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Thread: Backstroke Ledge at Nationals ?

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    Backstroke Ledge at Nationals ?

    I've asked one of the meet directors if the ledge would be available for the meet in Greensboro and received the answer. No. Certainly not what I expected. Last year in San Antonio, after having them available on Wed and distance day on Thurs they were removed. I spoke with the Colorado Timing rep that was at the meet who was also disappointed and had hoped they would be available this year. Has anyone ever seen/used the ledge at a masters, high school or college meet ? I have seen them at the elite Meets but no where else. When the Nationals roll around it will be almost 2 years since they were approved. I wonder how long it will be before we are able to use them ?
    Last edited by jackback; February 3rd, 2016 at 12:59 PM.
    As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly.

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    Very Active Member swimmieAvsFan's Avatar
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    Re: Backstroke Ledge at Nationals ?

    The ledges were not in use last year at San Antonio. The facility had them installed, but they were not allowed to be used during the meet.

    Mollie Grover
    Potomac Valley Top Ten Recorder
    USMS Rules committee

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    Re: Backstroke Ledge at Nationals ?

    Some folks got to try the ledges in warm-ups at San Antonio, but I did not get a chance. Sure would like to try them sometime before they are offered during a meet.
    Mary Pohlmann

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    Very Active Member jroddin's Avatar
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    Re: Backstroke Ledge at Nationals ?

    Quote Originally Posted by jackback View Post
    I've asked one of the meet directors if the ledge would be available for the meet in Greensboro and received the answer. No. Certainly not what I expected. Last year in San Antonio, after having them available on Wed and distance day on Thurs they were removed. I spoke with the Colorado Timing rep that was at the meet who was also disappointed and had hoped they would be available this year. Has anyone ever seen/used the ledge at a masters, high school or college meet ? I have seen them at the elite Meets but no where else. When the Nationals roll around it will be almost 2 years since they were approved. I wonder how long it will be before we are able to use them ?
    The backstroke ledges were at the facility in San Antonio but the officials made the decision to not use them because they weren't prepared for them. This was discussed at convention this past fall in the Officials Committee and Championship Committee meetings. Here is a cut and paste from Championship Committee minutes:

    F. Fin Blocks/Backstroke Ledges
    Fin Blocks were new to us in 2012 (Omaha) and were at both 2015 Nationals. The backstroke ledges were available at San Antonio, but were not used for competition. Jeff said that from now on, the Officials Committee has agreed to allow them at Nationals if the host facility has them available. It was also suggested they have the ledges available in warmup sprint lanes. Kim suggested that we have a promotional video included in our electronic newsletters to the meet participants to show how to use the ledges. It was also suggested that tips for using the ledges should included with the Coach Certification clinics. Jillian will take this to the Coaches Committee.

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    Re: Backstroke Ledge at Nationals ?

    thanks for the reply, jrodin ... i can't remember if the Colorado Timing Rep said that they had supplied them for San Antonio meet but that was the impression I came away with ... but maybe the school district pool we used in San Antonio had purchased them, which would be very impressive !
    As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly.

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    Active Member mrubacky's Avatar
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    Re: Backstroke Ledge at Nationals ?

    Greensboro Aquatic Center does not have enough for both courses so that's why we chose not to have them at Spring Nationals.

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    Very Active Member pwb's Avatar
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    Re: Backstroke Ledge at Nationals ?

    Quote Originally Posted by mrubacky View Post
    Greensboro Aquatic Center does not have enough for both courses so that's why we chose not to have them at Spring Nationals.
    That is a bummer. What's the cost for 10 more so we could use them? If we had a successful GoFundMe campaign to raise money for wedges at Greensboro, could we use them?

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    Re: Backstroke Ledge at Nationals ?

    Or if Colorado timing could supply the extra ten and gain the exposure for the product. I think they are one of USMS partners. They go for $650 a lane.
    As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly.

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    Very Active Member pwb's Avatar
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    Re: Backstroke Ledge at Nationals ?

    Quote Originally Posted by jackback View Post
    Or if Colorado timing could supply the extra ten and gain the exposure for the product. I think they are one of USMS partners. They go for $650 a lane.
    So, assume they need two spare, we'd need 12 x $650 = $7,800. There were 427 unique individuals entered in the 100 backstroke back in 2012, so that's about $18 per backstroker to fund ledges. It would seem to me that, either GAC or USMS might create a win-win by running a funding campaign ... if GAC runs it, they could offset part of the capital costs to further enhance their facility. If USMS runs the funding campaign, they could have a set of ledges to be transported to future Nationals sites.

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    Very Active Member StewartACarroll's Avatar
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    Re: Backstroke Ledge at Nationals ?

    Quote Originally Posted by pwb View Post
    So, assume they need two spare, we'd need 12 x $650 = $7,800. There were 427 unique individuals entered in the 100 backstroke back in 2012, so that's about $18 per backstroker to fund ledges. It would seem to me that, either GAC or USMS might create a win-win by running a funding campaign ... if GAC runs it, they could offset part of the capital costs to further enhance their facility. If USMS runs the funding campaign, they could have a set of ledges to be transported to future Nationals sites.
    Great idea. I would contribute.

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    Re: Backstroke Ledge at Nationals ?

    ADD ME IN ! ... 424 to go !
    As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly.

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    Very Active Member habu987's Avatar
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    Re: Backstroke Ledge at Nationals ?

    Going off on a bit of a tangent, the prices for the backstroke ledges are beyond absurdly high. Gotta love that oligopoly!

    Back on track, I tried the backstroke ledges in the diving well at San Antonio and honestly wasn't that impressed. The two I tried malfunctioned--one wouldn't go down more than about 9 inches underwater, and the other wouldn't lock in place once I pulled it down. I did a total of 8 starts with them and wasn't super impressed. Didn't have problems with slipping, but it made me put my feet in different positions than normal for the start. Maybe something like Myrtha's (also absurdly priced) backstroke ledge would work better in my case, but I'm not heartbroken that we don't get ledges this time around.

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    Re: Backstroke Ledge at Nationals ?

    the range of the ledge according to the rules: adjustable 4 centimeters above or below the surface of the water ( 1.5+ inches) ... i remember the colorado timing ledges at san antonio as being able to go well below that ... i used it for practice as high as i could go and not put/curl my toes over the gutter (still against the rules) ... i wanted to get my butt as high as possible so on the start i could actually attempt to get it (my butt) airborne as opposed to plowing thru water as i currently do because i keep my feet lower to prevent slipping ... colorado timing ledges do not lock in place, once you pull it down you have to get a foot on it to secure it, it then retracts automatically after the start ... omega ledges lock into place at the start but do not retract, an official must pull them back up ... if they are supplied at a meet there use is not required
    As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly.

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    Very Active Member orca1946's Avatar
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    Re: Backstroke Ledge at Nationals ?

    I was looking forward to using them - maybe some meet in the future.

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    Re: Backstroke Ledge at Nationals ?

    USMS April Streamlines has a nice video on how to use the Colorado Timing "Backstroke Ledge" ... out today. One of these years ! .... .... .... May i make a correction, after receiving a National meet update just now -- "Backstroke Ledges" will be in use for the meet !!!!
    Last edited by jackback; April 4th, 2016 at 07:30 PM.
    As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly.

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    Very Active Member orca1946's Avatar
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    Re: Backstroke Ledge at Nationals ?

    I still would like to try them. Will there be any in the warm up lanes at any time?

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    Re: Backstroke Ledge at Nationals ?

    Quote Originally Posted by jackback View Post
    USMS April Streamlines has a nice video on how to use the Colorado Timing "Backstroke Ledge" ... out today. One of these years ! .... .... .... May i make a correction, after receiving a National meet update just now -- "Backstroke Ledges" will be in use for the meet !!!!
    I'm not getting meet updates via email (or the Streamlines), odd. I will have to search for the video.

    So for sure the ledges will be in use at nationals?

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    Re: Backstroke Ledge at Nationals ?

    Here is the pertinent info from update # 1







    Facility Information


    The Venue
    The Greensboro Aquatic Center, which opened in 2011, is one of the United States' premier indoor aquatic facilities. If you participated in the 2012 USMS Spring Championships, then you already know what a fantastic facility it is.

    The GAC features three pools--a 50-meter x 25-yard competition pool, a diving well, and an instructional pool. Colorado Time Systems backstroke ledges will be in use at this meet. See our Backstroke Start Device instructional video on this great feature. The ledges will be in place on Wednesday afternoon for the warm-up period for practice.

    The competition pool will be divided by twin bulkheads into two, 10-lane courses for the meet. The depth of the competition pool is 9 to 10 feet throughout. All lanes are 7-feet wide. The competition pool opens at 6 a.m. each day of the meet. The warm-up pools will be open starting at 7 a.m. and there will be 13 lanes for warm-up in the diving well and instructional pools during competition.

    As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly.

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    Very Active Member pwb's Avatar
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    Re: Backstroke Ledge at Nationals ?

    so stoked the backstroke ledges will be there! Thanks to whoever made that happen!

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    Very Active Member orca1946's Avatar
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    Re: Backstroke Ledge at Nationals ?

    I used it for the 200 back. Easy to adjust and friendly to use at the start of a race. I tried learning how to adjust it in the diving well before the race use. If you pull it down from the center rather from the side, it pulls down level .

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