Welcome, Zulu! You have come to the right place! In The Breaststroke Lane, you will find like-minded frogs who won't tease you about breaststroke being the slowest stroke,Originally Posted by Zulu
Speaking of frogs, go back to the beginning of this thread and look for any posts with a frog avatar. That's Allen Stark, the king of breaststroke in these forums.He not only gave great tips on this thread; he watched my breaststroke events at Nationals and gave me immediate feedback and excellent advice. As a result, my times have improved a lot, since joining USMS, in February. And, I hadn't competed since high school, back in 1979.
Another recommendation: Go to www.goswim.tv and watch the video clips on that website. Great stuff! Also search You Tube for videos of races by the best breaststrokers, so you can see how the stroke has changed over the years.
Good luck with your comeback!
Cheers!
http://ElaineiaKsTravels.wordpress.com
~ Believing in your dreams can be far more rewarding than living by your limitations ~Karla Peterson
I have been watching the variations in the pulls of the swimmers at Pan Pacs.Soni for instance is relatively narrow with little insweep whereas Kitajima is relatively wide.At Atlanta I got a velocity analysis and I was losing momentum by setting up my catch too wide.Now I am bringing my hand just slightly wider than my elbows and really focusing on getting my elbows close together in the recovery for better streamlining.Try various things with your pull to see what works best for YOU.
"To strive,to seek,to find,and not to yield" Tennyson
Allen
Well, as you know, with my past shoulder problems and surgery, I've had no other choice but to listen to your advice and my part-time coach's advice and go with a narrower pull. Saving my shoulders for the long haul is much more important than getting faster times. And, having a narrower pull (like Rebecca Soni) definitely puts less stress on the shoulders. Same goes for a low profile recovery on fly (like Michael Phelps) and a 10:00/2:00 backstroke (like Natalie Caughlin). For freestyle, I'll go with Lochte rather than Janet Evans!
http://ElaineiaKsTravels.wordpress.com
~ Believing in your dreams can be far more rewarding than living by your limitations ~Karla Peterson
Elaine asked me about drills so I thought I'd dispense some,especially shoulder friendly ones
1)Ultra-slow BR with snorkel.It is self explanatory.The Snorkel means you don't have to worry about your head and can focus on every other aspect of your stroke.This is also good as part of the warm up.
2)The 2 inch BR kick(with snorkel or kick board.)Do the BR kick catch ,focusing on getting your feet as close to your rear as possible and turned out as far as possible.Then kick back only 2 inches so you can do the catch again.This is good for helping get the feel of the catch and working on ankle flexibility.
3)Straight leg BR kick.This one is tricky.With a snorkel or kick board swim using only the ankle snap.Turn your ankles as far out as you can and then snap them together.This helps get a better feel for the water with your feet and also helps with flexibility.It also strengthens the muscles in the front of your calves.
"To strive,to seek,to find,and not to yield" Tennyson
Allen
Thanks for the links. I'm going to try to include many of these drills in my practice sessions. For now, I'm swimming on my own. I hope to find a team with a coach where I can swim soon. I'm trying to get in 4-5 practices a week and I shoot for 2500-3000m per session.
I vary my workouts but I try to get as much breaststroke as I can at each session. Probably 3/4 of my sets involve breaststroke. I'm also working on my backstroke...and I throw in IM sets.
When I swam way back when, I was competitive, but I wasn't given much breaststroke technique. Brute force I guess. Sorta ticks me off that I didn't get better coaching. I've learned so much from watching the kids at clinics and practices.
My goal is to build my swimming endurance while trying to involve all the lessons.
There aren't many meets around here, but I'm on the look out.
Here are some more drills.If this isn't useful let me know and I'll stop posting them.If anyone else wants to post drill they find useful I'd love it.These are drills to eliminate dead spots in your pull.
1)Head up BR pull.If you have dead spots your face gets wet.This is also a good hand speed drill.WARNING:it can be hard on the shoulders so be careful.
2)Underwater BR.With water all around you it is easier to feel you arms(and body.)
3)Fast flutterkick with fins with slow BR pull.Similar to swimming underwater it lets you get a better feel for the resistance from your arms and shoulders.
4)Full stroke BR with hand paddles without using the straps.If you have dead spots ,they fall off.This can also be hard on the shoulders.
The big thing to make sure of is that there is no hesitation between pull and recovery,especially don't get caught in the "prayer position."
"To strive,to seek,to find,and not to yield" Tennyson
Allen
[QUOTE=Allen Stark;224126]Here are some more drills.If this isn't useful let me know and I'll stop posting them.[QUOTE]
Keep posting them, Allen!I appreciate it very much; especially the shoulder warnings, so I know which ones to be careful doing. I will do those sparingly...
Zulu: I can relate! The only competition I did until this past March was in high school, 1977-1979. My "coach" was a non-swimmer PE teacher, so the first real coaching I received was right here in The Breaststroke Lane, by Allen.
I'm in the same situation; swimming 5 x week, but I've backed off the yardage from around 3,000 to around 2,500 each time, because of my shoulders. It was trial and error for the first few months of swimming with USMS, trying to figure out how much swimming and cross-training my body (and past surgeries) could handle. Listen to your body, Zulu, so you can stay out of trouble and stick around for the long haul- if that's your goal. It is mine!
http://ElaineiaKsTravels.wordpress.com
~ Believing in your dreams can be far more rewarding than living by your limitations ~Karla Peterson
No way -- please keep them coming, especially if there's some way to teach me to keep my head from popping up.
Hmm, never thought to use this with a slow pull as our AG program uses this as a way to promote fast hands and a strong 'pop' of the arms forward.
The standard drill for that is the tennis ball under the chin drill.I don't like it as it puts my neck in an unnatural position and under tension.What I do is take my center mount snorkel and turn the tube around so the mouthpiece points the wrong way.Then I put it on upside down and backwards so the long end goes down my back.Then if I lift my head is rubs against my back.No way -- please keep them coming, especially if there's some way to teach me to keep my head from popping up.
"To strive,to seek,to find,and not to yield" Tennyson
Allen
This is probably my favorite drill.It isn't even so much a drill as an important part of my sprint workout.
25s sprint eggbeater kick.I do them with snorkel,but you can use a kick board.I find them easier on my knees than regular BR kick.They are great for improving foot speed,give your quads an amazing burn,and since form isn't as important while doing them as it is with full stroke you can really do them to fatigue(feeling like your legs will fall off.) As to the interval,that depends on your speed and pain tolerance.I generally go on the minute or the 45 but sometimes on the 30,depending on how I feel and how close to a meet I am(don't do them on the 30 during the week before a meet if you care about the meet.)Important safety tip,do some recovery swimming after them before any other hard sets or your hamstrings will cramp up(at least mine do.)
"To strive,to seek,to find,and not to yield" Tennyson
Allen
Here is the next drill.
The lane line drill.-Standing in shallow water,bend forward over the lane line so it is resting under your armpits.Now do your pull.
This trains you to keep your elbows in front of ,or even with your shoulders throughout the pull.
"To strive,to seek,to find,and not to yield" Tennyson
Allen
Sounds good, but you wouldn't be moving due to the lane line being stationary. I wonder if it would have the same effect if you swam using a ... *gasp* ... noodle under your armpits?
I can't remember a life before Google.
Fortunately, I can Google it.
Oh, no, Jim! Enough people look down on us and now you want us to be subject to more derision by using the most-hated accessory?!?!?!?!
If you you are alone in the pool you may use a noodle,but if someone sees you you must say"uh,it's not mine,I was holding it for a friend."
Seriously,a noodle is OK (if you can stand the derision,)but,perhaps I was unclear,stay standing leaning forward on the line so your feet hold you in one place.
"To strive,to seek,to find,and not to yield" Tennyson
Allen
hi guys,
can someone help me to identify deficiencies noticed on video? I would appreciate any comment or advice for improvement.
thanks
and by the way, I swim in lane 7
swimming 1,5 year after a 18 years of break
now 36 :-)
thanks
take care
[nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0DBNCyPWhpo"]YouTube- 50P Martin Hlavatý 31,21 (5.)[/nomedia]
Noodle???But, seriously, I couldn't do this drill at our pool, because the Noodlers ripped the lane line right out of the wall of the pool, because they were hanging on it for their noodling classes. It resulted in a big bill for the HOA for repairs AND the pool being closed for two weeks.
So, the new rule: Nobody "disturbs the lane lines" or you break you pay.
http://ElaineiaKsTravels.wordpress.com
~ Believing in your dreams can be far more rewarding than living by your limitations ~Karla Peterson
Good pull,good rhythm.Two things I noticed.First on your breakout you start your pull too late and therefore lose momentum.Second,you are bending at the hips too much and too soon in your kick recovery which is greatly increasing your drag.You also finish the kick with your feet fairly deep.I'd suggest you practice recovery by bending at the knees only.A good drill for that is BR kicking vertically holding on to the wall with your chest against the wall so that if you bend at the hips you bonk your knees.
"To strive,to seek,to find,and not to yield" Tennyson
Allen
Another drill,this one an easy seeming one.Simply swim a length using the minimum number of strokes.REALLY work on streamlining at all times,but especially on the pull out and after each kick.The pullout part is especially important do those of you with a slow BR.For many swimmers the best way to swim BR is to do as little actual swimming as possible so for yhou the longer the pullout the better.Can you get it down to pullout plus 3 strokes for 25?2? 1?.0?1 stroke after pullout is as good as I can do in a 25 yd pool.
This is a real awareness drill.As you are slowing down really focus on maximum streamlining.
"To strive,to seek,to find,and not to yield" Tennyson
Allen
Ande, are you out there? Remember your demonstration in the warm-up pool? You showed me what you mean by "Ride the Glide", by demonstrating your breaststroke. You made the 25 yards in one stroke after the pullout!.
Allen, this drill rocks! After Nationals, I really started working on it; especially after you and I talked about my events. I do this drill in EVERY warm-up now!
http://ElaineiaKsTravels.wordpress.com
~ Believing in your dreams can be far more rewarding than living by your limitations ~Karla Peterson
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