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Thursday w/Speedo, Sept. 9

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by , September 9th, 2010 at 05:26 PM (3564 Views)
I hauled my unrefreshed, allergy addled, geriatric feeling (Jimslie) body to the pool for a lunchtime swim with Speedo. We did the following:

Swim/SCY @ Oak Marr:

Warm up:

800 various

8 x 25 shooters w/fins

Kick Set:

Pete and I did a portion of a kick workout we did frequently last year. I thought it was 5 x 200 kick, but it was 6. I took a nature break and did an easy 100 during #6, as I wasn't expecting it. My times were faster than I expected.

5 x 200 backstroke kick, no fins @ 3:30

I cruised #1, and immediately cramped. (I fear my allergy meds are causing dehydration.)

Then I went: 2:56, 2:53, 2:52, 2:51.

I looked back at a couple of my previous sets. I usually cruise #1-2 and then go.

On 2/4, I went 2:56, 2:53, 2:56, 2:51
On 12/28, I went 2:59, 2:56, 2:55, 2:53

So today's set was a slight improvement over last time. I didn't kill the SDKs. I took 8+ on the first 25 and then 6 (usually) thereafter.

100 EZ

20 x 50 Petra Paddle Drill Set @ :45

Extra :15 between sets of 5 to switch paddles
I left my fins on to float my shoulders, which are still sore, but didn't kick much.

1-5 w/strokemaker paddles (I don't use Pete's he man version)
6-10 reverse paddle drill
11-20 swim (I joined Pete in ditching the paddles)

The last 5 I tried to pick up the pace and went high 30s, breathing every stroke.

200 EZ

Total: 3300

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Commentary:

It was great to swim with Pete again today and we mulled over a number of topics such as:

1. If fins increase your leg strength and endurance, do paddles increase you shoulder strength and endurance? And is that why Petra (Mason sprint coach) is obsessed with them?

2. What nickname is Geek going to come up with to ride Pete about Gaga?

3. Why do Mrs. Speedo and I so get irked when our children or spouses eat something before dinner or fail to eat the delicious food we make them?

4. How much dryland work is sufficient? Pete is considering cutting back to 2x per week. I am thinking my sessions are too long and that I can't recover quickly enough. I perused my last 80 minute session and see that I started off with 3 x 75 med ball slams and 75 push ups before I even hit the weight room ...

5. Life would be infinitely improved if we could have a daily massage.

6. Pete needs to keep taking his 100 back out fast to keep putting up stellar times. I need to do this as well (I did it, finally, in Atlanta) and not die the last 15 yards.

7. Pete and I agreed that "that perfect blend of caring and not caring" (from Andre Agassi's autobiography) produces the best meet prep and results.

8. Petra really likes to train her sprinters with hypoxic freestyle. Pete likes oxygen. And, despite my love of underwater dolphin work, I insist on breathing every stroke in freestyle, except during a race or timed swim. I just don't buy those 3-5-7 breathing sets, so refuse to do them.

Tomorrow, I am going to haul myself out to Mason to swim in a cool pool and do some aerobic set. Trying to decide whether to swim in regular suit, B70 or wetsuit. I saw a couple tris using full sleeve wetsuits today at Oak Marr. No idea how they do that when the pool is 84 degrees ...

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Categories
Swim Workouts , Test Sets

Comments

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  1. qbrain's Avatar
    4. I am experimenting with twice a week this season and I will probably go crazy in the gym for 3 months afterward. 3x/week heavy was hurting my water workouts.

    8. I ignore all hypoxic sets, the focus is on the wrong thing. You can decrease your stroke and breath count per length by having good walls which results in faster speeds, so that obviously is a better place to focus "breath control". Breathing every 7th is once per length, so how slow do I have to swim to be able to maintain that on a typical breath control set? DUMB.
  2. jim thornton's Avatar
    I don't think swimming with a B70 is good for you, despite what some claim about it teaching you the right body position, etc.

    I think it will only put you in a position where the micromuscles you are training will not be the ones you will be using in actual competition.

    I am glad you and Pete get to work out together.

    2 x dry lands are more than enough, in my view.
  3. Chris Stevenson's Avatar
    1. Yes, I think so. (Well, I don't know if it is just *shoulders")

    4. It is good to experiment some, but I would be worried with only 2X per week. I have also wondered if your drylands are too long. Bottom line: they supplement water training, they shouldn't be the main focus (if you want to swim fast, that is).

    8. I am marginal on "non-functional" hypoxic sets: sets that don't mimic what you might do in a race. Who ever breathes every 7 in a race? I'm with QB on this one. That said, if a coach gives me one of those sets occasionally, I take it as an opportunity to recover and work on stroke efficiency. But too much of it would be irksome to me.
  4. pwb's Avatar
    5. Oh, yeah. If I ever win the Powerball, after chucking my job, I'm hiring a full-time masseuse!

    4. 2x is sufficient, but I'm going to go to 3x in a few weeks because my strength is insufficient.

    8. The more I think and play around with breathing, the more I think more is better. Having said that, I will also work on my underwater SDK and hence holding my breath to see if that can get me under 48 seconds in the 100.
  5. The Fortress's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by qbrain
    4. I am experimenting with twice a week this season and I will probably go crazy in the gym for 3 months afterward. 3x/week heavy was hurting my water workouts.

    8. I ignore all hypoxic sets, the focus is on the wrong thing. You can decrease your stroke and breath count per length by having good walls which results in faster speeds, so that obviously is a better place to focus "breath control". Breathing every 7th is once per length, so how slow do I have to swim to be able to maintain that on a typical breath control set? DUMB.
    Go crazy for 3 months after your next taper meet or next summer after short course season is over.

    Totally agree on #8. I'd much rather count my SDKs and then take in oxygen.
  6. The Fortress's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by jim thornton
    I don't think swimming with a B70 is good for you, despite what some claim about it teaching you the right body position, etc.

    I think it will only put you in a position where the micromuscles you are training will not be the ones you will be using in actual competition.

    I am glad you and Pete get to work out together.

    2 x dry lands are more than enough, in my view.
    I was thinking of swimming in the B70 b/c it might be too hot to swim in my wetsuit even at Mason. So it would be a poor mimic of the wetsuit float. I'm only thinking of my OW swim at the moment wrt the B70.

    I don't think 2x a week is ideal for sprinters. it may perhaps work for others though.
  7. The Fortress's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Stevenson

    4. It is good to experiment some, but I would be worried with only 2X per week. I have also wondered if your drylands are too long. Bottom line: they supplement water training, they shouldn't be the main focus (if you want to swim fast, that is).

    8. I am marginal on "non-functional" hypoxic sets: sets that don't mimic what you might do in a race. Who ever breathes every 7 in a race? I'm with QB on this one. That said, if a coach gives me one of those sets occasionally, I take it as an opportunity to recover and work on stroke efficiency. But too much of it would be irksome to me.
    Do you use paddles much though? I don't seem to recall reading about them too much in your blog.

    I am leaning toward thinking my dryland sessions are too long. I think I need to do about 50 minutes to not cause undue soreness and diminish my water workouts. But, honestly, there are so many different types of drylands I like to do that I'm not sure what to focus on ... And, actually, once I get going, I just keep going ... then pay the price later. But I do want to keep drylands at a minimum of 3, no less, so may have to focus and shorten. I love compound exercises, so perhaps I should focus on those with some core and trad strength sets. And I can't decide if I should do some trad strength exercises every time I do drylands or focus on that once a week. Can't decide really. I have no idea how some folks like JimRude do P90X every day and still swim.

    I'm quite rude. When Cheryl assigns those hypoxic freestyle sets, I just laugh and breathe every stroke. "Its masters." And she doesn't mind.
    Updated September 9th, 2010 at 08:37 PM by The Fortress
  8. The Fortress's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by pwb
    5. Oh, yeah. If I ever win the Powerball, after chucking my job, I'm hiring a full-time masseuse!

    4. 2x is sufficient, but I'm going to go to 3x in a few weeks because my strength is insufficient.

    8. The more I think and play around with breathing, the more I think more is better. Having said that, I will also work on my underwater SDK and hence holding my breath to see if that can get me under 48 seconds in the 100.
    If you want to build strength, which is where I was at two years ago as a weak sprinter, 2x seems too little. And you're still doing bodyweight exercises. You could probably stand to add some weight to some of those squats and lunges if you want to get ferocious.

    My calves feel like they are dying for a masseuse. I am stuck with my foam roller tonight ... Poor substitute.
  9. Chris Stevenson's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by The Fortress
    Do you use paddles much though? I don't seem to recall reading about them too much in your blog.
    Once the season seriously gets underway, maybe 1-3 times per week.
  10. jim thornton's Avatar
    Leslie, it was recommended to me for my sore back to get a foam roller. What is this gizmo, and is it something you can use on your own, or do you need the aforementioned masseuse?

    PS this is comment #2. I am still patiently awaiting comment #1, dearest mither.
  11. jim thornton's Avatar
    [nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aOpnaplkmXU"]YouTube - Foam Roller Exercises for Your Lower Back and Lumbar Spine[/nomedia]

    Okay, I think I can afford the foam roller.

    I don't think I can afford the location where you need to use it for maximum meditative relief.
  12. The Fortress's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by jim thornton
    Leslie, it was recommended to me for my sore back to get a foam roller. What is this gizmo, and is it something you can use on your own, or do you need the aforementioned masseuse?

    PS this is comment #2. I am still patiently awaiting comment #1, dearest mither.
    I was watching a movie with my actual mither who is back for a week visit.

    I have a foam roller. It is nice for sore backs and quads and hips. You do not need a masseuse, as you can see from the vid, but it is not as effective.
  13. The Fortress's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by jim thornton
    PS this is comment #2. I am still patiently awaiting comment #1, dearest mither.
    I just checked your vlog, and there were so many comments, I was overwhelmed and must read in the am hours.

    Your cult like following is still hypnotized. I still can't quite believe Swimshark is a member of the cult though ...

    Bzaks likely will be suicidal if you don't go to Indy. So I hope your prediction of a 98% likelihood of appearing is accurate.
  14. Jazz Hands's Avatar
    1. Swimmers tend to have shoulder injuries more often than knee/ankle/hip injuries, no? You have to be more careful with paddles.

    4. You know what I'm going to say about 215 throws and 75 push-ups, right? (Rhymes with "top hat") You need to be more goal oriented with dryland. 2x or 3x or whatever really isn't the point at all. It's whether you are getting stronger. Don't listen to Jim on this subject, obvi; he's clueless. Just focus.

    6. I finally put together a decent back-half to a 100 free in Atlanta (23.9/25.5). Far more enjoyable to do it that way, in my opinion. I don't like dying at the end of anything. That's why I do 50s.

    8. Those are the worst sets ever. I always got headaches. I lose a little respect for any coach who assigns that crap.
  15. The Fortress's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Jazz Hands
    4. You know what I'm going to say about 215 throws and 75 push-ups, right? (Rhymes with "top hat") You need to be more goal oriented with dryland. 2x or 3x or whatever really isn't the point at all. It's whether you are getting stronger. Don't listen to Jim on this subject, obvi; he's clueless. Just focus.
    What do you think I should focus on? Back to basics after a summer off from drylands? Give me a sample workout or two.

    Are you sure med ball work isn't making me stronger? Rich A. seems to do pretty well with the med ball game.
    Updated September 10th, 2010 at 08:24 AM by The Fortress
  16. Speedo's Avatar
    I agree that the 3-5-7 breathing is not something to do during a main set- I've usually been assigned it during a short recovery set, or a break between more intense sets. Of course, it doesn't allow you to recover fully.
  17. qbrain's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by The Fortress
    Go crazy for 3 months after your next taper meet or next summer after short course season is over.
    Nov-Jan I think. Who knows, I just fumble through my swimming life clueless except for baiting Geek.
  18. Jazz Hands's Avatar
    Note that what I'm about to say is hypocritical. I definitely don't always follow this advice. It's still important

    Quote Originally Posted by The Fortress
    What do you think I should focus on? Back to basics after a summer off from drylands? Give me a sample workout or two.

    Are you sure med ball work isn't making me stronger? Rich A. seems to do pretty well with the med ball game.
    I don't think it's about the workouts themselves, but where they come from.

    What attributes would you like to develop this season? What are your weaknesses? Pick them out and work on them. Yes, this does sometimes mean at the expense of hammering away at your strengths.

    You only have a certain amount of training time and energy, so there's an opportunity cost on every workout you do. Every workout needs to be useful to you, either:

    1. Maintaining something you're strong at (by doing pretty much what you've done before)
    2. Improving something you're weak at (by doing something completely different)

    For example, I can tell by your training the last few years that you are likely to be strong at underwater dolphin kicking and general abdominal strength/endurance. Those seem to be your first priority in pool and dryland workouts, respectively. Keep doing them, but be prepared to de-emphasize them a little if you need to.

    Identify a weakness and make that your obsession. You've been doing more explosive stuff recently. All of those box jumps should have had some kind of effect by now, right? Now you're doing the med ball stuff. Can I assume this is also for explosiveness, but in the upper body? Again, figure out what you're maintaining and what you're improving.
  19. qbrain's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by The Fortress
    Are you sure med ball work isn't making me stronger? Rich A. seems to do pretty well with the med ball game.
    I think the med ball game and other slams are more intense than typical med ball routines and it is safer to use explosive force with medicine balls compared to weights.

    What is hard to measure with medicine balls vs weights is how hard you are actually working. The faster you go with the medicine ball, the more power and there is probably some correlation between power and strength.

    Weights are probably better for people who might just go through the motions of a workout. This is probably not the case for you.
  20. aquageek's Avatar
    1. If fins increase your leg strength and endurance, do paddles increase you shoulder strength and endurance? And is that why Petra (Mason sprint coach) is obsessed with them?

    I've almost completely sworn off paddles. For me, they are a crutch, cruisetastic. I think if you want to make paddles work they either need to be part of a drill oriented set or a speed set. Otherwise, I just toss them on and recover. They are kind of like running on a treadmill.

    2. What nickname is Geek going to come up with to ride Pete about Gaga?

    I can't come up with anything. I'm in awe of his swimming so I can't poke too much fun at him. Now, if he admits to listening to it in the car with no family around then it might change my tune.


    3. Why do Mrs. Speedo and I so get irked when our children or spouses eat something before dinner or fail to eat the delicious food we make them?

    Lock the pantry or be a terrible cook.

    5. Life would be infinitely improved if we could have a daily massage.

    And a bag of flamin' hot Cheetos.


    7. Pete and I agreed that "that perfect blend of caring and not caring" (from Andre Agassi's autobiography) produces the best meet prep and results.

    I love this quote. It makes sense.


    8. Petra really likes to train her sprinters with hypoxic freestyle. Pete likes oxygen. And, despite my love of underwater dolphin work, I insist on breathing every stroke in freestyle, except during a race or timed swim. I just don't buy those 3-5-7 breathing sets, so refuse to do them.

    I don't know the value of a lot of the sets I do with our various coaches. Some I enjoy, some I don't. I do know I love hypoxic sets and that is good enough for me, especially with fins, a nose clip and on the back.

    The sets that I know have the greatest value are the ones that hurt the most. 5 X 100 @ 5:00 is the prime example. That set makes my bowels quiver.
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