How to Train For OW 10K

[Bobinator]

My club is putting on the 10K ow National Championships next summer.
I like ow swimming and think I would like to try the 10K.
I have completed several ow 5K's with no problem at all (I've enjoyed them)
My best time is 1:27 and i'm 54 years old. I swim about 15,000 meters/yards per week.
How much more would I need to swim to complete the 10K?
What type of training should one do to get ready for a 10K
The course is an easy double loop in a lake that tends to be non-wavy.
Any advice would be appreciated. If you think it would be a bad idea for me to do it please say so.
My biggest fear is shoulder injury and burn-out!

[tjrpatt]

I remember reading on the USMS Features about Heidi George who competed in the USA Swimming Open Water Champs, 5K or 10K this summer. I think that she said that she did alot of 800s in Long Course. Since lovely Central Indiana has alot of LCM pools, this would be a problem to do. But, if you do a set of 1000 or 800 in the short course form, you should be fine.

I know nothing about training for OW solely but My guess that you if you do a good month of training 20K a week, you should be fine. Heck, maybe have one of your many workout total 5 to 6K and you should have the endurance you need for this race. Also, maybe PM chaos since he is more of an OW guru.

[chaos]

the 10k. over the past decade i've learned that i can race for 2 hours without feeding (that includes water)... anything longer than that and its bonk city. this means that if i think i will be swimming for more than 2 hours i need to have a feeding plan that will start somewhere between 30 and 60 minutes into the swim.
as the 10k will be held in a lake, and conditions will be fairly predictable, it should be easy for you to predict your time if you know what kind of pace you can maintain.
personally, i like big yardage weeks, but i know some swimmers that have completed marathon swims (>20 miles) on 15k/week, so its really a question of finding a pace that you can sustain for that distance.

my tips:
- do a 3 hour pool swim, feeding no more than every 30 minutes.
- feed mid pool on your back... keep it brief. take an end lane and have someone hand you a cup or bottle... gulp... keep swimming.
- have a friend kayak for you. practice with this person so that they know where you like them to be and you won't need to sight the course.
- go over your feed plan with your kayaker... let them keep track of the time and your feed intervals.
- have fun!

[E=H2O]

I think it is a great idea and very doable for you. It sounds like you can swim a strong 5K so you should be able to make the transition to 10K. The biggest difference would be the need for water and calories during the swim. Water temperature can also be an issue. Water temperature which is comfortable for a 1500 may be down right cold for a 10K.

This past year I swam a 4K OW lake swim in 54 minutes. 4 weeks later I swam a 5K OW ocean swim where the course was parallel to the shore. Given the surface conditions I anticipated finishing in about 1:15 but there was a very strong current on the return leg. I was in a small chase group fighting stroke for stroke the entire leg back. It felt like it went on forever. While I had done a warmup before the swim, I had not ventured out past the protective jetties so I was not aware how strong the current was. I finished in 1:54. This was the longest time I had ever raced in OW and while I was tried and a bit cold from the 61 degree water I never felt that I was physically in over my head. I'm sure one or both courses may have not been accurately measured, but I offer this for comparison purposes.

[Ken Classen]

Can you swim a 10K on 15,000 yards a week? Based on your 5K time, yes. I've known a few swimmers who have, but don't do it. On 15,000 per week it will feel good to about that 5K mark but then you will start asking yourself how much further? the tempo will go away, when you feed you will start to linger, telling yourself just one more minute here hanging out and I will feel better. The freestyle starts getting broken up with breaststroke and backstroke just trying to relieve those arms. And as E=H2O stated, what seemed like a decent water temperature at the start, feels chillier and chillier and finally your mind might start playing tricks on you.

The more you train, the longer you will feel comfortable in the 10K. Training for a 10K is one area where the so called garbage yards are good. I believe the race is in mid July, think about creating a plan by working backwards. Personally I like to have two to three weeks prior to the a race working about 30K per week then tapering off about 8-days out. So as not to wreak your shoulders have a plan that that takes you from the current 15K to the 30K plateau, where you add about 1K per week (3 to 4 months) A mix of standard masters pool practices and hopefully some long and regular openwater sessions. If your pool and team allow, think about doing a standard masters practice then when everyone else is getting out, swim a straight a 1000, 1500 etc. It doesn't have to be fast, your just trying to get your body used to going the distance. Finally you need to ask yourself are you swimming to complete it or racing it? If swimming to race, then long strong interval sets become important, 10 x 200's, 8 x 400 etc., concentration on tempo and maintaining pace a bit less of the long slow distance (LSD).

[Bobinator]

Thanks for the wonderful advice. The comments are getting me fired up and in the mood to train a bit more!
I am going to ponder over some of this advice, devise some sort of plan, then most likely be back on this thread asking more questions.
The water will most likely be around 80 degrees. It is much more likely to be too warm than cold. I am thinking I can finish anywhere from 3 hours to 3:10. I am very steady although I've never gone longer than 1:35 in my life so maybe I will be surprised. I'm going to think positive though and assume i'll be fairly steady.

[Chicken of the Sea]

Bob, you can do a 10k with your hands tied behind your back!!!
What's the date? I'd love to come!
I'll be looking on this thread for advice too cos one of these days I'd like to really improve my time.

[Lump]

I did two 5K's and a 4.5 mile OW swim last summer and plan on bumping up and doing some 10K and more this summer and fall once SCY season is over. I probably won't swim any more/farther than I am now which is 15K-25K a week. To me, its more about what you actually doing while you are in the pool, not how far you are going. I could get in a float 7500 4-5 times a week but its boring and pointless. Get in and mix it up....distance, quality, IM, kick, pull...it all helps. If you can run/jog/walk, any cardio, outside the pool that will certainly help with endurance.

I was a distance guy in HS and college, my days of 10K-15K a workout, 10-12 practices a week, 100K yards/wk, etc......OVER. I swim now to enjoy it and just for the health benefit. Like everyone, I want to do well and place well, but I want to enjoy it this time around and not suffer burnout.

[srcoyote]

I'm planning on doing my first 10K in May. I'm glad to read all of these perspectives on training. In prep for the 5K's I've done, I typically average about 18K per week peaking at about 21K. I plan to hold a similar training schedule. I think my first goal, though, is to get over that mental hump and get in a 6 to 7K straight swim (will have to be in a pool) sometime before May.

My biggest challenge will be finding a feeding strategy. Apparently the swim I'm doing plans to have feeding stations (boats) in the course. I haven't yet found one of the one market substances that doesn't make my bp go up and leave me nauseous and weak. A little bagel and gatorade works best, but I won't have a kayaker to carry what I like.

[Chicken of the Sea]

Originally Posted by srcoyote

I'm planning on doing my first 10K in May. I'm glad to read all of these perspectives on training. In prep for the 5K's I've done, I typically average about 18K per week peaking at about 21K. I plan to hold a similar training schedule. I think my first goal, though, is to get over that mental hump and get in a 6 to 7K straight swim (will have to be in a pool) sometime before May.

My biggest challenge will be finding a feeding strategy. Apparently the swim I'm doing plans to have feeding stations (boats) in the course. I haven't yet found one of the one market substances that doesn't make my bp go up and leave me nauseous and weak. A little bagel and gatorade works best, but I won't have a kayaker to carry what I like.

What 10k are you doing? Can you arrange to have gatorade on one of the boats, if that's not what they serve? Are you ok with Gu? A couple of gu's up my suit works fine for me

[Leonard Jansen]

My $0.02, for what little it's worth...

Since you can do 5k, you CAN do 10k. However...
1) Dave's comments about feeding are spot on. 2 hours is about the limit for anyone. You CAN finish a 10k without feeding - been there, done that - but it is miserable.
2) Get familiar with doing some longer swims at race EFFORT, not pace. You are trying to figure out the effort you can sustain since pace varies so much in the pool to OW transition.
3) Assuming that you aren't trying to set any world records, there are 4 physiological abilities that you will need to consider as part of your training plan:
a) The ability to go from a stop up to race speed at the beginning of the race.
b) The ability to maintain a decent pace for a long time in the middle of the race.
c) The ability to increase your effort for relatively brief periods of time in the middle of the race to overcome conditions or competitors.
d) The ability to finish strongly at the end of the race.

It's b & c that you will be most interested in since that is where you will be spending most of your race. Since exercise/stress adaptation is fairly specific, a reasonable training program will include the type of things that help train those abilities. IMHO, longer paced swims (per Dave above and any number of variations), longer intervals (or shorter intervals with less rest) and the like are good for b. For c, I like doing longer swims where I throw in bursts every once in awhile. For example, 1 hour, sprinting 50-100 yards on every 5 minute mark. Or 2 hours, sprinting 200-300 on every 10 minute mark. Another trick I've used is to get to the pool about 30-60 minutes before master's practice, fill that time with a fairly hard continuous per one of the above and then do the master's workout, too.

Rotator cuff injury prevention lifting is good, as is core strength exercises.

Work your technique relentlessly - I always suggest watching the FIRST "Karate Kid" movie for this - the part where the old man has the kid paint his fence, wax his car and sand the floor is pretty much all you need to know about practicing technique and why.

Plan ahead and BUILD towards the race. There are no awards for being in the best shape of your life in February only to be injured/sick/burhed-out by summer.

I would guess that a 1:27 5k ability, with proper training and some feeding support during the race will get you in the 3:00 - 3:10 range; perhaps better.

You CAN do it! Don't let the pool ballerinas tell you otherwise.

-LBJ

[Munatones]

Besides the recommendations from other members, if I were you, I would try to swim at least 7K in a practice swim in the venue 2-3 weeks ahead of time. You should also be practicing feeding (i.e., hydration or fueling) during your workouts, if you are not already doing so. Nearly all the experienced elite swimmers stick 2-4 gel packs in their swimsuits in a 10K, so if they miss a feeding, they can always take a gel pack at their convenience. Most people would not do a 2-3 hour run without drinking something, so swimmers should not do a 2-3 hour swim without refueling. Good luck.

[srcoyote]

Originally Posted by Chicken of the Sea

What 10k are you doing? Can you arrange to have gatorade on one of the boats, if that's not what they serve? Are you ok with Gu? A couple of gu's up my suit works fine for me

My hope is to place some gatorade on the boat. Unfortunatley, Gu was one of my failed experiements. Anyone else have the elevated bp, nausea, and weakened legs after one of these?

The one I will be attempting is the double-crossing of Pensacola Bay. So while my best 5K time is 1:18, I did it in calm lake water and not choppy bay water. I will count a finish in the 3 hour range a success. Could be interesting.

I used to only swim distances at cruise pace. I've begun to mix occasional sprints in and some entire workouts which are IM or sprint based. I've seen my cruising pace quicken as a result. Cut off a full 5 seconds per hundred so far. I usually never have difficulty finishing strong. Once I get within 800 yards of finishing, the mental aspect takes over and I tend to swim really hard just to finish whether I like to or not. My barriers are always around 1/3 to 2/3 mark. That second third of any long swim is a mental killer for me.

Unfortunatley, due to limited budget and schedule, all of my training will be in a 25y pool for this one. I might get in a warm up swim in Pensacola Bay the day before to acclimate to choppy conditions, but that will be it.

[Chicken of the Sea]

Never had that with Gu, luckily.
If you can maybe get your own drink bottles on the boat, maybe try perpetuum instead of gatorade (or as well as)? one or two drinks of that would do for a 10k. I switched to it this year and it doesn't taste great but it seems to work. Probably won't work if you have to carry all your own stuff, although I know a couple of people who mix it into a very strong paste which you could possibly carry on yourself.