Page 5 of 20 FirstFirst 12345678915 ... LastLast
Results 81 to 100 of 390

Thread: The Backstroke Lane

  1. #81
    Very Active Member Swimosaur's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Knoxville, TN
    Posts
    557

    Re: The Backstroke Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by Swimosaur View Post
    Breathing: Once per cycle, or twice per cycle (on every stroke)?

    Why or why not?

    Does it matter?
    From thread "Swim Myth #7.....busted" ...

    Quote Originally Posted by GaryHallSr View Post
    ... during maximal exertion, even breathing at about our maximal rate (50 to 60 respirations per minute) we do not get enough oxygen. That is called oxygen debt and is why we keep breathing like we are exercising long after the exercise is over.
    Cardiac output is also one of the limiting factors in getting oxygen to the muscle, as are several others, but breathing less certainly does not help.
    BTW, you should try inhaling on every arm stroke in backstroke. You might go faster.
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Stevenson View Post
    ... I also have a breathing pattern in backstroke ... I breathe every other stroke, inhaling when my right arm is recovering.
    The jury is out.

    Another breathing metric I like, in addition to breathing pattern, is number of breaths per length. I have difficulty swimming SCY freestyle for very long if I don't get at least six breaths per length, and I much prefer seven or eight. The number of breaths per length is a limiting factor for me in freestyle events 200 & longer. (It is also a limiting factor for me in butterfly and breaststroke, on the rare days I can swim either of them.)

    Backstroke is a little different in that there are longer breakouts and fewer strokes per length. Breathing once per cycle would put me below 7 breaths per length, and I don't think I could sustain that. Breathing twice per cycle puts me way over 8. I'm more comfortable there.

    Chris, breathing once per cycle, how many breaths per length do you take in a 100 or 200 SCY back?
    Last edited by Swimosaur; August 31st, 2010 at 02:34 PM.

  2. #82
    Very Active Member Chris Stevenson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Richmond, VA
    Posts
    3,999
    Blog Entries
    1217

    Re: The Backstroke Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by Swimosaur View Post
    Chris, breathing once per cycle, how many breaths per length do you take in a 100 or 200 SCY back?
    I don't count breaths per se, of course. But in a 100 race I take 10-11 kicks underwater and about 4 stroke cycles per length. I often taken an extra quick breath just before the flip, so that would be 5 breaths per lap.

    I am less sure in the 200. I take 6-7 kicks underwater but don't remember how many stroke cycles that equates to...maybe 6? I'll have to do a test run tomorrow in practice, if I remember.

  3. #83
    Very Active Member Redbird Alum's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Chillicothe, Illinois
    Posts
    861

    Re: The Backstroke Lane

    Okay, just for fun... on your start, do you whip the arms out and around prior to entry, or up and over?

    I've always gone around, as up and over tends to drive me too deep too early in the entry profile.

    What about the rest of you? Does anyone use a Breastroke recovery in the air?


  4. #84
    Very Active Member Chris Stevenson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Richmond, VA
    Posts
    3,999
    Blog Entries
    1217

    Re: The Backstroke Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Stevenson View Post
    I don't count breaths per se, of course. But in a 100 race I take 10-11 kicks underwater and about 4 stroke cycles per length. I often taken an extra quick breath just before the flip, so that would be 5 breaths per lap.

    I am less sure in the 200. I take 6-7 kicks underwater but don't remember how many stroke cycles that equates to...maybe 6? I'll have to do a test run tomorrow in practice, if I remember.
    Okay, I remembered that I have two swims on Floswimming (from Clovis nationals). The 100 back stroke count as I remembered it was pretty accurate. My stroke count (not cycles but individual pulls) for the 200 was: 6/9/9/10/10/11/11/11. So divide those numbers by 2, round up if necessary, and that is how many breaths I took for each lap.

    Quote Originally Posted by Redbird Alum View Post
    Okay, just for fun... on your start, do you whip the arms out and around prior to entry, or up and over?

    I've always gone around, as up and over tends to drive me too deep too early in the entry profile.

    What about the rest of you? Does anyone use a Breastroke recovery in the air?
    I think going over the top is more common. I fling my arms to the side, but my start isn't great.

  5. #85
    Very Active Member Redbird Alum's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Chillicothe, Illinois
    Posts
    861

    Re: The Backstroke Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Stevenson View Post
    ...
    I think going over the top is more common. I fling my arms to the side, but my start isn't great.
    Do you look up at the ceiling/sky, or do you tip your head until you see the other end of the pool and then align it just before entry?


  6. #86
    Very Active Member Chris Stevenson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Richmond, VA
    Posts
    3,999
    Blog Entries
    1217

    Re: The Backstroke Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by Redbird Alum View Post
    Do you look up at the ceiling/sky, or do you tip your head until you see the other end of the pool and then align it just before entry?
    Mostly up, tilted a little back.

  7. #87
    Very Active Member thewookiee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    2,760
    Blog Entries
    42

    Re: The Backstroke Lane

    Do any of the guys ever get beard burn on one shoulder but not the other? Today was the first time that I had gotten beard burn in a long time. What I found interesting was that I only got it on my left shoulder but not my right.

    Does this ever happen to any of you?

  8. #88
    Very Active Member Chris Stevenson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Richmond, VA
    Posts
    3,999
    Blog Entries
    1217

    Re: The Backstroke Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by thewookiee View Post
    Do any of the guys ever get beard burn on one shoulder but not the other? Today was the first time that I had gotten beard burn in a long time. What I found interesting was that I only got it on my left shoulder but not my right.

    Does this ever happen to any of you?
    YES! I noticed this exact thing this summer when I would do a backstroke-heavy LCM practice. It was quite noticeable too; my coach commented on it.

    (I haven't noticed it in short-course, though; I guess fewer strokes between walls...)

  9. #89
    Very Active Member thewookiee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    2,760
    Blog Entries
    42

    Re: The Backstroke Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Stevenson View Post
    YES! I noticed this exact thing this summer when I would do a backstroke-heavy LCM practice. It was quite noticeable too; my coach commented on it.

    (I haven't noticed it in short-course, though; I guess fewer strokes between walls...)
    I found it odd that I was getting it on one shoulder but not the other. It has me wondering if I am doing something differently with the mechanics.

  10. #90
    Very Active Member Redbird Alum's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Chillicothe, Illinois
    Posts
    861

    Re: The Backstroke Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by thewookiee View Post
    I found it odd that I was getting it on one shoulder but not the other. It has me wondering if I am doing something differently with the mechanics.
    Okay... which shoulder? And the obvious follow-up, are you left handed or right handed? (And this isn't just 5 o'clock shadow beard we are talking about, is it?)


  11. #91
    Very Active Member thewookiee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    2,760
    Blog Entries
    42

    Re: The Backstroke Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by Redbird Alum View Post
    Okay... which shoulder? And the obvious follow-up, are you left handed or right handed? (And this isn't just 5 o'clock shadow beard we are talking about, is it?)
    Left Shoulder. Right handed. Yea, it would be closer to 5 o'clock shadow at 6 am than a full beard. I would say about 5 day growth(insert smart alec comments here)

  12. #92
    Very Active Member thewookiee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    2,760
    Blog Entries
    42

    Re: The Backstroke Lane

    Gotta another question for the backstrokers. How many of you actually feel like you are rotating your hips from one side to another vs. feeling like you are sliding your hips from one side to another?


    Also, how many of you do to the wrist flip at the end of the pull? Where it looks like elites are flipping their wrist down quickly before the arm exits to start the recovery?

  13. #93
    Very Active Member orca1946's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    schaumburg, il
    Posts
    5,838

    Re: The Backstroke Lane

    Still trying the back to breast turn with poor timing so far

  14. #94
    Very Active Member Redbird Alum's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Chillicothe, Illinois
    Posts
    861

    Re: The Backstroke Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by thewookiee View Post
    Left Shoulder. Right handed. Yea, it would be closer to 5 o'clock shadow at 6 am than a full beard. I would say about 5 day growth(insert smart alec comments here)
    Okay... left shoulder is up and your right arm (strongest) is probably going deeper for the pull. I'm just guessing, but you're rotating more to the favored arm as it pulls, which (if you keep your head locked as we all are wont to do) would bring that left shoulder tighter to your chin.

    I'm a righty, and last evening I had to try not to overthink the why as I worked this out. Let me know what you think.


  15. #95
    Very Active Member Redbird Alum's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Chillicothe, Illinois
    Posts
    861

    Re: The Backstroke Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by thewookiee View Post
    Gotta another question for the backstrokers. How many of you actually feel like you are rotating your hips from one side to another vs. feeling like you are sliding your hips from one side to another?

    Also, how many of you do to the wrist flip at the end of the pull? Where it looks like elites are flipping their wrist down quickly before the arm exits to start the recovery?
    1. Definately rotate more than slide.

    2. I tend to flip the wrist in a meet, but not so much in practice. I've always been a believer in that last bit of scull helping to elongate the pull (and add a teeny push) and also to help lift the arm for recovery. No scientific data to back up the beleif, though.


  16. #96
    Very Active Member thewookiee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    2,760
    Blog Entries
    42

    Re: The Backstroke Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by Redbird Alum View Post
    Okay... left shoulder is up and your right arm (strongest) is probably going deeper for the pull. I'm just guessing, but you're rotating more to the favored arm as it pulls, which (if you keep your head locked as we all are wont to do) would bring that left shoulder tighter to your chin.

    I'm a righty, and last evening I had to try not to overthink the why as I worked this out. Let me know what you think.
    I think you maybe right on the "deeper pull' observation. I have been going more toward the right side of the lane lately. This morning, I focused on rolling more on the left side, which seemed to allow the pull to get a bit deeper. I stayed more centered in the lane as well.

    From time to time, I know that I have the tendency to let me head ride too high out of the water. I think that forces me to favor my strong side(right side), so I roll more to that side. Today, when I made sure my ears were submergered, letting just a small part of my face be above water, I had much better roll to both sides as well...easier too.


    Thanks for your comments! I appreciate them.

  17. #97
    Very Active Member moodyrichardson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Shelbyville, TN
    Posts
    234

    Re: The Backstroke Lane

    Questions for you guys. What are the official USMS rules for backstroking. Do you have to touch both feet on the turns, or if you just one?

    Also, I've been changing from a SCMl to SCY. I'm trying to get my stroke count down for the turn. What do you guys do, when it brings you too close to the wall take that last stroke, but if you don't take it, you are too far out?

    Thanks!

  18. #98
    Very Active Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    604
    Blog Entries
    74

    Re: The Backstroke Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by moodyrichardson View Post
    Also, I've been changing from a SCMl to SCY. I'm trying to get my stroke count down for the turn. What do you guys do, when it brings you too close to the wall take that last stroke, but if you don't take it, you are too far out?

    Thanks!
    For me, the SCM flags are pretty much exactly 4 strokes from the wall at race pace. In SCY the flags are like 3-and-a-bit strokes from the wall at race pace. I tend to pick up stroke rate a bit at the flags, decrease how hard I am pulling and take 4 shorter quicker strokes. I know there is still room for improvement though...

  19. #99
    Very Active Member Redbird Alum's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Chillicothe, Illinois
    Posts
    861

    Re: The Backstroke Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by moodyrichardson View Post
    Questions for you guys. What are the official USMS rules for backstroking. Do you have to touch both feet on the turns, or if you just one?
    ...!
    Actually, just "something" has to touch... here is the USMS backstroke turn rule...

    101.4.3 Turns—
    Upon completion of each length, some part of the swimmer must
    touch the wall. During the
    turn the shoulders may be turned past the vertical
    toward the breast, after which a continuous single arm pull or a continuous
    simultaneous double arm pull may be used to initiate the turn. Once the
    body

    has left the position on the back, any
    kick or arm pull must be part of the
    continuous turning action. The swimmer must have returned to a position
    on the back upon leaving the wall.

    Note:
    The swimmer who turns past vertical and, in a continuous motion,

    grabs the wall before pushing off with the feet while on the back is consid
    ered

    to have executed a “continuous turning action.”

    Of course, bashing the end with some parts might be uncomfortable!


  20. #100
    Very Active Member moodyrichardson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Shelbyville, TN
    Posts
    234

    Re: The Backstroke Lane

    Quote Originally Posted by Redbird Alum View Post
    Actually, just "something" has to touch... here is the USMS backstroke turn rule...


    101.4.3 Turns—
    Upon completion of each length, some part of the swimmer must
    touch the wall. During the

    turn the shoulders may be turned past the vertical
    toward the breast, after which a continuous single arm pull or a continuous
    simultaneous double arm pull may be used to initiate the turn. Once the

    body
    has left the position on the back, any


    kick or arm pull must be part of the
    continuous turning action. The swimmer must have returned to a position
    on the back upon leaving the wall.
    Note:


    The swimmer who turns past vertical and, in a continuous motion,
    grabs the wall before pushing off with the feet while on the back is consid


    ered
    to have executed a “continuous turning action.”

    Of course, bashing the end with some parts might be uncomfortable!



    Thanks so much for posting the actual rule!! I think I'm going to try to skip the "bashing" part


Page 5 of 20 FirstFirst 12345678915 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Lane Etiquette (question on moving lanes)
    By SaltySwimmer in forum General Swimming-Related Discussions
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: December 2nd, 2008, 09:13 PM
  2. Lane N or Lane N-1?
    By twosox in forum General Swimming-Related Discussions
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: July 2nd, 2008, 05:38 PM
  3. What is your pet peeve about swimming?
    By in forum General Swimming-Related Discussions
    Replies: 291
    Last Post: February 12th, 2008, 08:36 PM
  4. 2005 world championships
    By ande in forum General Swimming-Related Discussions
    Replies: 142
    Last Post: August 2nd, 2005, 08:14 PM
  5. Lane lines
    By Ian in forum General Swimming-Related Discussions
    Replies: 36
    Last Post: April 29th, 2003, 12:13 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •