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Thread: Help My Flutter Kick is Horrible!

  1. #21
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    don't play those goal games
    I'll be happy when I ____ 3 months from now

    just keep training
    keep testing your kick and
    you will improve as much as you improve

    ande

    Originally posted by Blue Horn
    Wow, that is some serious speed. Heck your dolfin kick would smoke my whole stroke. If I can ever get below 20 I will be happy. BTW, what would be a realistic goal 3 months from now?

  2. #22
    Very Active Member Blue Horn's Avatar
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    UPDATE!

    I did my weekly timing and did much better than I thought I could. I had someone time me on the pace clock and did three all out kicks from a dive off the blocks for 25 yards. I went 21, 20 and 20. I didn't think I would hit that number for a while.

    Better yet in my main kick set I did a 12 x 25 yards all of which were uner 30 except my last two and they were 30 and 31. I has hitting anywhere from 27 to 29 (during the week I have been training at a 25 meter pool which I think has helped too)! When I started three weeks ago, I seriously had a hard time getting down below 40 and by the end my 6th 25 (yards) I was getting closer to 45. I still can't believe what three weeks of following your advice has done for my kick! I just figured it was a breastroker thing and I would always have a horrible flutter kick. Don't get me wrong, I know that I am still snail slow, but the improvement has been far beyond what I thought I could accomplish in this time period. I can't explain how excited I am right now.

    Thinking back on everything I think the fins really hurt my kick. It was like I couldn't feel the water when I took them off. But I couldn't keep up without them. When I start swimming with the team again, I will just do shorter distances if I have to. I really think that developing a feel for the water with my feet and my shins has been the biggest improvement for me. That and bending my knees. Before, I was trying to keep my legs completly straight and kick with my ankles only. Trust me, that doesn't work.

    Thanks for all your help Ande. It has really paid off thus far.

    Hook'em
    Blue

  3. #23
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    Re: UPDATE!

    congratulations
    you have made serious improvements on your flutter kick

    remember the last thing I wrote in the post about how to improve your kick

    I swear this WILL WORK

    you are now proof of that!


    Blue Horn's times for all out 25 streamline flutter kick

    03/25 :20
    03/18 :22
    03/04 :24


    OK

    here's a few things to add to the mix

    1) distance per kick drills
    concentrate on feeling the water with your feet and shins and going further with each kick
    don't worry about time, count your kicks

    2) fast 50 kicks
    you are ready to add fast 50 kicks to the mix
    so now start training and testing 25's and 50's
    if you're kicking a 50 with no board,
    take one arm pull into the turn and flip it
    splitting becomes inportant for 50's and up
    you need to learn how to kick fast but
    hold back a little to save some energy for your last 25

    3) time to 10ths of a sec
    start doing your test kicks with a timer on a stop watch

    4) short sprint kicks
    Do a few 10 yard, 12.5 yard and 15 yard
    all out kicking blasts to improve your all out kicking speed
    take lots of rest

    5) self talk / belief
    add self talk while you're kicking, just repeat
    "I'm a fast kicker"
    the more you believe it the faster you'll kick

    6) kick while you swim
    learn to use your new kick when you sprint freestyle swim
    so do a few sprint 25's where you concentrate on blasting your legs, stick with a 2 beat for longer stuff

    7) streamline dolphin kicking
    start training and testing sprint streamline dolphin kicking

    8) test and train with a board from a push



    Blue Horn you have made significant improvements on your flutter kick and i believe you have much more are ahead of you

    I'm proud of you and happy for you.

    Ande

    ps anyone else out there want to give this a try?


    Originally posted by Blue Horn
    I did my weekly timing and did much better than I thought I could. I had someone time me on the pace clock and did three all out kicks from a dive off the blocks for 25 yards. I went 21, 20 and 20. I didn't think I would hit that number for a while.

    Better yet in my main kick set I did a 12 x 25 yards all of which were uner 30 except my last two and they were 30 and 31. I has hitting anywhere from 27 to 29 (during the week I have been training at a 25 meter pool which I think has helped too)! When I started three weeks ago, I seriously had a hard time getting down below 40 and by the end my 6th 25 (yards) I was getting closer to 45. I still can't believe what three weeks of following your advice has done for my kick! I just figured it was a breastroker thing and I would always have a horrible flutter kick. Don't get me wrong, I know that I am still snail slow, but the improvement has been far beyond what I thought I could accomplish in this time period. I can't explain how excited I am right now.

    Thinking back on everything I think the fins really hurt my kick. It was like I couldn't feel the water when I took them off. But I couldn't keep up without them. When I start swimming with the team again, I will just do shorter distances if I have to. I really think that developing a feel for the water with my feet and my shins has been the biggest improvement for me. That and bending my knees. Before, I was trying to keep my legs completly straight and kick with my ankles only. Trust me, that doesn't work.

    Thanks for all your help Ande. It has really paid off thus far.

    Hook'em
    Blue

  4. #24
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    any updates?

  5. #25
    Very Active Member Blue Horn's Avatar
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    LJ,

    So how are you doing? Have you been trying the workout?


    Ande,

    I hear you meet Coach Barton. He has put me over in my own lane until I get back into shape again (after the latest baby was born 6 months ago I have not been able to hit the pool regularly until recently) and develop a better kick.

    This Wed. I kicked a 250 with a centermount snorkel and without a board and held around 35 second per 25. Although, I really started fading on that last 50.

    Today I did 5 x 25 coming in on the 27 to 29 and leaving on one minute. Then I did 10 x 50 on 2 minute intervals coming in at 1:05 and under except for two intervals where I came in around 1:07.

    The one thing I noticed is that I feel more streamlined in my hips (if that makes any sense) and I have a tighter but easier kick. I think most of it is just learning to feel the water.

    Next week I make work in a set of 75s.

    Hook'em
    Blue

  6. #26
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    any updates?
    are you continuing with the sprint kick training?

    ande

  7. #27
    Very Active Member Blue Horn's Avatar
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    I just finished up with a long trial (out of town), so I am just now getting back into my work-out routine. Yesterday, I did a 4 x 50 (yards) kick set with a board (for the first time without fins) on 1:15, holding a 1:06 (coach timed). I was supposed to do 6 sets, but I am just way too out of shape after a month off for trial. I couldn't believe that I was holding those times. I would have never thought I could kick that fast (relatively speaking of course).

    Now I just have to get this ten pounds of trial weight off of my gut.

    Thanks again for all of your support and encouragement. It really has helped.

    Hook'em
    Blue

  8. #28
    Very Active Member Blue Horn's Avatar
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    Ande,

    What do you think about trying the rack? I noticed that my left foot is not near as flexible as my right and that I don't get as much push out of my left leg kick. In fact, I will drift to the left if I am not paying attention. I was thinking about doing some stretches for my feet and ankles to help my kick. What do you think?

  9. #29
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    I don't think it's necessary, you might be like jeff,

    try sitting on your feet in a hot bath
    or rock on your feet when you watch TV
    also

    you'll kick faster if you consistently train
    you'll kick faster when you lose weight

    also work on SDK, streamline dolphin kicking

    ande

    Originally posted by Blue Horn
    Ande,

    What do you think about trying the rack? I noticed that my left foot is not near as flexible as my right and that I don't get as much push out of my left leg kick. In fact, I will drift to the left if I am not paying attention. I was thinking about doing some stretches for my feet and ankles to help my kick. What do you think?

  10. #30
    Very Active Member Blue Horn's Avatar
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    Re: Re: UPDATE!

    Originally posted by ande


    OK

    here's a few things to add to the mix

    1) distance per kick drills
    concentrate on feeling the water with your feet and shins and going further with each kick
    don't worry about time, count your kicks

    2) fast 50 kicks
    you are ready to add fast 50 kicks to the mix
    so now start training and testing 25's and 50's
    if you're kicking a 50 with no board,
    take one arm pull into the turn and flip it
    splitting becomes inportant for 50's and up
    you need to learn how to kick fast but
    hold back a little to save some energy for your last 25

    3) time to 10ths of a sec
    start doing your test kicks with a timer on a stop watch

    4) short sprint kicks
    Do a few 10 yard, 12.5 yard and 15 yard
    all out kicking blasts to improve your all out kicking speed
    take lots of rest

    5) self talk / belief
    add self talk while you're kicking, just repeat
    "I'm a fast kicker"
    the more you believe it the faster you'll kick

    6) kick while you swim
    learn to use your new kick when you sprint freestyle swim
    so do a few sprint 25's where you concentrate on blasting your legs, stick with a 2 beat for longer stuff

    7) streamline dolphin kicking
    start training and testing sprint streamline dolphin kicking

    8) test and train with a board from a push



    [/B]
    I have been incorporating some of these points this week and last week. I have been focusing on distance per kick (150 SCM for warm up!), sprinting with a 6 beat kick and developing a stronger two beat kick at longer distances. I have also been doing SDK and breastroke kicking. I am very happy that I am actually getting some push out of my kick even when I do longer distances with a two beat kick. Better yet, I am finally starting to develop a rythm for a 6 beat kick (or at least something more than 2) on short distances. It has really made a difference in my swimming. I am really looking forward to seeing were I am at by the end of the summer.

  11. #31
    Very Active Member Blue Horn's Avatar
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    Hey Ande,

    I did a 300 LCM flutter kick set! I really didn't go that slow either! I am really really stoked right now.

    I am trying to work at a sustained 6 beat kick, but it just isn't there yet. Anything over a hundred (LCM) even at a moderate pace and I am beat. I am getting much more push out of my two beat kick.

    Hook'em
    Blue

  12. #32
    Very Active Member Blue Horn's Avatar
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    Ande,

    Well I got "The Rack". I figured I would give it a try and see if it made a difference in my kick after a month of consistent use. I will keep you updated.

    Hook'em
    Blue

  13. #33
    Very Active Member Blue Horn's Avatar
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    Update

    I hope I am not boring everyone with these updates, but I am very excited about my progress with my kick after implementing som eof Ande's ideas.

    Anyway, I did a 2x800 with 15 seconds rest today at the end of the work out and the one thing I noticed is that my new kick really made the swim much easier. I stuck to a two beat kick, but once I got into a rythm I could really feel the extra umpphhh. I could also tell that it made my pull much easier in that I seemed to get much better leverage on my pull.

    My six beat kick is coming along, but I am still not getting into a good rythm with it yet. It is better though.

    As to the ankle stretching with the rack, it has been about a week and a half and I actually would say that I have seen some difference. My times aren't much different, but I feel like I am grabbing the water better with my feet. I am definitely cruising better.

    Hook'em
    Blue

  14. #34
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    Re: Update

    blue,

    I'd like to see you continue to do the sprint kick training and report your times

    ande

    Originally posted by Blue Horn
    I hope I am not boring everyone with these updates, but I am very excited about my progress with my kick after implementing som eof Ande's ideas.

    Anyway, I did a 2x800 with 15 seconds rest today at the end of the work out and the one thing I noticed is that my new kick really made the swim much easier. I stuck to a two beat kick, but once I got into a rythm I could really feel the extra umpphhh. I could also tell that it made my pull much easier in that I seemed to get much better leverage on my pull.

    My six beat kick is coming along, but I am still not getting into a good rythm with it yet. It is better though.

    As to the ankle stretching with the rack, it has been about a week and a half and I actually would say that I have seen some difference. My times aren't much different, but I feel like I am grabbing the water better with my feet. I am definitely cruising better.

    Hook'em
    Blue

  15. #35
    Very Active Member Blue Horn's Avatar
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    I have been swimming in a 50 meter pool, but I will try to get to the 25 yard pool this weekend. However, a couple of weeks ago (with a training suit on) I was kicking 34s in a 25 meter pool with 15 seconds rest for a set of 5x25. I am not sure how that translates to a 25 yard pool.

    Hook'em
    Blue

  16. #36
    Very Active Member Blue Horn's Avatar
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    Update

    Ande,

    I was a bit tired this morning from a lack of sleep, but did a couple of all out 25s during my kick set. Both were from a push in streamline with a centermount snorkle. I went 23 and 24 seconds. The last time I tested I think I went a 20 and 21 from a dive and 26 from a push!

    Whats really amazing is that I never really thought I would get below 30 seconds for a 25 yard kick.

    I will do a test kick set this weekend when after some rest. I have been running lately so my legs are exhausted.

  17. #37
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    Re: Update

    congratulations
    you're doing great

    keep doing the set at least 3 times a week
    then do a test set once every 2 weeks
    I may be in aransas pass
    friday june 16 - sunday june 18
    maybe I can catch you at a practice in corpus

    keep it up, I believe you'll be kicking 25's under 20 soon

    ande
    512-217-2728 cell
    512-397-1892 day

    Originally posted by Blue Horn
    Ande,

    I was a bit tired this morning from a lack of sleep, but did a couple of all out 25s during my kick set. Both were from a push in streamline with a centermount snorkle. I went 23 and 24 seconds. The last time I tested I think I went a 20 and 21 from a dive and 26 from a push!

    Whats really amazing is that I never really thought I would get below 30 seconds for a 25 yard kick.

    I will do a test kick set this weekend when after some rest. I have been running lately so my legs are exhausted.

  18. #38
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    blue

    when you do your test kicks for time

    Kick your legs as FAST as you can and
    CONCENTRATE on splashing alot

    WHEN YOU DO
    let me know your times

    Ande

  19. #39
    Very Active Member Blue Horn's Avatar
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    I will try to do a test as you suggest this weekend.

    Also, I think I should be here during the time that you are going to be down.

    Hook'em
    Blue

  20. #40
    Very Active Member geochuck's Avatar
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    Why don't we call it the way it is, the kick is the least important part of having a great swim time. Make all the splash you want it won't help if you cannot kick properly. When I was a kid one of the best age group crawl swimmers I knew had one leg that had been removed at the hip.
    Keep it simple George Park
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