Page 4 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast
Results 61 to 80 of 91

Thread: Water Temp v wetsuit

  1. #61
    Very Active Member E=H2O's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Lake Oswego, OR
    Posts
    496

    Re: Water Temp v wetsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by evmo View Post
    Should we lower the rim to 8 feet in basketball?
    Absolutely, but you can't play unless you are under 6 ft
    "If you didn't swallow water in your last open water race, you weren't racing."

    www.bobswims.com/

  2. #62
    Active Member geog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    86

    Re: Water Temp v wetsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by evmo View Post
    I'm talking about marathon swimming (in particular, solo marathon swimming).
    in your original post, that qualification would have gone a long way
    swimith

  3. #63
    Very Active Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    California
    Posts
    222

    Re: Water Temp v wetsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by E=H2O View Post
    On this basis neoprene caps should be allowed. I'm sure Ederle and others would have used them if they were available, and would find it comical that they are banned by all channel associations.
    The Farallon Islands organization allows them. Based on your description of the research, it sounds like their performance benefit over the course of a channel swim is possibly non-existent? Anyone attempting the Farallons has probably trained away the first-immersion shock anyway...

  4. #64
    Very Active Member E=H2O's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Lake Oswego, OR
    Posts
    496

    Re: Water Temp v wetsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisM View Post
    I agree that it's more difficult, takes more preparation, more willingness to be uncomfortable... No one is taking that away from you.
    I don't think it takes anymore preparation. I think swimming in rough water does, unless you have years of experience to fall back on. (And swimming in a pool with noodlers doesn't count).

    Definitely more uncomfortable, but that is usually only at the beginning and of course riding out the shivers after you are done. Chaos convinced me to do the Bridge to Bridge in SF at 57 when my coldest experience was at 60. He then convinced me to jump in 52 water to swim the GG Bridge to Aquatic Park. Frankly there is little difference in those swims. All I remember is the shock from the jump in (preferably not from a platform that sends you 6 feet under water) and swimming like hell.
    "If you didn't swallow water in your last open water race, you weren't racing."

    www.bobswims.com/

  5. #65
    Very Active Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    144

    Re: Water Temp v wetsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by E=H2O View Post
    I don't think it takes anymore preparation. I think swimming in rough water does, unless you have years of experience to fall back on. (And swimming in a pool with noodlers doesn't count).

    Definitely more uncomfortable, but that is usually only at the beginning and of course riding out the shivers after you are done. Chaos convinced me to do the Bridge to Bridge in SF at 57 when my coldest experience was at 60. He then convinced me to jump in 52 water to swim the GG Bridge to Aquatic Park. Frankly there is little difference in those swims. All I remember is the shock from the jump in (preferably not from a platform that sends you 6 feet under water) and swimming like hell.
    Yeah, I was referring to mental preparation, really, but also experience. Water could be calm, could be rough, but swimming in the ocean you have to be prepared to handle whatever conditions present themselves at the start of or in the middle of a swim.

    Every time I've jumped into the bay in a wetsuit I've thought to myself I could do this without.... but that requires actually jumping in without in the first place. Easy to say when you have one on

  6. #66
    Very Active Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    California
    Posts
    222

    Re: Water Temp v wetsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by geog View Post
    in your original post, that qualification would have gone a long way
    Hmm. I'd put it this way: They are a crutch regardless of distance. In short-distance OW races with separate categories, the distinction is self-evident. However, in solo marathon swims it can prove tempting to "make up your own rules" and then elide this fact when reporting to the media your unprecedented feat of "marathon swimming."

  7. #67
    Active Member geog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    86

    Re: Water Temp v wetsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by geog View Post
    fwiw, feeding can also be couched as a crutch. it has been
    demonstrated to be unnecessary even in long (21 mile) swims:

    [1] "... did not touch food or drink throughout the long swim, but had a light breakfast of canteloupe, cereal, toast and coffee one hour before starting."

    [2] "... ruddy of cheek, bright of eye and full of life ... gave not the least sign of the great ordeal she had gone through. She would not even rest on the trip up the bay and spent most of the time chatting and enjoying another meal of cold food."

    it is not even necessary in order break records:

    [3] "... broken the record for the swim ... by seven minutes and 30 seconds ... in far harsher conditions"


    sources:
    [1], [2]: http://www.nycswim.org/Article/Artic...Article_ID=728
    [3]: p137 in http://www.amazon.com/dp/0786440287
    Quote Originally Posted by evmo View Post
    I'm fairly certain if Trudy Ederle (the subject of geog's articles) were alive today, she'd tell us her decision to not eat was a personal preference, and she certainly wouldn't expect future competitors in the swim-later-to-be-known-as the "Ederle Swim" to also refrain from eating. <snip>
    it seems implausible to me that Trudy did not at least drink some water. so i only half believe that newspaper report. maybe NYCswims has additional historical accounts such a swim log, debriefings or diary pages from her support crew.

    on the other hand, Lisa Bier did fanatical research for her book.

    on the otherhand, Bier may have written book out of sociological interest, plus she simply may not have had been endurance athlete herself, or had enough exposure to our crowd for the no-food statement to have raised a red flag.

    regardless, if one reads accounts of survival such as Unbroken by Laura Hillenbrand, it is clear that people are capable of far more than what seems reasonable. so maybe Trudy did swim it without food/liquids.

    Anyway ...

    I disagree with you about your Trudy-today scenario. I think she would say her food plan was based on her experience and knowledge, plus she didn't want to risk impressing with vomit the 7 reporters on the support boat. This was a time in history when women were trying to overcome several biases, including the myth that the female physique did not have sufficient constitution for participation in sports without harm to themselves.

    If she had today's knowledge, such as that being shared on MarathonSwimmers.org, I think she wholeheartedly would have fed.

    ok, so maybe you summed all that up more elegantly in the phrase "personal preferences".
    Last edited by geog; April 4th, 2012 at 08:41 PM.
    swimith

  8. #68
    Active Member geog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    86

    Re: Water Temp v wetsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisM View Post
    I get that OW swimmers ... more willingness to be uncomfortable
    cold water is not uncomfortable.
    swimith

  9. #69
    Very Active Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    144

    Re: Water Temp v wetsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by geog View Post
    cold water is not uncomfortable.
    Well, that's a personal thing I guess. I may not have swum in water colder than 55, but I've dived in 45 degree water. Diving in 80 degree water is more comfortable to me. Floating in 80 degree water is more comfortable than floating in 55 degree water to me.

  10. #70
    Very Active Member chaos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    hudson valley, ny
    Posts
    1,738
    Blog Entries
    155

    Re: Water Temp v wetsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by geog View Post
    it seems implausible to me that Trudy did not at least drink some water. so i only half believe that newspaper report. maybe NYCswims has additional historical accounts such a swim log, debriefings or diary pages from her support crew.
    I think Mr NYC Swim has some incredible video footage of Gertie... and indeed some of it contradicts what was reported.

  11. #71
    Very Active Member E=H2O's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Lake Oswego, OR
    Posts
    496

    Re: Water Temp v wetsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by geog View Post
    cold water is not uncomfortable.
    You are a walrus, goo goo a'gjoo
    "If you didn't swallow water in your last open water race, you weren't racing."

    www.bobswims.com/

  12. #72
    Active Member geog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    86

    Re: Water Temp v wetsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisM View Post
    I get that OW swimmers ... more willingness to be uncomfortable
    Quote Originally Posted by geog View Post
    cold water is not uncomfortable.
    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisM View Post
    Well, that's a personal thing I guess.
    i agree. i should should have qualified my statement. regardless, it breaks your point, or at least that aspect of your point. cheers!
    Last edited by geog; April 4th, 2012 at 08:55 PM.
    swimith

  13. #73
    Very Active Member chaos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    hudson valley, ny
    Posts
    1,738
    Blog Entries
    155

    Re: Water Temp v wetsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by E=H2O View Post
    He then convinced me to jump in 52 water to swim the GG Bridge to Aquatic Park.
    One of my favorite swims EVER! It was truly glorious... (breakfast at Denny's, not so much)

  14. #74
    Active Member geog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    86

    Re: Water Temp v wetsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by geog View Post
    it seems implausible to me that Trudy did not at least drink some water. so i only half believe that newspaper report. maybe NYCswims has additional historical accounts such a swim log, debriefings or diary pages from her support crew.

    on the other hand, Lisa Bier did fanatical research for her book.

    on the otherhand, Bier may have written book out of sociological interest, plus she simply may not have had been endurance athlete herself, or had enough exposure to our crowd for the no-food statement to have raised a red flag.

    regardless, if one reads accounts of survival such as Unbroken by Laura Hillenbrand, it is clear that people are capable of far more than what seems reasonable. so maybe Trudy did swim it without food/liquids.
    Quote Originally Posted by chaos View Post
    I think Mr NYC Swim has some incredible video footage of Gertie... and indeed some of it contradicts what was reported.
    thanks. online? where?
    swimith

  15. #75
    Very Active Member E=H2O's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Lake Oswego, OR
    Posts
    496

    Re: Water Temp v wetsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by chaos View Post
    (breakfast at Denny's, not so much)
    I was colder walking around in the rain than I was on the swim.
    "If you didn't swallow water in your last open water race, you weren't racing."

    www.bobswims.com/

  16. #76
    Active Member geog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    86

    Re: Water Temp v wetsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by geog View Post
    cold water is not uncomfortable.
    Quote Originally Posted by E=H2O View Post
    You are a walrus, goo goo a'gjoo
    lol. you are a triathlete at heart, gear gear mo'gear

    "Lennon composed the song by combining three songs he had been working on. When he learned that a teacher at his old primary school was having his students analyse Beatles' lyrics, he added a verse of nonsense words.[3]

    The walrus is a reference to the walrus in Lewis Carroll's poem
    The Walrus and the Carpenter (from the book Through the Looking-Glass). Lennon expressed dismay upon belatedly realising that the walrus was a villain in the poem.[4]"

    btw, from what I understand you do 99% of your training in a pool. to me thats nutso, but to me that makes your cool water swims impressive because i do know the benefits of cold water training. hats off to you, sincerely! best wishes on your swims/fundraisng.
    swimith

  17. #77
    Very Active Member chaos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    hudson valley, ny
    Posts
    1,738
    Blog Entries
    155

    Re: Water Temp v wetsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by geog View Post
    thanks. online? where?
    [ame="http://vimeo.com/20493197"]Three Rivers, The Brooklyn Bridge and Lady Liberty (US Version) on Vimeo[/ame]

    There are only a few short clips of Ederle in this vid.... but I'm sure there must be more.

  18. #78
    Active Member geog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    86

    Re: Water Temp v wetsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by chaos View Post


    There are only a few short clips of Ederle in this vid.... but I'm sure there must be more.
    thanks, historical footage starts about 9 min into it, runs for ~3 min. excellent production quality, but if you find the bacon, please post!
    swimith

  19. #79
    Very Active Member E=H2O's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Lake Oswego, OR
    Posts
    496

    Re: Water Temp v wetsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by geog View Post
    btw, from what I understand you do 99% of your training in a pool. to me thats nutso, but to me that makes your cool water swims impressive because i do know the benefits of cold water training.
    Thanks.

    When I lived in Santa Barbara for nearly 20 years it was ocean swimming and surfing, with a little training in Los Banos and the Carpinteria pool. I even lived right on Rincon Point for a year, but had to move when I gort married. :-(

    At least the moving part was sad.
    "If you didn't swallow water in your last open water race, you weren't racing."

    www.bobswims.com/

  20. #80
    Very Active Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Kingston, RI
    Posts
    134

    Re: Water Temp v wetsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by geog View Post
    sounds like you've acclimated your eyes to the salt.
    is that for events or for saltwater training swims too?
    and are your eyes irritated/red afterwards?
    Slightly red and irritated but it passes very quickly. I did a 5K swim without goggles last year and by the time I was finished my eyes were just about closed with the irritation, and it actually hurt. But for 2.5 miles or less I basically never wear goggles in the salt water any longer. I asked my Eye doc and she thought it was reasonable. I guess our tears aren't so much different from salt water as you might think.
    DrMikey

Page 4 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. How often do they change pool water completely?
    By ddl in forum General Swimming-Related Discussions
    Replies: 24
    Last Post: November 27th, 2017, 01:42 PM
  2. Help! Water temp over 90!
    By renie in forum General Swimming-Related Discussions
    Replies: 22
    Last Post: July 15th, 2011, 05:33 PM
  3. USMS rulebook clarification - open water
    By mattson in forum General Swimming-Related Discussions
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: May 11th, 2011, 07:41 PM
  4. Open Water Race during Masters Nationals
    By Paul Smith in forum Open Water Swimming
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: March 27th, 2011, 02:27 PM
  5. To wetsuit or not?
    By pwb in forum Open Water Swimming
    Replies: 21
    Last Post: November 3rd, 2008, 10:47 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •