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Thread: 2013 Qualifying Times

  1. #21

    Re: 2013 Qualifying Times

    Using the formula 5th time * 1.15 for qualifying times seems to bias participation in the shorter distances over the longer distances (100 vs 200). Is this intentional?

    Using the qualifying times for the 100 vs the 200 breast -
    Event Rankings 2012 (Long Course meters - Men)
    Age 50-54 39 made the cut in the 100, 23 in the 200.
    Age 55-59 35 in the 100, 26 in the 200.
    Age 60-64 31 in the 100, 20 in the 200.

  2. #22
    Very Active Member jroddin's Avatar
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    Re: 2013 Qualifying Times

    Quote Originally Posted by secondheart View Post
    Using the formula 5th time * 1.15 for qualifying times seems to bias participation in the shorter distances over the longer distances (100 vs 200). Is this intentional?

    Using the qualifying times for the 100 vs the 200 breast -
    Event Rankings 2012 (Long Course meters - Men)
    Age 50-54 39 made the cut in the 100, 23 in the 200.
    Age 55-59 35 in the 100, 26 in the 200.
    Age 60-64 31 in the 100, 20 in the 200.
    A fairer question would be what percentage of the people in the Event Rankings database make the cuts for the events?

  3. #23
    Very Active Member orca1946's Avatar
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    Re: 2013 Qualifying Times

    I would think more as the age moves up & there are less in each older age bracket.

  4. #24

    Re: 2013 Qualifying Times

    Quote Originally Posted by orca1946 View Post
    I would think more as the age moves up & there are less in each older age bracket.
    Thank you and Jeff Roddin for your responses.

    I was showing how the qualification times in the 200 are harder relative to the 100 across multiple age groups (used 3 age group examples).

    Jeff's point is for those who post times that the percentage of qualifiers will be about the same between the 100 and 200. This is true, but I contend that a 1:35.88 (100 breast 60+ time) is equivalent to a 3:33-34 for the 200 not 3:27.79. This may discourage seniors from doing the 200 as opposed to the 100 and 50. Anyway - I hope I haven't put you to

  5. #25
    Very Active Member Chris Stevenson's Avatar
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    Re: 2013 Qualifying Times

    Quote Originally Posted by secondheart View Post
    I contend that a 1:35.88 (100 breast 60+ time) is equivalent to a 3:33-34 for the 200 not 3:27.79. This may discourage seniors from doing the 200 as opposed to the 100 and 50.
    According to the VA ratings calculator, you are correct: for a 62-year-old male the 1:35.88 time is equivalent to 3:33.76 in LCM.

    http://www.vaswim.org/cgi-bin/rcalc.cgi

    Of course the ratings calculator uses a much different algorithm (ie, FINA world record times in LCM) than the NQT formula.

    Possibly it might discourage participation in the longer events. Then again, since one gets three "freebies" perhaps swimmers might be grateful that the shorter events have slightly easier NQTs than the longer ones in this particular case

  6. #26

    Re: 2013 Qualifying Times

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Stevenson View Post
    According to the VA ratings calculator, you are correct: for a 62-year-old male the 1:35.88 time is equivalent to 3:33.76 in LCM.

    http://www.vaswim.org/cgi-bin/rcalc.cgi

    Of course the ratings calculator uses a much different algorithm (ie, FINA world record times in LCM) than the NQT formula.

    Possibly it might discourage participation in the longer events. Then again, since one gets three "freebies" perhaps swimmers might be grateful that the shorter events have slightly easier NQTs than the longer ones in this particular case
    Great calculator! Glad it agrees with my estimate (I simply used an average ratio of 200/100 times of a few 60+ top swimmers as the multiplier of 1:35.88). Maybe we should use your calculator for 200+ events based on 100 times.

  7. #27
    Very Active Member orca1946's Avatar
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    Re: 2013 Qualifying Times

    I calculate that I will not be able to swim what the end times comes out to be ??? Old age creep is in full motion !

  8. #28
    aka Elaine-iaK & Aqua Dog ElaineK's Avatar
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    Re: 2013 Qualifying Times

    Quote Originally Posted by ElaineK View Post
    Thanks, Jeff! These NQT's now give me direction for my 2013 goal-setting. I am very much looking forward to Mission Viejo and going back "home" to So. Cal!

    Question: I read over the FAQ sheet, however, I do not see anything about time limits for making NQT's. If I remember right, Anna Lea said the window is two years. Is that still correct? My reason for asking is this: According to the Swimming World Conversion Utility, my SCM 100 breaststroke time at last year's St. Nick's meet (November 2011) was EXACTLY the NQT time for that event in my age group. It was my personal best time in that event, however, I have not been able to hit it since. But, would it count? Mission Viejo is in August 2013, less than two years from the date I made NQT's. If my times from that meet DO count, then I also made it in the 50 and 200 breaststroke events and get to swim six events. (I will hold off on using an appropriate Smilie until I have confirmation...)
    I just received this from Jayhawk:

    Here's the thread you probably remember:

    http://forums.usms.org/showthread.ph...-for-Nationals

    Yes, it sounds like your times from the St. Nick's meet would all count. Woo hoo!

    Her post August 13, 2009 post on that thread (#4) confirms what I was asking.
    http://ElaineiaKsTravels.wordpress.com

    ~ Believing in your dreams can be far more rewarding than living by your limitations ~Karla Peterson

  9. #29
    Very Active Member Peter Cruise's Avatar
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    Re: 2013 Qualifying Times

    I hear the phrase "old age creep" from some of the age-groupers when I'm doing laps. They must be following this discussion...
    Life keeps throwing curve balls; the trick, I'm learning, is to duck...

  10. #30
    Very Active Member orca1946's Avatar
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    Re: 2013 Qualifying Times

    O K If I use times from the last 2 years --- I can make one more event.

  11. #31
    Very Active Member jroddin's Avatar
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    Re: 2013 Qualifying Times

    Quote Originally Posted by orca1946 View Post
    O K If I use times from the last 2 years --- I can make one more event.
    ElaineK and Orca recently asked the same question about time limits. This is addressed under item 9 in the NQT FAQ. Here is a cut and paste from the FAQ:

    9. My LMSC does not always send in the meet results to the USMS national
    database. Is this a problem?

    The rule is that you have swum the event at the national qualifying time or faster at some
    time in the past two years. You do not have to swim the event in a reported meet to the
    USMS national database. You could have swum the meet at a USA Swimming meet, a YMCA
    meet, a practice meet or in practice, but you should have swum the event.

  12. #32
    aka Elaine-iaK & Aqua Dog ElaineK's Avatar
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    Re: 2013 Qualifying Times

    Quote Originally Posted by jroddin View Post
    ElaineK and Orca recently asked the same question about time limits. This is addressed under item 9 in the NQT FAQ. Here is a cut and paste from the FAQ:

    9. My LMSC does not always send in the meet results to the USMS national
    database. Is this a problem?

    The rule is that you have swum the event at the national qualifying time or faster at some
    time in the past two years. You do not have to swim the event in a reported meet to the
    USMS national database. You could have swum the meet at a USA Swimming meet, a YMCA
    meet, a practice meet or in practice, but you should have swum the event.

    Thanks, Jeff. I got a clarification on that from Anna Lea in a PM. She pointed me to a past post she had written on the subject; the one I had trouble finding.
    And, she also confirmed that I have qualified in all three of my breaststroke events for Mission Viejo.
    http://ElaineiaKsTravels.wordpress.com

    ~ Believing in your dreams can be far more rewarding than living by your limitations ~Karla Peterson

  13. #33
    Very Active Member orca1946's Avatar
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    Re: 2013 Qualifying Times

    Thanks for an update on my/our question. That helps me in what I can q for .

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