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Thread: The Sprint Free Lane

  1. #81
    Very Active Member aztimm's Avatar
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    Re: The Sprint Free Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by shannalee80 View Post
    I bet there is some insurance reason why there isn't usually any diving block training available during masters swimming.
    I can't remember the last time I've swum at a masters practice when the coach specifically said that using blocks wasn't allowed. Nearly every masters team I've ever swum with has blocks available.
    Now getting swimmers to actually use the blocks is the problem. The coach usually has to coax them (and me) out of the pool, especially when it is cold outside.

    Even when I swim at a local city pool during lap swim that has blocks, I've nicely asked the lifeguards, and been able to use them.
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    Very Active Member __steve__'s Avatar
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    Breakout, a Convenient Time to Breath?

    Does anyone sneak a breath on first stroke at breakout from the block?

    I tried it yesterday and found it doesn't really slow me down compared to my breakout without breathing. When I breakout, I pop up high enough to take a full breath, and it seems to be a waste not to take advantage of it, even if it seems early.

  3. #83
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    Re: Breakout, a Convenient Time to Breath?

    Quote Originally Posted by __steve__ View Post
    Does anyone sneak a breath on first stroke at breakout from the block?
    Never.

    Most of my 50 frees are done no breath. One is the maximum I have ever taken and it has always been 3-4 strokes after the turn breakout in the 50.

  4. #84
    Very Active Member __steve__'s Avatar
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    Re: The Sprint Free Lane

    I have to breathe. Imagine doing a 60 lcm. That would be equivalent to the required air, duration and effort as my50

  5. #85
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    Re: The Sprint Free Lane

    Well in a 100 I breathe every 4th stroke, but never on a breakout because they are critical for the transition from streamline to swimming. If you breathe out of the breakout, it takes an extra stroke or two to get the transition complete... and you're not getting full stroke efficiency in a breakout so why would you want any more strokes than required in this phase?

    My breakouts are all power and can be somewhat violent. There is just no time for a breath there with everything else that happens in transition. I suspect that if you're finding there's no difference, perhaps you have weak breakouts and have found something to address with your sprints?

  6. #86
    Very Active Member __steve__'s Avatar
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    Re: The Sprint Free Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by fmracing View Post
    perhaps you have weak breakouts and have found something to address with your sprints?
    I will investigate

    During breakout I pop out high enough for breathing to be less significant and thought it to be convenient to breathe. Maybe not and your on to something
    Last edited by __steve__; August 31st, 2012 at 07:43 PM.

  7. #87
    Very Active Member Allen Stark's Avatar
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    Re: The Sprint Free Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by __steve__ View Post
    I will investigate

    During breakout I pop out high enough for breathing to be less significant and thought it to be convenient to breathe. Maybe not and your on to something
    Maybe the popping out high is a problem.Ant time you are coming up something must be going down and you are breaking streamline.It sounds like you are coming up at too steep an angle.
    "To strive,to seek,to find,and not to yield" Tennyson
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  8. #88
    Very Active Member __steve__'s Avatar
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    Re: The Sprint Free Lane

    I need to work on that area, especially with turns. The words "breaking streamline" is exactly what I recently noticed was happening on the 1st stroke off the walls. I think it's an old habit I've never looked at before. I should probably get more air prior to the turn and hold more of it, to keep it together just after.

    Thanks more making this click

  9. #89
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    Re: Breakout, a Convenient Time to Breath?

    Quote Originally Posted by __steve__ View Post
    Does anyone sneak a breath on first stroke at breakout from the block?

    I tried it yesterday and found it doesn't really slow me down compared to my breakout without breathing. When I breakout, I pop up high enough to take a full breath, and it seems to be a waste not to take advantage of it, even if it seems early.
    in a 50? in a 100?
    this is the SPRINT FREESTYLE LANE not the demented D dude dungeon

    It's a BAD idea to breathe on your first stroke off the dive. It's not necessary and it's an error that will add time to your possible best time.

    Have a breathing plan for your 50's & 100,
    you don't need any to many breaths in a 50
    Have a breath plan or breathing zones.
    0 breath, as you dive in and after you touch
    1 breath, breathe around 40 meters done 10 to go
    2 breaths, breathe around 25 meters and 40 meters
    3 breaths, 20, 30, 40


    Experiment:
    Do several free fierce fast 15 meter sprints for time
    one with no breath followed by a few minutes REST
    then another breathing on your 1st stroke
    Repeat several times see if a pattern emerges
    What's the difference?

    I believe the diff will be one two or a few tenths slower than no breath

  10. #90
    Very Active Member __steve__'s Avatar
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    Re: The Sprint Free Lane

    At 3:29 it appears Maksym Veraksa (on right) took a breath on first stroke (and possibly another near 35M) for S12 50M final. Not defending the method, but it worked for him since he has the WR and I thought it was interesting.

    [nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mEbBMfueta0"]2012 London Paralympic Games - 50 Freestyle - YouTube[/nomedia]
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Breathe.png 
Views:	21 
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ID:	3616  
    Last edited by __steve__; October 1st, 2012 at 10:08 AM.

  11. #91
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    Re: The Sprint Free Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by __steve__ View Post
    but it worked for him since he has the WR
    ...Which likely could've been set faster without taking a breath on the breakout.

  12. #92
    Very Active Member __steve__'s Avatar
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    Re: The Sprint Free Lane

    Perhaps he knew he had it bagged and didn't wan't to push since he already has the record.

    I did a test and the breath costs me 0.1 - 0.2 when taken at breakout for 25m. I'll have to do another test to see how much a midswim breath hurts me, figure how many for each course I need to optimize my time then decide from there.

    What I REALLY need to work on before anything is my streamline into the water and off wall (if any). Those are killing me. Unfortunately I can't hold my hands classic style, locked in a stacked fashion because the angle it places on my trick shoulder. I have to lock my thumbs holding my hands side by side which is OK, but many times the hands dig in or out and ruin the swim. Eventually I'll get a surgeon to fix.

  13. #93
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    Re: The Sprint Free Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by __steve__ View Post
    Perhaps he knew he had it bagged and didn't wan't to push since he already has the record.
    Not taking a breath on the first stroke of the 50 is "pushing" it ?

    In a serious 50 free race, there's no room at all to NOT push it. There is no time for rest. No extra padding for purposeful mistakes.

  14. #94
    Very Active Member __steve__'s Avatar
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    Re: The Sprint Free Lane

    What is the method for requesting a split of a greater distance event ? I understand it must be submitted in writing to the referee, but is that it?

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    Re: The Sprint Free Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by __steve__ View Post
    What is the method for requesting a split of a greater distance event ? I understand it must be submitted in writing to the referee, but is that it?
    Ah yes, the 50 free with a 450 cooldown. The perfect way to get those weird distance people all upset about their own inadequecies.

  16. #96
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    Re: The Sprint Free Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by __steve__ View Post
    What is the method for requesting a split of a greater distance event ? I understand it must be submitted in writing to the referee, but is that it?
    Page 143 of the Rule Book http://www.usms.org/rules/appb.pdf
    Last edited by That Guy; October 3rd, 2012 at 12:49 PM.
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  17. #97
    Very Active Member __steve__'s Avatar
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    Re: The Sprint Free Lane

    Thanks That,

    MS 2.7.2 just states that it needs to be in writing to ref beforehand, thats it ?

    Page142 is altitude adjust table

  18. #98
    Moderator Rob Copeland's Avatar
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    Re: The Sprint Free Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by __steve__ View Post
    MS 2.7.2 just states that it needs to be in writing to ref beforehand, thats it ?
    No. See 103.18.1(B), 105.2.2 and 105.3.6 in http://www.usms.org/rules/part1.pdf

  19. #99
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    Re: The Sprint Free Lane

    All this talk of splits represents too much talk about distance events in the sprint free lane.

  20. #100
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    Re: The Sprint Free Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by fmracing View Post
    All this talk of splits represents too much talk about distance events in the sprint free lane.
    I would enter a 500 if it gave me a second opportunity to get a PB in a 50, even if it means I must swim nonstop for an entire 7 minutes without a Jacuzzi break.

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