress
May 18th, 2007, 10:03 AM
All electronics are "programmed" to die within 12 to 72 hours(max) after the warranty expires, whatever warranty the customer buys (one, two or three). I believe the formula is:
[date-of-death] = [date-of-purchase] + ([length-of-warranty] * 365] + 2)
(or + 3 if [date-of-death] = "Sat" or "Sun")

Never fails.

My mini-ipod lasted through the initial warranty and the extended warranty. Even though I repeatedly dropped it on running trails. It's so old, they don't even sell it anymore. :thhbbb:

Tracy:

At least you recognize you did stupid things. I have heard so many parents say "My teenager has good judgment." I always say, no matter how good your kid seems, they do not have good judgment. Especially when it comes to cars. That's why minors here can't have cell phones or other minors in their car for awhile. Trying to avoid that distraction at the wheel issue. (It's not just moms in min-vans!)

geochuck
May 18th, 2007, 10:05 AM
Germany.....the speed limit on the Autobahn is actually around 200 MPH

Are there any Burger Kings at the rest stops or Tim Horton's Donut shops.

SwimStud
May 18th, 2007, 10:07 AM
Well I think it's still down to folks being accountable. Alhough I think sometimes someone has to force corporations to stop using harmful things in their products.

At the end of it all though, I hope to go having enjoyed a life of reasonably good behaviour yet still having stopped of for some indulgence along the way.

you can't drink a pint of whiskey, smoke 200 cigs and eat fast food everyday and expect good health--period.

You can do aslittle of all, exercsise and expect a fair run...although yes, you could take more precautions...you have to enjoy your time here...until I get confirmation that there is a second trip...

Now where'd I put that burger and my copy of playboy?

scyfreestyler
May 18th, 2007, 10:13 AM
My fav jerks are the toxic waster dumpers. They dump toxic waste, knowing that they are in violation of EPA regs (among other things) and that the EPA (and others) will sue them. While battilng away or shortly thereafter, they then engage in protracted litigation with their insurance companies, whom they expect to cover all the damages from from their dumping, which cannot be proved to be intentional. Litigation goes on for years over whether the dumping is covered or not by the policy. Insurance company is then forced to settle, sending more $$ back to the bad dumper.

Tracy:

I agree that the age for driver's licenses should be raised. Not a popular view with teenagers. But I'm not sure I know of a single teenager who hasn't at least been in a fender bender. Where I live the traffic is dense and dangerous. There is already consideration of raising the driving age to 17. Despite the fact that this will prolong my life as a chauffeur, I would prefer it.

Is anyone wondering what Matt's public safety job is?

With some of the personalites around here I don't know if I even want to announce it. I wll say that my job is probably more closely tied to public health than public safety; by definition.

tjburk
May 18th, 2007, 10:13 AM
Chuck, they do have BK and McDonald's and KFC over there. And believe it or not you can order beer at the drive thru!!!!!:drink: :drink:

geochuck
May 18th, 2007, 10:20 AM
I want Tim Horton's they have one in Afganistan.

SwimStud
May 18th, 2007, 10:32 AM
None of this can beat a Fish and Chip dinner followed by a Deep Fried Snickers bar...:coffee:

scyfreestyler
May 18th, 2007, 11:36 AM
I'll take the Fish and Chips with a Newcastle...scratch the snickers bar though.

FindingMyInnerFish
May 18th, 2007, 11:51 AM
I suppose the thing is to reach a balance.

Obviously, the person going to BK, Mickey's and other Grease Special establishments and eating a couple orders of burgers and fries daily has more problems than a lawsuit will solve. But suppose a person eats at BK once and becomes seriously ill as a result, because of some toxin in the food. Or (maybe a more complicated issue), someone has an allergy to a specific food item, such as peanuts. Where is the line between personal responsibility and public accountability by corporations?

A family member has had to research internet sites of a lot of different foods due to concerns about gluten/celiac disease; sometimes she has to e-mail or call customer service to determine whether a product is gluten free. If she gets no response or can't get information elsewhere, she won't buy the product.

More and more companies, I notice, have begun to disclose ingredients that could be hazardous or brag about lacking those ingredients. It takes a certain amount of pressure from the public--and voting with one's pocketbook.

But do we totally de-regulate and take our chances? Consider what happened with pet foods recently. (And consider that often people in extreme poverty will resort to eating pet food.) Also look at Vioxx--the company rushed the product to market, glossing over the cardiovascular risk.

If a food item or drug poses an immediate threat to a significant portion of the population, something does need to be done. If it's a matter of, "eat x on a regular basis for x number of (months? years?) and your health will suffer," maybe the urgency of a lawsuit is a bit extreme, since in that case one can choose to eat less of x and substitute other healthier foods, such as brussels sprouts. ;)

My additional $.02. (My pennies are tied up on forum responses. Please don't sue me.) ;)

SwimStud
May 18th, 2007, 12:03 PM
stuff about driving in Germany.


the same

How many Germans drive along whilst eating a TF laden burger, while guzzling a 32oz drink and while talking on the phone??

See TF's are bad for you!

scyfreestyler
May 18th, 2007, 12:07 PM
How many Germans drive along whilst eating a TF laden burger, while guzzling a 32oz drink and while talking on the phone??

See TF's are bad for you!


The root of all evil.

lefty
May 18th, 2007, 12:29 PM
SCY: When I wrote that driving 130 mph is safer than reading the newspaper the "while driving" was implied. I wasn't taking you out of context, I was leaving off the obvious. Clearly I didn't do a good job making my point. Here is my reattempt: your statement, "I think driving while putting on makeup and reading the newspaper is more dangerous," seems to indicate that you believe that by naming activities that are MORE dangerous than driving 130 mph you somehow justify your own foolishness (Yes your honor, I was drinking and driving, but the last guy was driving while high on crystal meth!). Please tell me you understand the utter foolishness of that type of argument.

I am going to guess you are a nurse.

Capitalism works to a higher degree when consumers have reasonable confidence in the safety and efficacy of the products they buy. This is why we have government oversight (FDA, National Transportation Safety Board etc...). It is reasonable to expect to go to Burger King and not be served the equivalent of rat poison. And if Burger King is allowed to serve rat poison under the protection of, "only an idiot would think that eating at Burger King isn't bad for you," then there will be broad effects on society. That is what I believe.

SwimStud
May 18th, 2007, 12:29 PM
Which leads me to my next point. Food and drink drive-thru's should be totally abolished.

aquageek
May 18th, 2007, 12:49 PM
I find capitalism works best when government doesn't intrude. Otherwise, that's called communism or socialism.

scyfreestyler
May 18th, 2007, 12:50 PM
SCY: When I wrote that driving 130 mph is safer than reading the newspaper the "while driving" was implied. I wasn't taking you out of context, I was leaving off the obvious. Clearly I didn't do a good job making my point. Here is my reattempt: your statement, "I think driving while putting on makeup and reading the newspaper is more dangerous," seems to indicate that you believe that by naming activities that are MORE dangerous than driving 130 mph you somehow justify your own foolishness (Yes your honor, I was drinking and driving, but the last guy was driving while high on crystal meth!). Please tell me you understand the utter foolishness of that type of argument.

I am going to guess you are a nurse.

Capitalism works to a higher degree when consumers have reasonable confidence in the safety and efficacy of the products they buy. This is why we have government oversight (FDA, National Transportation Safety Board etc...). It is reasonable to expect to go to Burger King and not be served the equivalent of rat poison. And if Burger King is allowed to serve rat poison under the protection of, "only an idiot would think that eating at Burger King isn't bad for you," then there will be broad effects on society. That is what I believe.

I don't think my speedy driving was really that dangerous at all. As a matter of fact, it was probably less dangerous than doing so on the Autobahn as I had no other cars to contend with. Therefore, your comparison with DUI and meth has absolutely nothing to do with my driving as far as I am concerned. You think I was looking for a stairway to heaven I guess and that is fine...you are entitled to an opinion.




I also don't think that TF's are even remotely close to rat poison...certainly not the equivelant of. I agree that there should be some oversight of food and drugs, but BK is currently in compliance with Federal Regualtions to the best of my knowledge.

geochuck
May 18th, 2007, 01:07 PM
Hey Geek tell me a country were the government does not intrude I think I will move there.
I find capitalism works best when government doesn't intrude. Otherwise, that's called communism or socialism.

tjburk
May 18th, 2007, 01:07 PM
One of the biggest problems we have today is this-

We have gotten so far away from personal responsiblity, it's borderline ludicrous - i.e. I pull into McDonald's on my way to work, I order a cup of HOT coffee, I then try and drive the rest of the way to work while drinking said cup of HOT coffee, I spill it in my lap and burn myself, am I to blame?

I sure as heck should be.....but not in this day and age, in this day and age the company that sold me the coffee is to blame :doh: :doh: :doh: How the heck did they come up with that? They sold me the product that I wanted, but because I am stupid and clumsy, I spill on myself, and it's there fault???

WOW!!!! Only in America!!!!

SwimStud
May 18th, 2007, 01:13 PM
Pure capitalism is a fallacy. Economic spillover costs are bad enough as is...give corporations an unfettered, Friedman-esque carte blanche to maximise shareholder wealth and that's just what they will do...to everyone's detriment.

Now too much govt. is bad...but none is much worse.

SwimStud
May 18th, 2007, 01:15 PM
...We have gotten so far away from personal responsiblity...
DING! DING! DING! DING! DING! DING!



WOW!!!! Only in America!!!!

Sadly no; USA may have started the trend but it's catching on in many places now...

lefty
May 18th, 2007, 01:24 PM
I find capitalism works best when government doesn't intrude. Otherwise, that's called communism or socialism.

That is a platitude, not an argument. Call something communist, it makes it bad.

In light of recent tainted meets, it is very likely that without the FDA consumers confidense in meat would be very low right now. We can disagree with the role that the FDA plays in raising the confidense of the consumer, and we can disagree to the degree that the increased confidense helps the sale of the product, or we can brush that off and simply label it communism.

lefty
May 18th, 2007, 01:25 PM
Pure capitalism is a fallacy. Economic spillover costs are bad enough as is...give corporations an unfettered, Friedman-esque carte blanche to maximise shareholder wealth and that's just what they will do...to everyone's detriment.

Now too much govt. is bad...but none is much worse.

I agree and you did a much better job of stating it!

aquaFeisty
May 18th, 2007, 03:08 PM
I just had a black cherry vanilla coke and half a bag of Hint-of-Lime Tostitos for lunch. Hmmm, perhaps this wasn't the most healthy lunch? Oh, I'm sure it wasn't my fault for eating so unhealthily! I think I will sue Tostitos for making their Hint-of-Lime chips so tasty. I'm sure I could have stopped at just a handful of plain tortilla chips...

Slowswim
May 18th, 2007, 03:21 PM
I didn't have much time for lunch so I used my standard fast meal of: canned chicken smothered in Salsa and an apple.
Zero Trans Fats and only 300 tasty calories.:banana:
</IMG>

tjburk
May 18th, 2007, 03:30 PM
That actually kind of sounds good Bill....do you eat that on crackers or anything?

I was bad today......Patty Melt and Onion Rings.....soooooo good though!!!!

Slowswim
May 18th, 2007, 03:37 PM
Usually over a baked (Nuc'd) potato; but with no time, I just ate it with a fork.


I highly recommend it either way (with or without the potato).

Mmmmm, "Fine Desk Dining". That could be a cool thread.:groovy:
</IMG>

tjburk
May 18th, 2007, 03:41 PM
Over a potato sounds good.......

I usually smother a potato with chilly and cheese!!!!!! LOL

3strokes
May 18th, 2007, 07:20 PM
My mini-ipod lasted through the initial warranty and the extended warranty. Even though I repeatedly dropped it on running trails. It's so old, they don't even sell it anymore. :thhbbb:


My mistake when I said:


All electronics are "programmed" to die within 12 to 72 hours(max) after the warranty expires, whatever warranty the customer buys (one, two or three). I believe the formula is:
[date-of-death] = [date-of-purchase] + ([length-of-warranty] * 365] + 2)
(or + 3 if [date-of-death] = "Sat" or "Sun")

Never fails.


I forgot to add (the truism that -subjectively- applies to all goggles that don't leak):
And if they made a mistake, and manufactured a "good" product, they STOP making it.

Slowswim
May 18th, 2007, 08:48 PM
Over a potato sounds good.......

I usually smother a potato with chilly and cheese!!!!!! LOL

I used to, this is as good!

MOONBEAM
May 20th, 2007, 08:33 AM
I'm not a plaintiffs' lawyer, as I already said. :thhbbb: I just don't want to be told what to eat or who to serve. I can get my own room too. :thhbbb: Can we go back to the "comedy" portion of the thread now? Or else I'll have to go speeding off in Mr. Fort's beemer since he's busy arbitrating a frivolous legal matter ... I can tell you his view, even though he's not here. Anything that teaches you to handle your vehicle, including BMW driving school, is a good thing.

Four questions:

Can one go fast in rush hour traffic?



Sure a person can drive fast in rush hour traffic. All they need to do is get in the diamond lane with a blow-up dummy person strapped into the passenger seat so as not to be discovered. Saw this in California on Hwy 101. But that was in the 90s, now that dummy would need to have a cell phone in hand to look more "real" nowadays.:D

Peter Cruise
May 21st, 2007, 01:38 AM
And you would have to overinflate the dummy to blend in...

Treebox
May 21st, 2007, 11:26 AM
Stupid people, Stupid lawyers, Stupid judges.

Did you hear about the judge in Northern Virginia who sued a dry cleaner for losing his favorite pair of pants for a mere $60 million dollars!

BK might just loose with someone on the bench like that.

Tree

SwimStud
May 21st, 2007, 12:19 PM
And you would have to overinflate the dummy to blend in...


Hopefully not while driving...but hey, CA is fairly liberal...

dorothyrde
May 21st, 2007, 01:58 PM
Dorothy change your post...what if your sister reads this?..it could spark a Family Feud!
;)


My sister does not get on the internet, nor does she exercise so would not be on a site like this!

3strokes
May 21st, 2007, 04:36 PM
And you would have to overinflate the dummy to blend in...

Careful, where and how you "inflate" the dummy................
In some counties, you might get arrested for just such an act.

lefty
May 21st, 2007, 04:47 PM
Stupid people, Stupid lawyers, Stupid judges.

Did you hear about the judge in Northern Virginia who sued a dry cleaner for losing his favorite pair of pants for a mere $60 million dollars!

BK might just loose with someone on the bench like that.

Tree

They may lose the case too...:laugh2:

SwimStud
May 25th, 2007, 03:12 PM
I had a BK meal last night and loved evry last TF of it! I then went in my car to Dunkin Donuts for a coffee and got a butternut donughnut while I was there!

I feel so American this morning!

Peter Cruise
May 25th, 2007, 03:26 PM
Rich- you probably didn't supersize though...that is the real litmus test.

swimr4life
May 25th, 2007, 03:29 PM
I had a BK meal last night and loved evry last TF of it! I then went in my car to Dunkin Donuts for a coffee and got a butternut donughnut while I was there!

I feel so American this morning!

Wow...you need to swim a few extra thousand yards!:rofl:

swimr4life
May 25th, 2007, 03:32 PM
Hey....what's up with you guys making fun of us Americans? God forbid we start comparing national favorites. Can you say fish and chips are any healthier? :thhbbb:

SwimStud
May 25th, 2007, 05:00 PM
Hey....what's up with you guys making fun of us Americans? God forbid we start comparing national favorites. Can you say fish and chips are any healthier? :thhbbb:

In Britiain we actually have to exit the car and use our lower limbs to get the fish and chips and then go back to the car...so it's a bit better .

There's no drive through drugstores to get your diet pills from either :thhbbb:.

geochuck
May 25th, 2007, 06:15 PM
In the UK you do not know what convenience is. I can get home delivery without going out to pick up my "Fish-n-Chips" as long as my order is over $10.00. They come to my house wrapped in newspaper ready to eat. They even deliver salt, pepper and vinegar. The Yanks don't know how good fish and chips are with malt vinegar.

They even send ketchup.

swimr4life
May 26th, 2007, 01:57 PM
In the UK you do not know what convenience is. I can get home delivery without going out to pick up my "Fish-n-Chips" as long as my order is over $10.00. They come to my house wrapped in newspaper ready to eat. They even deliver salt, pepper and vinegar. The Yanks don't know how good fish and chips are with malt vinegar.

They even send ketchup.

Chuck,
You'd be surprised how many Americans eat fish with malt vinegar. Captain D's and Long John Silvers got me started on that. You are so right! It is delicious!

geochuck
May 26th, 2007, 03:24 PM
Chuck,
You'd be surprised how many Americans eat fish with malt vinegar. Captain D's and Long John Silvers got me started on that. You are so right! It is delicious! You are right there is a pretty good place to have Fish and Chips in the USA H.Salt http://www.hsalt.com/index.htm Nutritional guide here http://www.hsalt.com/nutritional.htm

SwimStud
May 28th, 2007, 08:24 PM
Today we went to the Ice Creamparlour like many folks.
I had a Rum Raisin cone. It was good.
I then had a Maple Walnut cone. It too was good.

...I am going to sue the shop for selling me a second cone and increasing my risk of clogged arteries etc.
:cheerleader:

geochuck
May 28th, 2007, 09:23 PM
CHICKEN ENCHILADAS: We visited Mexico in our own dining room tonite. Chuckie took a cooking class by one of the cooks in Melacque Mexico. Better than any enchiladas I have ever had. No trans fats, used ingredients we brought back from Melaque, the special dried peppers etc.

geochuck
May 29th, 2007, 06:04 PM
Even Thorpe ate trans fat foods http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9SyUXvY_JE&mode=related&search=

islandsox
May 31st, 2007, 02:08 PM
We have our first drive through here; it is a Donut drive through. I'll try to get a picture of it. It's called Mini-Donut Drive Through and you have to get out of your car; they didn't exactly build the drive thru window with cars in mind (LOL). I haven't had one yet but I hear that they put one donut hole in a cup and the cup is filled with a water/confectioner's sugar concoction. It's Roatan's version of Diabetes in a Cup.:dunno:

geochuck
May 31st, 2007, 02:58 PM
We have our first drive through here; it is a Donut drive through. I'll try to get a picture of it. It's called Mini-Donut Drive Through and you have to get out of your car; they didn't exactly build the drive thru window with cars in mind (LOL). I haven't had one yet but I hear that they put one donut hole in a cup and the cup is filled with a water/confectioner's sugar concoction. It's Roatan's version of Diabetes in a Cup.:dunno:
Here is the ride through Tim Hortons, Fort St John BC. They did not have to get off their horses. In the summer I saw 7 horses in the line up.

imspoiled
June 1st, 2007, 11:31 AM
Here is the ride through Tim Hortons, Fort St John BC. They did not have to get off their horses. In the summer I saw 7 horses in the line up.

Geez George,
It's 2007. Don't they have cars up there in Canada yet?:joker:

3strokes
June 6th, 2007, 03:37 PM
We have our first drive through here; it is a Donut drive through. I'll try to get a picture of it. It's called Mini-Donut Drive Through and you have to get out of your car; they didn't exactly build the drive thru window with cars in mind (LOL). I haven't had one yet but I hear that they put one donut hole in a cup and the cup is filled with a water/confectioner's sugar concoction. It's Roatan's version of Diabetes in a Cup.:dunno:

From your description, Donna, it seems to me like they mis-spelled it.
They were thinking more:
Mini-DoNOT Drive Through

scyfreestyler
June 6th, 2007, 03:42 PM
Had some great fish and chips this past weekend at a local pub in Monterey. Enjoyed it with a pair of Guinness pints...most excellent!

SwimStud
June 6th, 2007, 06:08 PM
Anyone touring CT can come swim with me and then go for a fish and chip supper. Guinness too!

:drink:

geochuck
June 15th, 2007, 12:13 PM
Cheetah - Johnny W's Cheetah still alive In California. 71 years old, goes to Drive thrus and has a hamburg and coke. He drinks beer and smokes cigars. Very healthy, 4 feet tall and weighs 140lbs.
http://soundingcircle.com/newslog2.php/__show_article/_a000195-000176.htm

3strokes
June 17th, 2007, 07:45 AM
I don't really want to start a new thread (about morons who don't know that hot coffee is "hot" if spilled in your lap or about bicycle-makers who get sued -successfully- because their booklets don't explicitly state that headlights should be turned ON if one is riding in the dark and rides into a parked car or judges who sue dry-cleaners for $54 million for losing their pants ---why? Did they forget their family jewels in the pants that were lost? And were the jewels worth that much? Even to their owner?)

Anyway here's the latest (and in my view, most moronic) precautionary sign I have seen from our Lords and Masters, the City of Ottawa at the public pool where I swim:

One of those yellow sandwich signs thats says, "Caution. Wet Floor", in both official languages.
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in front of the men's showers.
P.S. I really don't know if they have a similar sign in the ladies' locker room.

scyfreestyler
June 18th, 2007, 11:27 AM
Some signs are not worth the guano that falls upon them.

SwimStud
August 27th, 2007, 10:11 AM
Well DD's now gets with the program!

http://www.comcast.net/news/index.jsp?cat=GENERAL&fn=/2007/08/27/748707.html&cvqh=itn_dunkin

Police departments nationwide now going to introduce smaller gunbelts...
:rofl:

3strokes
August 27th, 2007, 10:38 AM
Well DD's now gets with the program!

http://www.comcast.net/news/index.jsp?cat=GENERAL&fn=/2007/08/27/748707.html&cvqh=itn_dunkin

Police departments nationwide now going to introduce smaller gunbelts...
:rofl:

Quote From that article
Federal regulations allow food labels to say they've got zero grams of trans fat, provided levels fall below the half-gram threshold.

Therefore if "any weight" < 0.5g = (or is equivalent to) zero
In other words (for example) 0.4g = zero then,
mathematically (or logically)
if x= 0.4g
then 10x = 4g
100x = 40g
10000x = 4000g (that's 1 kg = 2.2 lbs)
but if x = 0.4g and 0.4g is equivalent to zero
then 10000x = zero
Therefore 2.2 lbs of transfats = zero transfats. (ad infinitum).

geochuck
August 27th, 2007, 10:52 AM
Stud cops are famous for taking coffee breaks. Did I ever tell you about the coffee I had in the kitchen of a restaurant, it had protein added.

I looked in the cup of coffee and it had cockroach legs floating it. Needless to say I did not drink that coffee.

SwimStud
August 27th, 2007, 10:56 AM
Stud cops are famous for taking coffee breaks. Did I ever tell you about the coffee I had in the kitchen of a restaurant, it had protein added.

I looked in the cup of coffee and it had cockroach legs floating it. Needless to say I did not drink that coffee.

Hehe well seeing it is one thing...not seeing it and ingesting is another.
I went to lunch once in the UK...I was trying to get to the pub, but a bomb threat on a bus had blocked the access, so I'd settled for tea whilst I waited. I then get word that the pub was accessible again (false alarm) and I handed my tea to WPC in a van full of envious male colleagues. Ah well...stud is as stud does...
Doughnut shops are not big in the UK...so I don't know where "coppers" go when they're loafing...
:D

david.margrave
August 28th, 2007, 01:11 AM
Quote From that article
Federal regulations allow food labels to say they've got zero grams of trans fat, provided levels fall below the half-gram threshold.


You're right, and then they manipulate the other variables, like serving size & servings per container, so they come up with <0.5g trans fat, and then they can call it zero.

scyfreestyler
August 28th, 2007, 03:48 PM
Is that sub half gram of trans fat going to do you in? Probably no more than the butter you put on your bread.

3strokes
August 28th, 2007, 05:01 PM
Is that sub half gram of trans fat going to do you in? Probably no more than the butter you put on your bread.

If it's 0.499 grams per serving and their understanding of a serving is a nano-nibble per quarter pretzel, and you eath three pretzels, then
it's 0.499 x 4 x a nano (or 1 000 000 000) = 1 996 000 000 grams
that's 1 996 000 kilograms (nearly 2,000 metric tons of trans-fat) per pretzel.
That will do anybody in.
:bump:

scyfreestyler
August 28th, 2007, 05:12 PM
If it's 0.499 grams per serving and their understanding of a serving is a nano-nibble per quarter pretzel, and you eath three pretzels, then
it's 0.499 x 4 x a nano (or 1 000 000 000) = 1 996 000 000 grams
that's 1 996 000 kilograms (nearly 2,000 metric tons of trans-fat) per pretzel.
That will do anybody in.
:bump:
That sounds illegal.

geochuck
February 18th, 2008, 06:56 PM
My favorite food - I found a great picture. Here it is full sized http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:OriginalPoutineLaBanquise.jpg

PArob83
February 19th, 2008, 09:24 AM
And i bet then people will start pinning " " "trans fats" " " as the cause for all the worlds ills... Id make a list but I really dont want to stir this too much... lol:censor:
Anyway off to burger king for a 5pattie double cheese whopper....
either way my suit still fits.

3strokes
February 19th, 2008, 08:51 PM
And i bet then people will start pinning " " "trans fats" " " as the cause for all the worlds ills... Id make a list but I really dont want to stir this too much... lol:censor:


It is a very well-known fact that Saddam Hussein had a lot of trans-fats hidden in the desert (or was that "dessert"?).

geochuck
February 19th, 2008, 08:53 PM
3strokes I sent you personal mail.